Good Job Thompson....It Only Took 4 Years.

[pbmax]

Re: Good Job Thompson....It Only Took 4 Years.

You are just going to keep us on the edge of the couch? Cough up the speculation RG, don't hold it in.

McGinn has already stated that the Football Braintrust decided Favre was not going to win another championship and it was time, with two years left, to give AROG a test drive.

What is your theory?

And for the Life of Brian, why was it skullduggery or shameful for Thompson to give Sherman an extension rather than let him coach as a lame duck? T2 removed the lame duck specualtion and then made a decision. And M2 got paid well. How was this at all questionable?

I am there with you Cheez. I understand why Thompson got rid of Favre, he had worn us all out with the "will he won't he" crap, and barring a multi year commitment this was understandable.

However, I also think it did validate that there is more to Ted Thompson than meets the eye. There are some things going on that I have never approved of... Some would say, "if that's the price of winning", and I would disagree.

Time will tell who Ted is, and I'll be watching. If it happens as I expect it will, I'll be getting my popcorn and watching who will mea-culpa and who won't.

In the meantime, I'll watch the Packers and hope the team I love continues as it has the past 16 years. But, this year, I think I'll also watch the J-E-T-S. If they get to the Super Bowl against my beloved Packers then I'll really enjoy the game, if they don't maybe I'll get to see that "Favre magic" a couple more times before it's gone forever.

[pbmax]

Re: Good Job Thompson....It Only Took 4 Years.

Same question to you Cheese.

And for the Life of Brian, why was it skullduggery or shameful for Thompson to give Sherman an extension rather than let him coach as a lame duck? T2 removed the lame duck specualtion and then made a decision on more than a year of observation. And M2 got paid well. How was this at all questionable?

And what lies, exactly, did Thompson tell the public about Favre?

... Telling lies to the press about players I couldn't live with myself.

This treatment of Brett Favre has shaken my fanhood a great deal. Not since the 1982 strike have I felt as apathetic about the upcoming NFL season.

I disliked Ted when he gave Sherman a contract extension and then fired the whole coaching staff and dismantled the team. His draft picks and rebuilding the team made me hopeful. Now I just don't know...

I hate what this has done to me.

[Fritz]

Hey, I liked Tennessee Ernie Ford. Made great sausage commercials back in the day.

As for the Jets' o-line being better...Damien Woody was overweight and undermotivated the whole time he was in Detroit, until the last half of the last year, when he realized he was playing for a contract. Then he suddenly became interested. I believe this is why New England let him go in the first place.

Now he's got a big, new contract. I wonder how he'll play?

'

Overweight? How can you tell...he is a lineman. When he was injured he did balloon up..but, he lost that weight by going to the duke program..hardly someone who is unmotivated..and playing at 335.

Undermotivated? again, how can you tell. I say the opposite..he lost his starting position at guard, was inactive for a couple of games and worked his way into the starting lineup at RT. That hardly sounds like someone is unmotivated.

The facts are this..he started for two Superbowl winning teams. He started 76 games with the Pats and was considered the anchor of the line.

He was a pro bowler in 02 and alternate in 04. He started every game 04 and 05 before and injury sidelined him in 06.

He is versatile and has played every position on the line cept for LT.

At worst he is an above average lineman.

We just don't agree here, Tyrone. Woody came to Detroit and proceeded to play and gain weight. He did not play well the year before last, and last year he got played so poorly he was benched - benched for the Detroit Lions? That's pretty bad. Yes, he worked his way back in, but my point it that this only seems to happen when Woody has a contract coming up. And since that's not the case now, having been rewarded, I see him once more settling into the familiar pattern.

I don't think he's all that. But I still love you and respect you, you crazy crackhead.

[retailguy]

Re: Good Job Thompson....It Only Took 4 Years.

You are just going to keep us on the edge of the couch? Cough up the speculation RG, don't hold it in.

McGinn has already stated that the Football Braintrust decided Favre was not going to win another championship and it was time, with two years left, to give AROG a test drive.

