2011 PackerRats community mock second draft

[Guiness]

Jimmy Smith, Clayborune, Locker and Brandon Harris were the players picked in the first mock that didn't go this time. I don't know which of those would get consideration.

[Bretsky]

Jimmy Smith, Clayborune, Locker and Brandon Harris were the players picked in the first mock that didn't go this time. I don't know which of those would get consideration.

It all depends how bad of a person Jimmy Smith is. Talent wise, he may be top tier.

And Claybourne......great talent but inconsistent.....with the injury concern...who knows

[Lurker64]

Jimmy Smith, Clayborune, Locker and Brandon Harris were the players picked in the first mock that didn't go this time. I don't know which of those would get consideration.

Clayborn might, though his medical condition might disqualify him in TT's eyes.

Locker? Nope, we're not taking a QB in the first round.

Brandon Harris wouldn't, since TT doesn't draft short corners. Harris is even south of the 5-10 that most NFL teams look for in their CBs, nor is he particularly fast.

Jimmy Smith is a fantastically talented prospect, probably the second best CB in this draft on talent alone. He's a very similar prospect to Revis coming out. The problem is that he's an absolute "capital-C" character risk. So you may get a Revis or you may get Pac-Man Jones. The degree to which he "just doesn't get it"? He lied to NFL teams about his arrest records in the combine interviews.

[Bretsky]

Clayborn might, though his medical condition might disqualify him in TT's eyes.

Locker? Nope, we're not taking a QB in the first round.

Brandon Harris wouldn't, since TT doesn't draft short corners. Harris is even south of the 5-10 that most NFL teams look for in their CBs, nor is he particularly fast.

Jimmy Smith is a fantastically talented prospect, probably the second best CB in this draft on talent alone. He's a very similar prospect to Revis coming out. The problem is that he's an absolute "capital-C" character risk. So you may get a Revis or you may get Pac-Man Jones. The degree to which he "just doesn't get it"? He lied to NFL teams about his arrest records in the combine interviews.

I didn't hear that, but it does redefine stupid..........what did he lie about ?

This is your ship Lurk......but the bracket challenge might be interesting. You could do the seeds. Create Four Seperate threads at the same time for the top 8.......and then you could give a couple days for people to download scouting reports and build a case for the person of their choice in the four threads.

But that might be a lot of work as well......so going the standard route would be cool as well.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

Lot of value here at 32. I really think the BPA here is TE Rudolph. Out of the players left to choose from, I suspect Clayborn and Smith could be gone by now. All it takes is one team to fall in love with a prospect. I also feel like someone will pick Rudolph in the late first round. It seems like he's been flying under-the-radar up until this point.

In most years, IMO, it wouldn't even be a question that Kyle Rudolph would go in the first round. Then again, most years there isn't an abundance of first round defensive line talent like this year.

[Guiness]

A TE? JHC, we better cut Lee this year then. If we carry 5 TE's into next season my head will explode!!!

re: Smith lying to teams...on what planet did he think he would not get caught?

edit: looked around for info on Smith's arrests, and found very little that wasn't about the Jaguar's former WR! Seems like he had two arrests for underage drinking. I'm not sure what to make of that, and what sort of a police force keeps track of those sorts of things? I'm my hometown police force kept records of underage drinking tickets in the days before computers, they'd need another building to keep them all in!

There have also been mentions of drug tests failed, but I couldn't find anything on them. Do you have any links Lurker?

http://www.ralphiereport.com/2011/3/1/2024278/recapping-the-nfl-combine-for-nate-solder-and-jimmy-smith

[Bretsky]

Lot of value here at 32. I really think the BPA here is TE Rudolph. Out of the players left to choose from, I suspect Clayborn and Smith could be gone by now. All it takes is one team to fall in love with a prospect. I also feel like someone will pick Rudolph in the late first round. It seems like he's been flying under-the-radar up until this point.

In most years, IMO, it wouldn't even be a question that Kyle Rudolph would go in the first round. Then again, most years there isn't an abundance of first round defensive line talent like this year.

Does Rudolph possess elite talent ? He seems like a decent player, but I'm not sure he is great at anything. Is he any better than a Greg Olson ?. I can maybe see a team in need of a TE taking him here but IMO it'd be a need pick. If we're going BPA I'm not sure how to argue Rudolph over Smith. Since this is how the board fell the argument of they will probably not be there as a reason not to vote for them is no more valid that it was when some tried to use that argument against Ingram .

[Lurker64]

I didn't hear that, but it does redefine stupid..........what did he lie about ?

He told teams that he had only been arrested once. The actual number of times he was arrested was significantly closer to four. It's not unthinkable that a kid might want to hide this, but it's pretty stupid to do so at a job interview where the people talking to you actually know your arrest record. If you don't actually know how many times you've been arrested, well... that's a problem.

This is your ship Lurk......but the bracket challenge might be interesting. You could do the seeds. Create Four Seperate threads at the same time for the top 8.......and then you could give a couple days for people to download scouting reports and build a case for the person of their choice in the four threads.

But that might be a lot of work as well......so going the standard route would be cool as well.

Happy to do this, I'd be happier figuring out the seedings if more people (you already did this so you're exempt) would post their top eight seeds.

Personally, I would definitely include: Ijalana, Watkins, Reed, Clayborn.

But the last four spots are trickier.

