Grade the Last Decade of Packer Drafts

[The Leaper]

Re: Grade the Last Decade of Packer Drafts

Best of the last decade?

1. 2000 (A-) Any draft where you can produce two very high caliber OL players is tough to beat...even more so if both of those guys are OTs. Then you land a premier DE pass rusher in KGB too? Franks and Diggs were very solid players for 4-6 years in Green Bay as well. Was kind of a feast or famine draft...but those feast picks came at vital trench positions in the NFL.

2. 2005 (B+) Aaron Rodgers really fell into the Packers lap...and Thompson's first draft pick as a Packer GM will probably go down in history as his best. A true franchise QB, Rodgers alone makes the draft a winner...toss in Collins as well, and you have two Pro Bowl caliber performers. However, without much production after the top two picks, I can't say this draft was better than 2000.

3. 2006 (B) Hawk hasn't lived up to his draft position, but he is still a capable starting LB. Jennings is a very good WR, but probably not a superstar. Jolly provides excellent depth as one of the DL cogs. Spitz is a serviceable player on the OL. Probably the draft that provided the greatest amount in numbers to the roster...but the talent level wasn't quite as good as the others, even with more players to choose from.

[get louder at lambeau]

the Packers have as bright of a present and future of any team in the NFL.

This.

A GM's job is to get the pieces to be competitive for a Championship. Ours has done that. Now, with whatever additions come from the draft, it's up to the coaches and players to take the next step.

[ND72]

Just thought I'd remind us of this...

1989...

1 Troy Aikman QB UCLA Dallas Cowboys
2 Tony Mandarich OT Michigan State Green Bay Packers
3 Barry Sanders RB Oklahoma State Detroit Lions
4 Derrick Thomas LB Alabama Kansas City Chiefs
5 Deion Sanders CB Florida State Atlanta Falcons
6 Broderick Thomas LB Nebraska Tampa Bay Buccaneers
7 Tim Worley RB Georgia Pittsburgh Steelers
8 Burt Grossman DE Pittsburgh San Diego Chargers
9 Sammie Smith RB Florida State Miami Dolphins
10 Eric Hill LB Louisiana State Phoenix Cardinals
11 Donnell Woolford DB Clemson Chicago Bears
12 Trace Armstrong DE Florida Chicago Bears
13 Eric Metcalf WR Texas Cleveland Browns
14 Jeff Lageman DE Virginia New York Jets
15 Andy Heck T Notre Dame Seattle Seahawks
16 Hart Lee Dykes WR Oklahoma State New England Patriots
17 Joe Wolf G Boston College Phoenix Cardinals
18 Brian Williams C Minnesota New York Giants
19 Wayne Martin DE Arkansas New Orleans Saints
20 Steve Atwater DB Arkansas Denver Broncos
21 Bill Hawkins DT Miami (Fla.) Los Angeles Rams
22 Andre Rison WR Michigan State Indianapolis Colts
23 David Williams T Florida Houston Oilers
24 Tom Ricketts G Pittsburgh Pittsburgh Steelers
25 Louis Oliver DB Florida Miami Dolphins
26 Cleveland Gary RB Miami (Fla.) Los Angeles Rams
27 Shawn Collins WR Northern Arizona Atlanta Falcons
28 Keith DeLong LB Tennessee San Francisco 49ers


Who the hell did we even draft?
1. Tony Mandrich
3. Matt Brock
3. Anthony Dilweg
4. Jeff Graham
5. Jeff Query
5. Vince Workman
6. Chris Jacke
7. Mark Hall
8. Thomas King
8. Brian Shulman
9. Scott Kirby
10. Ben Jessie
11. Cedric Stallworth
12. Stan Shiver

I mean really? if not for rounds 5 & 6, I would poop all over this.

[The Leaper]

A GM's job is to get the pieces to be competitive for a Championship. Ours has done that.

I beg to differ.

Our sieve of an OL is not a championship caliber crew. The OL has been broke ever since Thompson showed up, and he has done little to fix it...and with Clifton and Tauscher breaking down, Thompson now has to find the right answer or risk getting his franchise QB killed.

Thompson has made more right moves than wrong...I'll give him that. He's a very good GM. Still, his approach to the OL over the last 3-5 years has puzzled and scared me. Thinking that he has to pull all the right strings now in this one offseason worries me...if he hasn't been able to get much of anything done in 5 years on the OL, why should I be convinced that he will suddenly get it right this year?

[ND72]

A GM's job is to get the pieces to be competitive for a Championship. Ours has done that.

I beg to differ.

Our sieve of an OL is not a championship caliber crew. The OL has been broke ever since Thompson showed up, and he has done little to fix it...and with Clifton and Tauscher breaking down, Thompson now has to find the right answer or risk getting his franchise QB killed.