What is your theory?

And for the Life of Brian, why was it skullduggery or shameful for Thompson to give Sherman an extension rather than let him coach as a lame duck? T2 removed the lame duck specualtion and then made a decision. And M2 got paid well. How was this at all questionable?

PB - I'm already on the record for saying where there is smoke, there is fire. Favre was an idiot in the way he handled this situation. He's clearly established himself as a DIVA, however, those things don't make the things he said against Thompson untrue. Those things could have happened, just the way Brett says they did.

You can claim, with some reasonableness that Favre shouldn't have "butted in" to the GM side of the business, but you can also make a claim that Thompson should have just had the balls to say "butt out", but he didn't either.

We don't know what happened. We don't know the full story. I think there is more here than meets the eye. I interpret that to mean that Ted Thompson is not who he makes himself out to be.

As to Sherman, who cares if he coached as a lame duck? Others have, and will continue to do so. Thompson thought it best to not do that, then he decided he couldn't work with Sherman. It happens, but it doesn't prove what you imply. He wasn't doing Sherman any favors, nor was he endorsing him and his experience.

I'm not sure how this point, which you've repeated twice backs up anything you appear to be claiming.

I don't like Ted Thompson, never have, probably never will. But, I have acknowledged on numerous occasions that results matter. I even wrote an entire mea culpa about it. Ted gets credit for 13-3, and he'll also get some of the blame if he can't maintain similar results, and can't win a superbowl. In the end, this killed Sherman, and it should kill Thompson as well if he fails. Fair is fair, right?

In the end, I'm confident that who Ted really is will be displayed for all to see. I'm unconvinced that most of us will like it, when it is revealed, in the end.

As I said, time will tell.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Hey, I liked Tennessee Ernie Ford. Made great sausage commercials back in the day.

As for the Jets' o-line being better...Damien Woody was overweight and undermotivated the whole time he was in Detroit, until the last half of the last year, when he realized he was playing for a contract. Then he suddenly became interested. I believe this is why New England let him go in the first place.

Now he's got a big, new contract. I wonder how he'll play?

'

Overweight? How can you tell...he is a lineman. When he was injured he did balloon up..but, he lost that weight by going to the duke program..hardly someone who is unmotivated..and playing at 335.

Undermotivated? again, how can you tell. I say the opposite..he lost his starting position at guard, was inactive for a couple of games and worked his way into the starting lineup at RT. That hardly sounds like someone is unmotivated.

The facts are this..he started for two Superbowl winning teams. He started 76 games with the Pats and was considered the anchor of the line.

He was a pro bowler in 02 and alternate in 04. He started every game 04 and 05 before and injury sidelined him in 06.

He is versatile and has played every position on the line cept for LT.

At worst he is an above average lineman.

We just don't agree here, Tyrone. Woody came to Detroit and proceeded to play and gain weight. He did not play well the year before last, and last year he got played so poorly he was benched - benched for the Detroit Lions? That's pretty bad. Yes, he worked his way back in, but my point it that this only seems to happen when Woody has a contract coming up. And since that's not the case now, having been rewarded, I see him once more settling into the familiar pattern.

I don't think he's all that. But I still love you and respect you, you crazy crackhead.

That isn't accurate..unless you can show some proof. He came and started for two years. That is 04 and 05. 06 he was out the whole year. Your time line isn't right.

What happened next is that they got a new coach...a tough guy..and woody went out with a foot injury. Now, he did gain weight..but, it is a fact that he went to the duke weight center and lost 40 pounds.

The big issue in detroit was of course could marinelli trust him...did he lose the weight so as to get his 4.5 salary or was he really committed.

Benched: No doubt...but, so what. He was coming back from an injury. You never saw any stories about him sulking, whining, demanding to be traded...he changed positions and got back in the lineup.

Remember, different coaches value diff types of lineman. If marinelli came to us...i guarantee many of our lineman would be benched, traded or cut.

