2020 Wide Receivers

[bobblehead]

If he quits the drops he is a game changer. How often does a receiver find there hands in year4?

He had them in the playoff game. That was the best version of him. He needed a lot more work than Jennings did coming out. Better? Well, you guys are trying to compare the best version of Jennings to the work in progress MVS. Jennings had only 3 1,000 yard seasons in the NFL and was never dominant. I think MVS may get to Jennings level yet. He also may never have reliable enough hands to crack 1k yards. They might have also reached the point where they are going to bring in a more consistent #2 and his chances are finished.

But this is why I love the internet. The idea that its not even feasible that MVS could have a 10 year career with 8200 yards is just as ridiculous as claiming he is a lock to turn into Jennings. I put it at 30/70 that by the end of next season he is right there with Jennings. I think he had 3 drops worth about 200 yards last year. If he makes hands hands hands the focal point of this offseason he could easily have a 1000 yard season.

Watch the playoff game again. Watch it with an open mind. He looked like the best WR on the field to me. That isn't to suggest he doesn't benefit from Adams pulling coverage, but thats how the game works when building a team. MVS stretches the safety or Adams draws him in. Rodgers decides which way to go with the ball.

[RashanGary]

He had them in the playoff game. That was the best version of him. He needed a lot more work than Jennings did coming out. Better? Well, you guys are trying to compare the best version of Jennings to the work in progress MVS. Jennings had only 3 1,000 yard seasons in the NFL and was never dominant. I think MVS may get to Jennings level yet. He also may never have reliable enough hands to crack 1k yards. They might have also reached the point where they are going to bring in a more consistent #2 and his chances are finished.

But this is why I love the internet. The idea that its not even feasible that MVS could have a 10 year career with 8200 yards is just as ridiculous as claiming he is a lock to turn into Jennings. I put it at 30/70 that by the end of next season he is right there with Jennings. I think he had 3 drops worth about 200 yards last year. If he makes hands hands hands the focal point of this offseason he could easily have a 1000 yard season.

Watch the playoff game again. Watch it with an open mind. He looked like the best WR on the field to me. That isn't to suggest he doesn't benefit from Adams pulling coverage, but thats how the game works when building a team. MVS stretches the safety or Adams draws him in. Rodgers decides which way to go with the ball.

Pretty much true here. And we’ve seen guys figure out the drops. Only problem with MVS is sometimes he likes to body catch. Well, that’s the second problem with the first being he hand drops quite a few. But regardless, he progressed for three straight years. He’s in his fourth year now with Rodgers and they’re building chemistry. I think it would be cool to re sign him because A) it should be relatively cheap and B) Rodgers does so much better with long term teammates than new guys. MVS could be Rodgers deep guy for the twilight of his career. He could easily finish as a James Jones level weapon for Rodgers. A long term, productive guy with a couple holes in his game.

[RashanGary]

It Gute gets some fair deals done with MVS, Tonyan and Lazard, while none are super stars (except maybe Tonyan), Rodgers would have a bunch of decent guys he has chemistry with down the final stretch of his career.

[RashanGary]

I could see a long term situation where gute drafts a stud wr this year and then gets Tonyan, Lizard abd MVS for the price of Adams and they move on from Adams. Sadly.

[sharpe1027]

He had them in the playoff game. That was the best version of him. He needed a lot more work than Jennings did coming out. Better? Well, you guys are trying to compare the best version of Jennings to the work in progress MVS. Jennings had only 3 1,000 yard seasons in the NFL and was never dominant. I think MVS may get to Jennings level yet. He also may never have reliable enough hands to crack 1k yards. They might have also reached the point where they are going to bring in a more consistent #2 and his chances are finished.

But this is why I love the internet. The idea that its not even feasible that MVS could have a 10 year career with 8200 yards is just as ridiculous as claiming he is a lock to turn into Jennings. I put it at 30/70 that by the end of next season he is right there with Jennings. I think he had 3 drops worth about 200 yards last year. If he makes hands hands hands the focal point of this offseason he could easily have a 1000 yard season.

Watch the playoff game again. Watch it with an open mind. He looked like the best WR on the field to me. That isn't to suggest he doesn't benefit from Adams pulling coverage, but thats how the game works when building a team. MVS stretches the safety or Adams draws him in. Rodgers decides which way to go with the ball.

The list of players that looked great for one game is as long as it is disappointing. Sure, he might end up being the best WR to ever play the game. In my opinion, he doesn't get to the top echelon unless he improves hands and route running. If not, he can still be extremely valuable to the offense with his deep threat.

