Packers D to Decline in 2010?

[vince]

I think we face about the same this year.

Keys this year:
C Wood to play a step below last year. If he can play like last year well save him a spot in the Hall cause last year was SICK!

Harris and Tramon to cover 1 and 3 WR if this can happen WOW we can really put a hurt on teams

CMIII to not have a sophmore slump

Jones dont mess up too bad

Raji time to get some preasure

Hawk...PLEASE Hawk play with some abandon!

Picket and the rotation on the DL eat space and stop the run

Collins and TBD SS please play good

Our defense does NOT need to be the Bears, Ravens or Steelers of old. They need to only give up 3 TDs a game and we should win every game.

I think the ability to pressure the QB will impact the success of the individuals in the defensive backfield as much or more than who's playing nickelback and/or whether Harris is 95% or 90% healthy for example. Harris has never relied on speed to be effective anyway.

And the pressure will have to come from someone besides Matthews, or he'll just be double teamed and neutralized. They may well move Matthews around more this year to offset that, but forcing offenses to be concerned about others is the best bet IMO.

I'm not sure how much you can count on Raji or any of the d-linemen to bring a ton of added pressure because of the difficulty in finding space to penetrate inside and the fact that their responsibility in Capers' scheme is often to occupy blockers to free up backers/blitzers rather than getting to the QB themselves. Maybe that'll change this year, but that's always been a pretty basic tenet of Capers'.

So it seems to me you're looking predominantly at Jones and the blitz schemes as the keys to getting to the QB. If they can do so, that'll help Matthews and the DB's as much or more than Matthews and the DB's can help themselves.

[Fred's Slacks]

I am not sure Harris was ever in the elite status.

A lot of elite NFL WR's thought he was.

In his prime, when he was healthy, no QB dared throw at him. Note that the oppositions #1 WR's were effectively taken out of the game when they played GB. Rarely topping 50 yards, and even more rarely scoring TD's. I think it may have been 2005, or 2006, or one of the seasons right around then, when Harris gave up 100 yards to only ONE player all season, that being Roy Williams in a game @ Detroit. Most of that yardage came on a single play, a play that resulted in the only TD Harris gave up on the entire season. And that play could at least in part be blamed on Marquand Manuel for being so far out of position to offer any help over the top.

Harris was never a ballhawk. He wasn't the guy to count on if you badly needed a turnover. But he can cover you like a blanket. He's a ferocious tackler. In his prime, I don't know if there's more than a handful of better man to man corners in the history of the league.

Just ask the guys he was covering.

Good points. I never understood why when Harris shut everyone down he was overrated because he didn't get any picks but now that Revis does it, he's the greatest ever?

[pbmax]

Dom also might just be unlucky and has always seemed to face a tougher array of offensive teams in his second seasons. Let's face it...Green Bay played a pussy schedule last year. The defense was not nearly as good as their stats suggested. I fully expect this defense to come back to earth a little this year. We ain't getting all the turnovers we did last year.

Still...a tougher schedule and some adversity in the regular season is probably good for this team. Make the playoffs, and it's anyone's title to win.

The other side to that, that a better defense in Year 1 under Capers leads to a better record for the team overall. Then Year 2, you face a better schedule (in theory).

[swede]

4 Sun Oct 3, 2010 Lions 1:00 PM ET They are the Lions...they will be better but we have Optimus Prime (Woodson) and he always beats Megatron (CJ) in the end

I read your entire post with interest, but your Transformer reference reminded me of something that I've never been able to confirm with anyone else. In the 2nd movie there is an epic battle scene near the pyramids. At one point you see the Shia LaBouf character from below while an evil Transformer is clambering over some sort of obstacle above him. From below you can see these huge metal balls swinging from chains under the Transformer's crotch. I laughed out loud and I don't know if anyone else in the theater noticed. No one in my group noticed.

I'm sorry. Big metal balls on a Transformer made me laugh.

we now return to Packer programming.

[mraynrand]

I'm sorry. Big metal balls on a Transformer made me laugh

Even more horrifying is what they transformed into...

[hoosier]

Hard to predict how everything will shake out on defense. However, I do think there are more guys likely to be better than there are guys likely to be worse. If Al declines, the big question is whether they have someone (Lee, Underwood, Blackmon) to adequately fill the nickel back role. They didn't last year, but then they didn't have Blackmon and Lee due to injuries. If the Packers end up at sometime this season with Jarrett Bush at nickel, it will be fair to say that TT did not do his job. I'm reasonably confident that won't happen though.

Blackmon got moved to safety so they're probably no longer considering him as an option for nickle. It seems to me that, based on that switch, they must either be confident that Underwood or Bell will be ready to play at a decent level (hard to imagine having a great deal of confidence in Lee at this point given his recent history) or they think more of Bush than most Packer fans do. Does anyone know if Underwood was cleared for the May OTA? If he was, then the fact that Bush was ahead of him is just a little bit concerning.

[vince]

I don't think you can read anything whatsoever into the fact that Bush was reported to be "starting" in the OTA's. I think they do that in May to keep the young guy hungry as much as anything.

[Pugger]

Pat Lee was drafted in the second round so there must be some talent there. His issue is staying healthy. I'm eager to see what he has this year and if he can stay on the field.

[retailguy]

I don't think you can read anything whatsoever into the fact that Bush was reported to be "starting" in the OTA's. I think they do that in May to keep the young guy hungry as much as anything.

I still remember the $1m signing bonus a couple years back. That, right there, told me that the team likes Bush a whole lot more than I do.

[Tarlam!]