Contract: He was great in NE. 76 games is quite a number for a lineman.

Love: Right back at you.

[Patler]

Re: Good Job Thompson....It Only Took 4 Years.

We don't know what happened. We don't know the full story. I think there is more here than meets the eye. I interpret that to mean that Ted Thompson is not who he makes himself out to be.

As to Sherman, who cares if he coached as a lame duck? Others have, and will continue to do so. Thompson thought it best to not do that, then he decided he couldn't work with Sherman. It happens, but it doesn't prove what you imply. He wasn't doing Sherman any favors, nor was he endorsing him and his experience.
...

In the end, I'm confident that who Ted really is will be displayed for all to see. I'm unconvinced that most of us will like it, when it is revealed, in the end.

To be honest, we also don't know who Favre really is either. We see only part of what he is. Over the last few years there have been indications, suggestions, insinuations that there is another aspect of him that has been camouflaged by the dominating persona displayed on the field and promoted by the media. Bill Michaels (WTMJ) said last week that the Brett Favre ass-kissing by almost everyone in the organization down to clubouse personnel had reached extraordinary levels. It might not even be that Favre demanded it, it just may be something that built over time. I suspect the trade will end a lot of that for him, if it did in fact exist. But it is hard to deny that he seemed to expect certain freedoms or deference that others don't have, and that he criticized others for wanting.

You may be right about TT, I don't know. But I have seen nothing from so called insiders that he is difficult, overbearing or anything other than a good guy to work with. After three years there were lots of indications that Sherman was anything but that as a GM. TT seems to be well-liked by those he works for and those who work for him. I suspect he is demanding, most top executives are. He clearly has a vision or plan that some will agree with and others will not. I'm sure he will follow his plan, not someone elses.

If reports are to be believed it seems to be that Sherman had more of a problem working for TT than TT had with Sherman. A demotion rarely works well in any organization and usually results in a departure. The contract extension seemed to be a gesture from TT that he was willing to try to make it work. It has been reported that Sherman just could accept a diminished role in the organization.

I don't really think there is anything sinister about TT, Murphy, Sherman, McCarthy or Favre. When leadership changes, some get on board with the change, some do not. Some work well with the new leadership, some do not. It always takes a few years to put all the combinations together. Hopefully they get there and can keep it together for a long time.

[pbmax]

RG, I would just point out two things:

One, Thompson could have told Favre to butt out. Or he could have gone with the more polite, "I'll think about it" or "We'll kick that around". If you have a boss and you make a suggestion that is outside your expertise, then reasonable people would know those answers mean, thanks, but stop wasting my time. It need not be sinister that Favre left with one impression and Thompson another. I agree that the responsibility rests with Thompson to make sure he is understood. But it serves him poorly if he outright lies to the QB about a friend of his. Thompson may have faults, but I feel its unlikely he's flat out dumb.

Two, many coaches have suffered in lame duck years. Clearly, lame duck coaches are likely those coaches who have already had mixed performances (hence no extension). But the speculation surrounding the contract and the future is simply a distraction. Removing that speculation was expensive but it improved the working environment for Sherman.

Most coaches do not thrive as Tom Coughlin did under these circumstances. Even Bill Cowher's Steeler team struggled. And it was clear that Coughlin made a major adjustment to reach his team. Sherman seemed unwilling to make a similar adjustment for a new boss.

[retailguy]

RG, I would just point out two things:

One, Thompson could have told Favre to butt out. Or he could have gone with the more polite, "I'll think about it" or "We'll kick that around". If you have a boss and you make a suggestion that is outside your expertise, then reasonable people would know those answers mean, thanks, but stop wasting my time. It need not be sinister that Favre left with one impression and Thompson another. I agree that the responsibility rests with Thompson to make sure he is understood. But it serves him poorly if he outright lies to the QB about a friend of his. Thompson may have faults, but I feel its unlikely he's flat out dumb.

