Players that have to go

[Deputy Nutz]

I know of at least one for Barnett where Favre fucked him like a hooker in a school girl outfit.

Nutz, you have a rare talent for pithy observations.

Why you aren't providing the color on Monday Night Football is a mystery to me.

Something to do with race.

[Fritz]

Hawk is our best run stopping LB and he's adequate in pass coverage, so he plays in the base defense. In specialty packages (like the nickel), he is taken off the field because he is neither our best blitzer nor our best coverage backer. The specialists are the guys who go in the specialty packages, and Hawk isn't special at anything. He is, however, above-average to very good at pretty much everything you'd ask an inside linebacker to do.

Just my opinion, but I think Hawk is actually our most assignment sure linebacker in coverage. I think Chillar is better in man coverage, but he is actually to stupid to play zone worth a shit.

Chilllar also gets the nod in the nickel because at one point in the first game of the season he sacked the QB. Haven't seen shit since.

Partial, stop reading the papers, listening to WSSP and basing your opinion only on those secondary sources. Try watching the game.

Hawk isn't playing like a top 5 player picked in a draft. Chad Greenway in Minnesota is playing a hell of a lot better. This switch to the 3-4 has put several of our defensive players in a position without a position.

Also, if I don't see improvement in our inside linebackers and linebackers in general I think it is time for Winston Moss to take a hike.

I take away from the game that they have little faith in Hawk as they don't play him much anymore.

Hawk has had fewer impact plays than just about any starter on the team. This is a pressure, big play defense. I just cannot see them keeping the beast on the sidelines while they keep playing the brawny man.

I do trust a lot of what I hear from WSSP because former pros know a bit more than most of the people posting here.

I actually coached with Gary Ellerson, and coached his son when he was a freshman. Nothing Gary Ellerson ever came up with or said about football was ground breaking. He like any pro has the insight about lockerroom type stuff, relates to what the players are going through, that type of stuff, but as far as getting his opinion about play on the field, or play design I will find another ex-pro's opinion before I label Gary Ellerson's opinion as the bible.

Leroy Butler, let me know when he finally lands that job as an assistant coach in the pros.

Next who says that every player on this defense has to be dynamic and make Earth shattering play after play after play? If that is the case cut Pickett's fat ass right now, but guess what? He has a role and he fills it just fine. I am certainly not saying that I am excited about the play of Hawk, but I am certainly telling you that the play of Chillar, and Barnett have much more to be desired, neither one of them can be termed a "playmaker" at this point of the season.

How many touchdown passes has Hawk given up this year? I can count at least 3 that Chillar has given up and I know of at least one for Barnett where Favre fucked him like a hooker in a school girl outfit.

Nutzy, I don't always agree with you but you crack me right up.

And I do agree with your assessment of ex-players - lockerroom insights, yes, but more knowledge than, say, guys who've coached at a certain level, and so on - I'm not so sure. What I find ironic is that all these former players are hired as analysts and commentators, yet the one area they might be most helpful with - the lockerroom stuff - they probably can't talk about much on the air.

[Partial]

Hawk is our best run stopping LB and he's adequate in pass coverage, so he plays in the base defense. In specialty packages (like the nickel), he is taken off the field because he is neither our best blitzer nor our best coverage backer. The specialists are the guys who go in the specialty packages, and Hawk isn't special at anything. He is, however, above-average to very good at pretty much everything you'd ask an inside linebacker to do.

Just my opinion, but I think Hawk is actually our most assignment sure linebacker in coverage. I think Chillar is better in man coverage, but he is actually to stupid to play zone worth a shit.

Chilllar also gets the nod in the nickel because at one point in the first game of the season he sacked the QB. Haven't seen shit since.

Partial, stop reading the papers, listening to WSSP and basing your opinion only on those secondary sources. Try watching the game.

Hawk isn't playing like a top 5 player picked in a draft. Chad Greenway in Minnesota is playing a hell of a lot better. This switch to the 3-4 has put several of our defensive players in a position without a position.

Also, if I don't see improvement in our inside linebackers and linebackers in general I think it is time for Winston Moss to take a hike.