Thompson has made more right moves than wrong...I'll give him that. He's a very good GM. Still, his approach to the OL over the last 3-5 years has puzzled and scared me. Thinking that he has to pull all the right strings now in this one offseason worries me...if he hasn't been able to get much of anything done in 5 years on the OL, why should I be convinced that he will suddenly get it right this year?

I don't put this squarely on Thompson. I've said since McCarthy came here he does not put a premium on his OL, and thinks he can get away with just throwing guys on the field. I am hoping McCarthy has learned.

[swede]

Just thought I'd remind us of this...

1989...

1 Troy Aikman QB UCLA Dallas Cowboys
2 Tony Mandarich OT Michigan State Green Bay Packers
3 Barry Sanders RB Oklahoma State Detroit Lions
4 Derrick Thomas LB Alabama Kansas City Chiefs
5 Deion Sanders CB Florida State Atlanta Falcons

Knowing everything I know I don't know who I would have picked.

I only know who i WOULDN'T have picked.

Believe it or not I think Derrick Thomas would have been the best fit in Green Bay.

[wist43]

Just thought I'd remind us of this...

1989...

1 Troy Aikman QB UCLA Dallas Cowboys
2 Tony Mandarich OT Michigan State Green Bay Packers
3 Barry Sanders RB Oklahoma State Detroit Lions
4 Derrick Thomas LB Alabama Kansas City Chiefs
5 Deion Sanders CB Florida State Atlanta Falcons

Knowing everything I know I don't know who I would have picked.

I only know who i WOULDN'T have picked.

Believe it or not I think Derrick Thomas would have been the best fit in Green Bay.

I was for 1) Thomas, 2) Barry Sanders

The reason I laugh, is b/c this is the one draft I missed on TV b/c I was in jail... got out of the can, went for a cheap breakfast, bought a newspaper, and read that the Packers had drafted Mandarich

GF ran off with a vacuum cleaner salesman, so I tied one on, and got busted for DUI

Hilarious in life's history... only after you age a bit can you laugh about such things...

Really, I can't think about the drafting of Mandarich w/o laughing

[pbmax]

Here is my ranking of the drafts, best to worst:

2005 ARod, Nick Collins, Brady Pop (Most of us HATED the first two picks)
2000 Bubba, Chad Clifton, Na’il Diggs, KGB, Tauscher (Foundation of the OL for a decade)
2009 Raji, Matthews, TJ Lang, Quinn Johnson, Brandon Underwood, Brad Jones
2006 Hawk, Colledge, Jennings, Spitz (Jennings!)
2008 Nelson, Sitton, Finley, Flynn (Finley!)
2002 Javon Walker, Pooper, AK 74
2007 Harrel, BJack, Rouse, Barbre, Crosby, James Jones (Back ups, a kicker, yawn)
2003 Nick Barnett and Nothing (Bad)
2004 Waste two picks, Trade up for a punter, and Scott Wells (Worse)
2001 Jamaal Too Small Reynolds and The Fraud (Disaster)

Man, looking at this it really is a challenge to build a team through the draft.
The trend is up, but even TT had a tough outing in '07. We need another '09!

I think everyone but KGB is still playing in the highlighted players from 2000. I know Diggs just signed and I think Bubba is still with the Jets.

[Little Whiskey]

I've been having a similar conversation with my uncle (who hates TT). He, for some crazy reason, thinks Sherman was more of a master at the draft than Thompson. his basic argument is that he doesn't want the facts to get in the way of a good debate.

[wist43]

I've been having a similar conversation with my uncle (who hates TT). He, for some crazy reason, thinks Sherman was more of a master at the draft than Thompson. his basic argument is that he doesn't want the facts to get in the way of a good debate.

I had been a fence sitter wrt TT for a few years, but am more in his camp than not... and, I agree that building thru the draft is the way to go.

At some point, you have to fill specific holes with front-line talent, to augment the good work you've done in upgrading your roster thru the draft.

What are we lacking now??? How far away are we??? Would signing, or trading for a shut-down corner put us in the SB??? Using CB as an example - Patrick Lee should be stepping into that spot based on his draft position, but he is a bust... so does TT draft 2 more CB's this year and wait 3 years for them to develop, the whole time other holes are popping up on the roster thru FA losses, injury, and retirement???

At some point you have to say, "we're close... let's fill these couple of holes with vets and try to make a run".

[get louder at lambeau]

A GM's job is to get the pieces to be competitive for a Championship. Ours has done that.

I beg to differ.

Our sieve of an OL is not a championship caliber crew. The OL has been broke ever since Thompson showed up, and he has done little to fix it...and with Clifton and Tauscher breaking down, Thompson now has to find the right answer or risk getting his franchise QB killed.