Two, many coaches have suffered in lame duck years. Clearly, lame duck coaches are likely those coaches who have already had mixed performances (hence no extension). But the speculation surrounding the contract and the future is simply a distraction. Removing that speculation was expensive but it improved the working environment for Sherman.

Most coaches do not thrive as Tom Coughlin did under these circumstances. Even Bill Cowher's Steeler team struggled. And it was clear that Coughlin made a major adjustment to reach his team. Sherman seemed unwilling to make a similar adjustment for a new boss.

Well, I'm unsure that Brett would have reacted to "I'll think about it" the way he did. That's my point. There are other incidents that have occurred over the course of the time Ted has been here that make me think there is a pattern. Maybe I'm just a conspiracy theorist, as I said, time will tell.

Yes, others don't thrive as a "lame duck", but again, what does that prove? Perhaps, he was trying to make things easier for Sherman, but we'll never really know that, will we? In fact, we'll never know much of anything because he'll never answer those questions. And we don't even know WHY that is.

There are others who have complained about Ted as well, and they've to this point also been labeled malcontents too, but eventually those things start to wane, eventually those criticisms of Sherman stuck too.

My personal opinion is that Ted is so committed to winning "his way" he won't even acknowledge there are other ways to win in the NFL. If he's successful, great, but if he isn't, then won't we be left wondering what "might have been", and then being more willing to listen to the criticisms?

As I said, time will tell. To boil it down to one sentence, I see things that cause me to question Ted's ethics. People with questionable ethics can be great GM's, and we'll see if he makes it. Right now, today, he's assembled a lot of talent and we'll see if he & McCarthy can mold that talent behind someone other than Favre.

[PackerBlues]

What you are saying makes sense retailguy, and even though my posts are a bit over dramatic, or one sided.........there is no denying that Thompson is building a strong team. It is not full of Pro-bowlers or anything, but it looks like it can be a very good Packer team. Almost a team of "Kampmans", which can be a good thing with any luck.

As for what I think of Thompson as a person..........

If you were hired to fix a team that was chock-full of veteran talent, and headed towards salary cap hell................how would you do it?

1)cut or let go as many high salary players as you can? (Wahle, Flannigan, Rivera, Longwell, Sharper................)

2)Stop signing other teams free agents, and try to improve through the draft.

3)hold on to your "Big Name" franchise players until you think you have all the other pieces in place.........just to keep the fans happy.

Sounds a lot like "REBUILDING" to me, and thats fine, if you are a fan of the team and you do not mind waiting a few years for your team to be competitive again.

But, if you happen to be a HOF QB, who signed a lifetime contract with that same team during a time that the team was commited to "WINNING NOW".....................

How does that sit? Especially when the GM keeps saying "we are not rebuilding." If that same GM will lie about that to placate the fans and his HOF QB, do you think it is also possible then that he might lead his HOF QB on a little more, by entertaining discussions with him about who the new head coach should be? About picking up a FA such as Moss? Why not? Having Favre's face around during the rebuiliding phase kept money coming in, and kept seats filled.

It all made sense from a business stand point, but I don't root for business's, I root for the Packers, and the players.

[mraynrand]

I wouldn't have said 'we're rebuilding' either. One down year, one average year, and then in the third year a shot to win it all. Rebuilding is cliche and no longer has the same meaning it used to. Rebuilding now can happen overnight. Some teams rely on a mix of draft and FA like NE, and TT wants mostly draft, so he's gonna take longer. Plus, who cares about Favre's lifetime contract? - it doesn't guarantee a championship - and neither does a so-called 'win now' strategy. Just ask Shermy. Favre could have easily said on March 6th "I feel great about this team. We just keep getting better. I'm committed to getting better this offseason and steamrolling the NFL next year." The 2007 Packers were a lot like the 1995 version and the 2008 version could have been like the '96 version with Favre fully engaged and on board (with Rodgers, who knows?). Thompson didn't undercut Favre.