[Joemailman]

I could see a long term situation where gute drafts a stud wr this year and then gets Tonyan, Lizard abd MVS for the price of Adams and they move on from Adams. Sadly.

Not sure what you mean by long term. I think the Packers give Adams an extension to provide some cap room now, and draft a WR. Then next year, they'll decide to to keep out of MVS, St. Brown, Lazard and Funchess.

[Upnorth]

We need a 3 yr extension of adams imo and draft a new stud as well. Mvs needs an extension as well.

[texaspackerbacker]

Of course they'll extend Adams for at least three years, both because he's so great and because it helps the cap situation.

Valdez-Scantling does NOT need to have 8,200 yards in 10 years or whatever to be as good or as valuable as Jennings was. MVS is a #3 or at best a #2 playing behind Davante Adams. He's a change of pace who would not be expected to get nearly as many catches. Obviously the detractors in here haven't said anything about yards per catch, which arguably is more important for somebody in his situation. Jennings was the primary target - similar to Adams now. In addition, the Packers probably have more capability to run and do run more now. I don't remember who the RBs with Jennings were - if he goes all the way back to Dorsey Levens or Ahman Green, I don't think so. Regardless, they were not as good as Aaron Jones plus Dillon and/or Jamal Williams.

[run pMc]

Recency bias.
Driver > Jennings > MVS.
The year Jennings was drafted was after Terrence Murphy left the NFL on a stretcher and Javon Walker tore his ACL, leaving Favre with nobody but Donald Driver and the likes of Robert Turd Ferguson, Antonio Chatmna, and the ghost of Rod Gardner to throw to. That was a 4-12 season. Jennings came in and fans were hoping against hope that the kid would show something in camp and be able to start early in the year. He did, and built on that the following year, and by the end of his third season (Rodgers' first as a starter) had leapfrogged Driver as WR1.

Jennings after year 2 was better than MVS after his year 3, and if you think MVS is going to be your WR1 you are huffing chemicals or a candidate to be the next JAX GM.

MVS has warts that I think he will be challenged to remedy: tracking the ball, hands, route running, consistency. I think he can and will improve on those, but if you think he's going to get 6000 career yards then I'll take that bet. He turns 27 in October, I'd bet he has 4 seasons of speed left. Let's assume he has 5 more seasons in the pros -- he'll need to average over 800 yards to hit 6000, and he's never done that yet.

Look, I like the guy -- he's talented, works hard, and cares about it.
Despite his warts he does some things very well that are valuable to an offense -- deep routes, run blocking, and he's shown some ability in the intermediate routes. I don't think he's more than your #3 option on most plays. Schematically MLF does some good things with him, and he's a useful piece in their offense.

Ahman Green was a beast. Jones needs more seasons to make it a debate, but Ahman > Aaron Jones and at this time it's not that close. Aaron Jones vs. Levens is an interesting one...I'd give the edge to Jones there.

They absolutely need to extend Adams. He still has prime years left and it would help the cap. They also need to plan ahead and draft and develop another quality WR to eventually succeed him.

[Upnorth]

Recency bias.
Driver > Jennings > MVS.
The year Jennings was drafted was after Terrence Murphy left the NFL on a stretcher and Javon Walker tore his ACL, leaving Favre with nobody but Donald Driver and the likes of Robert Turd Ferguson, Antonio Chatmna, and the ghost of Rod Gardner to throw to. That was a 4-12 season. Jennings came in and fans were hoping against hope that the kid would show something in camp and be able to start early in the year. He did, and built on that the following year, and by the end of his third season (Rodgers' first as a starter) had leapfrogged Driver as WR1.

Jennings after year 2 was better than MVS after his year 3, and if you think MVS is going to be your WR1 you are huffing chemicals or a candidate to be the next JAX GM.

MVS has warts that I think he will be challenged to remedy: tracking the ball, hands, route running, consistency. I think he can and will improve on those, but if you think he's going to get 6000 career yards then I'll take that bet. He turns 27 in October, I'd bet he has 4 seasons of speed left. Let's assume he has 5 more seasons in the pros -- he'll need to average over 800 yards to hit 6000, and he's never done that yet.

Look, I like the guy -- he's talented, works hard, and cares about it.
Despite his warts he does some things very well that are valuable to an offense -- deep routes, run blocking, and he's shown some ability in the intermediate routes. I don't think he's more than your #3 option on most plays. Schematically MLF does some good things with him, and he's a useful piece in their offense.