We would want to include a WR probably, but Young, Hankerson, or Cobb (or someone else)?
In terms of OLB prospects other than Reed, there's Jabal Sheard, Mason Foster, Martez Wilson all of whom would be reasonable picks here.
In terms of "general value picks" it's worth considering guys like LeShoure, Smith, and Rudolph at positions we generally wouldn't consider as needs.
If I include Watkins and Ijalana, why not consider Stefen Wisniewski too?

So I'm at too many names, and I don't know if we want to do sixteen (I kind of don't.)

A thought that crossed my mind would be to do four "groups" (an OL group, an OLB group, a WR group, and a WildCard group) and then do a 4-person bracket once we've filtered but that might even be more complicated.

[Bretsky]

He told teams that he had only been arrested once. The actual number of times he was arrested was significantly closer to four. It's not unthinkable that a kid might want to hide this, but it's pretty stupid to do so at a job interview where the people talking to you actually know your arrest record. If you don't actually know how many times you've been arrested, well... that's a problem.



Happy to do this, I'd be happier figuring out the seedings if more people (you already did this so you're exempt) would post their top eight seeds.

Personally, I would definitely include: Ijalana, Watkins, Reed, Clayborn.

But the last four spots are trickier.

We would want to include a WR probably, but Young, Hankerson, or Cobb (or someone else)?
In terms of OLB prospects other than Reed, there's Jabal Sheard, Mason Foster, Martez Wilson all of whom would be reasonable picks here.
In terms of "general value picks" it's worth considering guys like LeShoure, Smith, and Rudolph at positions we generally wouldn't consider as needs.
If I include Watkins and Ijalana, why not consider Stefen Wisniewski too?

So I'm at too many names, and I don't know if we want to do sixteen (I kind of don't.)

A thought that crossed my mind would be to do four "groups" (an OL group, an OLB group, a WR group, and a WildCard group) and then do a 4-person bracket once we've filtered but that might even be more complicated.

Ijalana, Watkins, Reed, Clayborn.

These along with Smith to me are probably the no brainers. Attitudes aside Smith is the best football player left so its interesting to see who will go BPA with an attitude

16 would probably be a nightmare IMO

If you can choose eight you can go two days for each round and allow a few days for the finale

But it would be helpful if others would post their top 8

[TennesseePackerBacker]

Someone enlighten me please. Does Clayborn possess the bulk required to play 3-4 DE? I always felt like he projected better as a 4-3 DE. And Bretsky, Rudolph just passes the eyeball test for me. Nothing more. He may not be great at anything, but he is the best TE prospect available hands down.

[Bretsky]

Someone enlighten me please. Does Clayborn possess the bulk required to play 3-4 DE? I always felt like he projected better as a 4-3 DE. And Bretsky, Rudolph just passes the eyeball test for me. Nothing more. He may not be great at anything, but he is the best TE prospect available hands down.

I was thinking about this more; there is something to be said to the idea of having two great TE's. It's another way to fill in for a guy like Jones who might leave

[Lurker64]

Someone enlighten me please. Does Clayborn possess the bulk required to play 3-4 DE? I always felt like he projected better as a 4-3 DE. And Bretsky, Rudolph just passes the eyeball test for me. Nothing more. He may not be great at anything, but he is the best TE prospect available hands down.

Clayborn is 281, so he can certainly bulk up to play the position. Wynn and Wilson were about that heavy when drafted, and Neal was a little heavier. The real problem with projecting Clayborn to play 5-technique would be his lack of ideal length (he's 6'2 5/8 and his arms are 32 1/2") and the fact that one of his arms doesn't work. I think that honestly if I was dead-set on drafting a DE with the top pick, I would rather trade back and get the other Iowa DE: Christian Ballard, who's bigger and longer (and his arms work).

But to be honest, I don't like taking a DE here with the board the way it is. 5-techs just aren't that valuable if you're not going to get elite ones, and we're not going to get one here.

[swede]

Jimmy Smith, Clayborune, Locker and Brandon Harris were the players picked in the first mock that didn't go this time. I don't know which of those would get consideration.

I picked Brandon Harris for the Steelers.

At the combines he was amazing, outclassing everyone in the ball and movement drills except for Peterson. If he doesn't go in the first he'll at least be the third CB taken.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

I was thinking about this more; there is something to be said to the idea of having two great TE's. It's another way to fill in for a guy like Jones who might leave

Agreed. You just never know with Ted. How much does he think Quarless progresses in the next couple of years? How high is his ceiling?

[get louder at lambeau]

Clayborn is 281, so he can certainly bulk up to play the position. Wynn and Wilson were about that heavy when drafted, and Neal was a little heavier. The real problem with projecting Clayborn to play 5-technique would be his lack of ideal length (he's 6'2 5/8 and his arms are 32 1/2") and the fact that one of his arms doesn't work. I think that honestly if I was dead-set on drafting a DE with the top pick, I would rather trade back and get the other Iowa DE: Christian Ballard, who's bigger and longer (and his arms work).

But to be honest, I don't like taking a DE here with the board the way it is. 5-techs just aren't that valuable if you're not going to get elite ones, and we're not going to get one here.

So he's a little undersized for the 3-4, his arm is fucked up, and he doesn't play an especially valuable position. He's a potential first round pick why? Is this draft that weak?