[DonHutson]

But, if you happen to be a HOF QB, who signed a lifetime contract with that same team during a time that the team was commited to "WINNING NOW".....................

Favre got his shot at the Super Bowl last year anyway. Maybe he didn't like the methods as they were unfolding, but in the end he had nothing to complain about.

[Fritz]

Hey, I liked Tennessee Ernie Ford. Made great sausage commercials back in the day.

As for the Jets' o-line being better...Damien Woody was overweight and undermotivated the whole time he was in Detroit, until the last half of the last year, when he realized he was playing for a contract. Then he suddenly became interested. I believe this is why New England let him go in the first place.

Now he's got a big, new contract. I wonder how he'll play?

'

Overweight? How can you tell...he is a lineman. When he was injured he did balloon up..but, he lost that weight by going to the duke program..hardly someone who is unmotivated..and playing at 335.

Undermotivated? again, how can you tell. I say the opposite..he lost his starting position at guard, was inactive for a couple of games and worked his way into the starting lineup at RT. That hardly sounds like someone is unmotivated.

The facts are this..he started for two Superbowl winning teams. He started 76 games with the Pats and was considered the anchor of the line.

He was a pro bowler in 02 and alternate in 04. He started every game 04 and 05 before and injury sidelined him in 06.

He is versatile and has played every position on the line cept for LT.

At worst he is an above average lineman.

We just don't agree here, Tyrone. Woody came to Detroit and proceeded to play and gain weight. He did not play well the year before last, and last year he got played so poorly he was benched - benched for the Detroit Lions? That's pretty bad. Yes, he worked his way back in, but my point it that this only seems to happen when Woody has a contract coming up. And since that's not the case now, having been rewarded, I see him once more settling into the familiar pattern.

I don't think he's all that. But I still love you and respect you, you crazy crackhead.

That isn't accurate..unless you can show some proof. He came and started for two years. That is 04 and 05. 06 he was out the whole year. Your time line isn't right.

What happened next is that they got a new coach...a tough guy..and woody went out with a foot injury. Now, he did gain weight..but, it is a fact that he went to the duke weight center and lost 40 pounds.

The big issue in detroit was of course could marinelli trust him...did he lose the weight so as to get his 4.5 salary or was he really committed.

Benched: No doubt...but, so what. He was coming back from an injury. You never saw any stories about him sulking, whining, demanding to be traded...he changed positions and got back in the lineup.

Remember, different coaches value diff types of lineman. If marinelli came to us...i guarantee many of our lineman would be benched, traded or cut.

Contract: He was great in NE. 76 games is quite a number for a lineman.

Love: Right back at you.

You're goin' Patler on me, man.

[cheesner]

Sounds a lot like "REBUILDING" to me, and thats fine, if you are a fan of the team and you do not mind waiting a few years for your team to be competitive again.

But, if you happen to be a HOF QB, who signed a lifetime contract with that same team during a time that the team was commited to "WINNING NOW".....................

How does that sit? Especially when the GM keeps saying "we are not rebuilding." If that same GM will lie about that to placate the fans and his HOF QB, do you think it is also possible then that he might lead his HOF QB on a little more, by entertaining discussions with him about who the new head coach should be? About picking up a FA such as Moss? Why not? Having Favre's face around during the rebuiliding phase kept money coming in, and kept seats filled.

It all made sense from a business stand point, but I don't root for business's, I root for the Packers, and the players.

TT did not know if Brett was going to play prior to his first 2 drafts or initial FA periods. Why would he draft or sign a FA with Brett in mind, not knowing if he was even going to play or not?

As far as 'keeping seats filled', the Packers have sold out every home game for the last 50 something years. There is no reason to believe it won't continue - I doubt fair weather fans, like yourself, comprise more than a percent or two of the Packer Fan population.

[sheepshead]

The guys all over the board isnt he?

[Guiness]

my posts are a bit over dramatic, or one sided.........

kept seats filled.

that would qualify as over dramatic right there.