Further to Gunnies points on Harris, just ask Chuck what he thinks of having Harris on the other side. A big reason for Chuck's successes at GB are because QB are forced to choose one of the two evils. In Oakland, QBs just threw away from Woodson and kept him on an island.

Woodsons appreciation for Harris is well documented.

[Tony Oday]

4 Sun Oct 3, 2010 Lions 1:00 PM ET They are the Lions...they will be better but we have Optimus Prime (Woodson) and he always beats Megatron (CJ) in the end

I read your entire post with interest, but your Transformer reference reminded me of something that I've never been able to confirm with anyone else. In the 2nd movie there is an epic battle scene near the pyramids. At one point you see the Shia LaBouf character from below while an evil Transformer is clambering over some sort of obstacle above him. From below you can see these huge metal balls swinging from chains under the Transformer's crotch. I laughed out loud and I don't know if anyone else in the theater noticed. No one in my group noticed.

I'm sorry. Big metal balls on a Transformer made me laugh.

we now return to Packer programming.

lol Yeah that is funny no idea why they had it in the movie but hell it was funny. I also like how Megan Fox's white pants NEVER got dirty! WTH

[run pMc]

Crazy Martz is the OC for a desperate CHI team, DET has really improved this offseason, and Grandpa Favre will be back, so all those division games will be tough fights.

I think the D will take a small step backwards, primarily due to the schedule, but I still think they will be good. Injuries will have a lot to say about that, as well as the development of the youngsters.

Pre-injury, Harris was a borderline-elite CB...not a burner but physical and great in press/man coverage. Given his age and injury, I'm not sure he will be able to return to that form. I do think he can still play in Capers' scheme.
Woodson and Harris need to stay healthy and keep drinking from the fountain of youth. I'm hoping for good things and development from Williams, Underwood, and Lee. I don't know how much they will be able to give the team. If Burnett can grasp things quickly and push Bigby that will help at the S.

To me the D line are mostly just gap pluggers, so if they do their job I think they are fine there. Capers will continue to focus on stopping the run. Getting a pass rush will help the secondary, but which LBs (besides Matthews) can bring it? Barnett having a full year removed from ACL might help...I think he's better than Hawk at rushing from the inside. I'm encouraged by Jones but not on the bandwagon yet. I'm not sold on Poppinga, Chillar, or Bishop either.

I would have liked to see more than some street guys brought in at the OLB, but the coaches know way more than a casual observer...so we'll see.

Really, it's hard to be unhappy if you get a top 10 defense to go with a top 10 offense.

[wist43]

Crazy Martz is the OC for a desperate CHI team, DET has really improved this offseason, and Grandpa Favre will be back, so all those division games will be tough fights.

I think the D will take a small step backwards, primarily due to the schedule, but I still think they will be good. Injuries will have a lot to say about that, as well as the development of the youngsters.

Pre-injury, Harris was a borderline-elite CB...not a burner but physical and great in press/man coverage. Given his age and injury, I'm not sure he will be able to return to that form. I do think he can still play in Capers' scheme.
Woodson and Harris need to stay healthy and keep drinking from the fountain of youth. I'm hoping for good things and development from Williams, Underwood, and Lee. I don't know how much they will be able to give the team. If Burnett can grasp things quickly and push Bigby that will help at the S.

To me the D line are mostly just gap pluggers, so if they do their job I think they are fine there. Capers will continue to focus on stopping the run. Getting a pass rush will help the secondary, but which LBs (besides Matthews) can bring it? Barnett having a full year removed from ACL might help...I think he's better than Hawk at rushing from the inside. I'm encouraged by Jones but not on the bandwagon yet. I'm not sold on Poppinga, Chillar, or Bishop either.

I would have liked to see more than some street guys brought in at the OLB, but the coaches know way more than a casual observer...so we'll see.

Really, it's hard to be unhappy if you get a top 10 defense to go with a top 10 offense.

I agree... although I'm not sold they're a top 10 D. Just depends on what Dom does with it.

TT didn't bring in any corners... so he's rolling the dice on Lee. I like Underwood and hope he would see a lot of playing time over Bush. Even if Bush is a better player at this point, he doesn't have the upside that Underwood does, so I'd give Underwood every opportunity to get on the field as the 4th corner.

[packerbacker1234]

Oh I do think Harris was indeed great - and yeah it is odd that now that Revis is doing what Harris did that he is the best thing out there, and harris was not.

Thing is, I think it's just the age difference. Harris in 2005/2006 or whatever was much older than Revis is now. Now, harris was good before that, and has been pretty good after, but those seasons are when he made is mark. That is when Ocho Cinco had his corner check list and he said all season, the best CB he had ever seen was Harris. Thats when his name really started getting out there. From that point on, almost every #1 WR was saying how they hated to play GB because Harris took them out of the game. It remained that way, pretty much, until TO had a hell of game against him a couple years ago in dallas. After that, he did appear to lose a step. Of course, being an "elite" corner, losing a step doesn't mean a whole lot. Especially since we added Woodson to the other side.

Knowing how harris works so hard to keep his body intact and such, I do expect him to return and play to form. I am not sure harris knows how to play the game any other way. Be agressive at the line, jam the WR, and shut him down.

I think why people are more impressed with Revis is due to his age, and the fact he is shutting guys down in a new era, where WR's are virtually not allowed to be touched.

[get louder at lambeau]

I think why people are more impressed with Revis is due to his age, and the fact he is shutting guys down in a new era, where WR's are virtually not allowed to be touched.

Playing in the largest NFL market instead of the smallest probably helps a little too.