Ahman Green was a beast. Jones needs more seasons to make it a debate, but Ahman > Aaron Jones and at this time it's not that close. Aaron Jones vs. Levens is an interesting one...I'd give the edge to Jones there.

They absolutely need to extend Adams. He still has prime years left and it would help the cap. They also need to plan ahead and draft and develop another quality WR to eventually succeed him.

I agree with basically this whole post except maybe the driver better than Jennings.
I agree 100% with green being better than jones. Green was a unique talent and i think the beast packer rb I have seen play.

[sharpe1027]

Of course they'll extend Adams for at least three years, both because he's so great and because it helps the cap situation.

Valdez-Scantling does NOT need to have 8,200 yards in 10 years or whatever to be as good or as valuable as Jennings was. MVS is a #3 or at best a #2 playing behind Davante Adams. He's a change of pace who would not be expected to get nearly as many catches. Obviously the detractors in here haven't said anything about yards per catch, which arguably is more important for somebody in his situation. Jennings was the primary target - similar to Adams now. In addition, the Packers probably have more capability to run and do run more now. I don't remember who the RBs with Jennings were - if he goes all the way back to Dorsey Levens or Ahman Green, I don't think so. Regardless, they were not as good as Aaron Jones plus Dillon and/or Jamal Williams.

What's your creteria for one wr being better than another? If they played in a better team they are a better WR?.

MVS is currently a limited WR that can play an important role on the team, but he's not a #1 on most teams, if any. To say he's better than some of the best #1s is an odd position to be taking.

Is AJ Dillion a better back than Dorsey Levens because he fills an important role on this team and he's bigger and stronger than Dorsey?

[texaspackerbacker]

What's your creteria for one wr being better than another? If they played in a better team they are a better WR?.

MVS is currently a limited WR that can play an important role on the team, but he's not a #1 on most teams, if any. To say he's better than some of the best #1s is an odd position to be taking.

Is AJ Dillion a better back than Dorsey Levens because he fills an important role on this team and he's bigger and stronger than Dorsey?

Fair questions.

Overall ability and value to the team would be my criteria. It's a helluva lot easier to find small not very fast possession receivers than to find big receivers with game-breaking speed. Of course, they need to not have a lot of drops, Just because a guy isn't the #1 WR doesn't change that.

Whether Dillon ends up better than Levens depends on a lot of things - health, attitude, the way he is used. Neither of them is my ideal kind of RB. Give me a Aaron Jones or Ahman Green type RB any day.

[sharpe1027]

Fair questions.

Overall ability and value to the team would be my criteria. It's a helluva lot easier to find small not very fast possession receivers than to find big receivers with game-breaking speed. Of course, they need to not have a lot of drops, Just because a guy isn't the #1 WR doesn't change that.

Whether Dillon ends up better than Levens depends on a lot of things - health, attitude, the way he is used. Neither of them is my ideal kind of RB. Give me a Aaron Jones or Ahman Green type RB any day.

Interesting take. So Jerry Rice probably doesn't make your top 10 best WRs? He was 6'2" and only ran a 4.6.

Give me a Jennings caliber wr over a workout wonder any day of the week.

[Upnorth]

If mvs gets over the drops he is a straight up game changer. If. That's the problem. He hasnt yet. I hope he does but until then you can't compare Jennings to mvs. Jennings had to be planned for on every snap by the d. Mvs doesnt.

Also while jones is good he is replaceable. Green was the center of the o for a few years when we had Favre. Can't say that about jones even in 2019.

[bobblehead]

The list of players that looked great for one game is as long as it is disappointing. Sure, he might end up being the best WR to ever play the game. In my opinion, he doesn't get to the top echelon unless he improves hands and route running. If not, he can still be extremely valuable to the offense with his deep threat.

Agree 100% that I don't think he reaches the top echelon....almost positive he won't. However, Jennings never did either. My guess is that MVS improves a tad more. Puts a 1k season in at some point, but primarily takes tops off the D and is more Billy Schroeder than Jennings. Also think the Jennings comp is humorous because the 2 are POLAR opposites.

He had 3 games last year where I thought he looked incredible. One happened to be the NFCC game. Again, its unlikely he emerges as elite, but I could see next season be something like 75 grabs for 1000 yards. That is a quality #2 in this league. I'm also realistic as I put that at 30/70 in my previous post.

[run pMc]

The Billy Schroeder comp feels more legit than Jennings.