I take away from the game that they have little faith in Hawk as they don't play him much anymore.

Hawk has had fewer impact plays than just about any starter on the team. This is a pressure, big play defense. I just cannot see them keeping the beast on the sidelines while they keep playing the brawny man.

I do trust a lot of what I hear from WSSP because former pros know a bit more than most of the people posting here.

If Bishop were really that great don't you think he would get any snaps

I don't think he's the second coming, but I think he is the type of guy who will at least make some things happen. In his very little real game experience, he has made as many game changing plays (FFs, for example) as I can remember Hawk making in his entire career.

Bishop isn't a complete player, but neither is Hawk. Bishop is a much bigger hitter/tackler in my opinion, and a much, much better blitzer.

I think Bishop could be a solid starter in this system where I do not see Hawk satisfying that role.

Nutzy -- not everyone has to be a playmaker, but in this system the linebackers are the playmakers. Now we just need them to make plays.

I think it's unfair to pick on Barnett. He looked awfully good last week. It seems like he's getting his legs back under him.

Leroy still was a very successful pro and the quarterback of the defense so I will value his opinion on the matter quite a bit. When two very successful pros and one moderately successful one agree on something very passionately (people who also watched practice daily, something you or I did not), I can at least respect their opinion and won't write it off, since they've clearly been there before and have a level of understanding from the sheer hours of film study that you or I do not.


PB,

I understand they played a lot of nickel, but its the hen before the egg problem. Are they playing nickel because it puts the 11 best guys on the field, or are they playing nickel because the other team is running 3-4 guys out there on routes? I barely watched the game so I have no idea. I tend to believe that if AJ was in the top 11 defenders, they'd find a way to get him on the field more than 11 snaps a game.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I barely watched the game so I have no idea.

Never has so little said so much.

[Guiness]

I actually coached with Gary Ellerson,

You should count yourself lucky it wasn't Emmitt Smith helping you out. Can you imagine trying to work with him???

[bobblehead]

I know of at least one for Barnett where Favre fucked him like a hooker in a school girl outfit.

Nutz, you have a rare talent for pithy observations.

Why you aren't providing the color on Monday Night Football is a mystery to me.

Something to do with race.

OH MY GOD....THE DEPUTY IS A *GONG*

[SkinBasket]

I barely watched the game so I have no idea.

Never has so little said so much.

This isn't the first time we've heard this either. If you're going to waste so much time making these arguments, Partial, you might want to start watching some football.

[Scott Campbell]

How about "Posters that have to go"?

how about if you keep this kind of stuff up, I start with you?

Fuck, even i'm not dumb enough to give you that kind of ammo.

Don't underestimate yourself Ty.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I barely watched the game so I have no idea.

Never has so little said so much.

This isn't the first time we've heard this either. If you're going to waste so much time making these arguments, Partial, you might want to start watching some football.

You really think, from his previous posts, that watching the game will improve his analysis?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

How about "Posters that have to go"?

how about if you keep this kind of stuff up, I start with you?

Fuck, even i'm not dumb enough to give you that kind of ammo.

Don't underestimate yourself Ty.

I never do Scott.

[b bulldog]

All of our LB's except for Mathews are basicly good for sh!t.

[Deputy Nutz]

I barely watched the game so I have no idea.

Never has so little said so much.

Well thank god he has Leroy Butler.

I have tried to get behind Partial since his return, but when you make threads about players and their abilities and then admit that you hardly watched the game to begin with I have real issues with that. This really shakes any and all credibility Partial ever had with me.

This thread boarders on him being a troll, but since we only have a 15 posters contribute here on a daily basis I guess we will take what we can get.

[Partial]

All of our LB's except for Mathews are basicly good for sh!t.

Agreed with the exception I like how Barnett plays down hill and is at least intense and plays with fire.

[Deputy Nutz]

All of our LB's except for Mathews are basicly good for sh!t.

This sounds like a post by a guy that only watches little bitty bits of games.

[b bulldog]

That sounds like a post from a guy who thinks LB's are not supposed to be making plays in a 3/4 scheme.