Thompson has made more right moves than wrong...I'll give him that. He's a very good GM. Still, his approach to the OL over the last 3-5 years has puzzled and scared me. Thinking that he has to pull all the right strings now in this one offseason worries me...if he hasn't been able to get much of anything done in 5 years on the OL, why should I be convinced that he will suddenly get it right this year?

He has done little to fix it? He drafted Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Moll, Barbre, Giacomini, Merideth and Lang, off the top of my head. I think there were a few more, so he has averaged about 2 OL draft picks per year- some good, some not. The OL has not been neglected as you claim. It still needs to be upgraded, obviously, but every team in the NFL has an area that needs to be upgraded. The Packers have as much talent on the roster as anybody, and they are mostly young and improving. We're in great shape.

[RashanGary]

Two years ago Pittsburgh had a sieve of an OL too. They won a SB with it.

I remember saying there was no way Pitt wins a SB with that OL after watching 2 of their games near the end of the season. They went on and won it.


We certainly need to upgrade our OL, but it's not the sky is falling drama some make it out to be.

[The Leaper]

He has done little to fix it? He drafted Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Moll, Barbre, Giacomini, Merideth and Lang, off the top of my head.

Exactly...and it still isn't fixed. Some of these guys have flashed some potential, some are complete flops. None of them is a difference maker. None of them have come in, taken a position by the throat and made it theirs.

8 draft picks...and our OL is no more settled today than it was 5 years ago. Granted, I'll lay some of the blame on McCarthy and Campen too...they are mediocre when it comes to teaching these kids IMO.

That is why I have little confidence that TT can suddenly pull a rabbit from the hat and mastermind a strong OL this offseason. He made lots of ATTEMPTS to fix it, but it still ain't fixed when you give up 51 sacks.

Continually hoping that your last 2-3 picks will finally turn the corner after 2-3 years in the league doesn't work. Plenty of kids come into the NFL from college and do just fine as rookies on the OL.

[swede]

Here is my ranking of the drafts, best to worst:

2005 ARod, Nick Collins, Brady Pop (Most of us HATED the first two picks)
2000 Bubba, Chad Clifton, Na’il Diggs, KGB, Tauscher (Foundation of the OL for a decade)
2009 Raji, Matthews, TJ Lang, Quinn Johnson, Brandon Underwood, Brad Jones
2006 Hawk, Colledge, Jennings, Spitz (Jennings!)
2008 Nelson, Sitton, Finley, Flynn (Finley!)
2002 Javon Walker, Pooper, AK 74
2007 Harrel, BJack, Rouse, Barbre, Crosby, James Jones (Back ups, a kicker, yawn)
2003 Nick Barnett and Nothing (Bad)
2004 Waste two picks, Trade up for a punter, and Scott Wells (Worse)
2001 Jamaal Too Small Reynolds and The Fraud (Disaster)

Man, looking at this it really is a challenge to build a team through the draft.
The trend is up, but even TT had a tough outing in '07. We need another '09!

I think everyone but KGB is still playing in the highlighted players from 2000. I know Diggs just signed and I think Bubba is still with the Jets.

That is a good argument for ranking the 2000 draft first, but many of those players are no longer here. It really is an impressive draft, though.

How many crappy teams have drafted one quarterback after another without finding an NFL starter? Just for the fact that TT-- by certain design, uncertain luck, or a combination of the two--found a quality NFL starting quarterback with the twenty-somethingth pick of his first draft I gave his 2005 pick the nod. If you don't take the critical need for a quality quarterback into consideration then I think the 2005 draft is third behind 2000 (1st) and 2009.

[wist43]

He has done little to fix it? He drafted Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Moll, Barbre, Giacomini, Merideth and Lang, off the top of my head.

Exactly...and it still isn't fixed. Some of these guys have flashed some potential, some are complete flops. None of them is a difference maker. None of them have come in, taken a position by the throat and made it theirs.

8 draft picks...and our OL is no more settled today than it was 5 years ago. Granted, I'll lay some of the blame on McCarthy and Campen too...they are mediocre when it comes to teaching these kids IMO.

That is why I have little confidence that TT can suddenly pull a rabbit from the hat and mastermind a strong OL this offseason. He made lots of ATTEMPTS to fix it, but it still ain't fixed when you give up 51 sacks.

Continually hoping that your last 2-3 picks will finally turn the corner after 2-3 years in the league doesn't work. Plenty of kids come into the NFL from college and do just fine as rookies on the OL.

I've been a pretty consistent complainer about the OL and TT's "spit ball" approach... no way can you defend 51 sacks given up, but he certainly has thrown plenty of spit balls at it

At least he switched to a 3-4 last year... and amazingly Rodgers turned out; so, I do have hope