Hargrove out 8 games

[Patler]

Had he continued in the denials, he would likely have been hit harder.

What about Smith?

[Smidgeon]

You guys seem to be missing my point.

The NFL has released fairly informative statements on the involvements of the suspended players. The major difference between their statements about Hargrove and Smith is that Hargrove lied when initial questions. Well, if they are correct in punishing Smith, he is continuing to lie to them. The NFL has pretty clearly indicated their belief that Smith contributed a lot of money to the program. The have even stated that this fact was corroborated by numerous sources. They made no such allegation against Hargrove, which I am fairly certain they would have if they have any evidence of it. The have identified numerous sources of money funding the program.

I'm not disputing Hargrove's punishment as much as I am trying to justify why he would get twice as much as Smith. I hate to say this, but I think Hargrove has been punished more severely because:

- of his actions in the "Favre is done" incident
- he has admitted to lying, while other continue do so. He has no defense to it.
- Hargrove is a "throw away" player. He is not a big name, probably is less likely or able to pose a significant individual defense, and it is easy for the league to say, "look how tough we are on this" with him rather than other big name players. Vilma's involvement made his suspension a no-brainer.

Excellent points.

Maybe Florio can segue them into national attention.

[pbmax]

I agree with that completely. Smith should be punished at least as significantly as Hargrove, and maybe even more.

The NFL has Hargrove admitting to lying and the NFL claims he "participated" in the scheme. 2 strikes, only one item needs to be defended. The NFL claims Smith participated but he is still denying it. Possibly two strikes, but both need to be proven. And Smith not only has the defense of maintaining innocence, but also being able to prove he contributed nothing and was paid nothing. His denial would look strong if all you can claim is that he knew people were talking about a scheme. His experience would be that the scheme was all talk and therefore not real at all.

I think this will become a debate about scheme vs. money. The NFL has a lot of evidence of a scheme. But little (publicly known) evidence of money actually changing hands. They have next to no injuries to tie to this program and only a few yellow flags during a 3 year run of the program. The only strong point to stand on is the CBA violation extra payments would have entailed.

And the CBA violation doesn't look impressive if you have scant evidence that players were actually paid. Hargrove's admitted lie is the low hanging fruit.

Its possible, if contrary evidence was presented, Smith or Fujita could face further discipline if their lie were exposed. But as this will likely enter the courts, that will be negotiated by lawyers similar to the personal conduct policy violations during the lockout. Absent financial proof, I think they will to stand on the scheme vs. money argument. If they neither paid nor received money, it could be reasonably argued they did not participate in the scheme, and refusing to acknowledge its existence might stand on all talk and no action.

I think we could call it the Sharper Defense.

[Pugger]

Had he continued in the denials, he would likely have been hit harder.

He was in a fucked position, since the team was doing something well outside the rules and he was told to lie about it, presumably by a higher up in the organization. Either he goes against the team and nobody trusts him afterwards, or he lies to the NFL and gets whacked now.

Now that you posted this you might be right and that Hargrove is getting hosed. Good lord, he finally does the right thing by coming clean and gets hammered for it but the others who continue to lie don't.

[Scott Campbell]

I can't stick up for Hargrove.

[smuggler]

I think it's good for us to get Hargrove back after 8 games. No complaint from me. After all, we're worried about the playoffs more than the first 8 games.

[Pugger]

I can't stick up for Hargrove.

Nobody is. We are just wondering why his punishment is harsher while others who continue to lie (like Smith) only got a 4 game suspension.

[Rutnstrut]

Nobody is. We are just wondering why his punishment is harsher while others who continue to lie (like Smith) only got a 4 game suspension.

Because Hargrove was the idiot bragging on live tv about taking Favre out.

[pbmax]

Rex Ryan putting his mouth (and pen) where his money isn't.

Rex Ryan wrote about "dotting" opposing players.

[Pugger]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--anthony-hargrove-s-declaration-to-nfl-regarding-saints-bounty-scandal.html

[Smeefers]

It's also possible that in the signed affidavits he admitted to paying people or accepting money for a big hit. If he hadn't of told the truth, he could have been suspended a full year a-la Vilma. We simply don't know and to speculate is just that, speculation. People are clamoring for the evidence, but it may be being kept out of the public eye to protect the players. If they really do go through with an appeal, I'm sure much of this will come to light. How would you play against a guy who paid someone to take out one of your team mates?

Wow, you hit that right on the head smeefers! Good job.

[pbmax]

Wow, you hit that right on the head smeefers! Good job.

Wait, wait. What did we miss or you get? Got link?

[Smeefers]

Wait, wait. What did we miss or you get? Got link?

Sorry! Rookie mistake, I just figured everyone knew Hargrove pretty much admitted to participating in the bounty program and participating in its cover up. The evidence that he himself released is pretty much the most damning thing that could have happened to him. Huh. He was cheating, got caught cheating, and now he's being punished for cheating. He got a lighter sentence than the other guy cause at least he eventually told the truth, but eventually telling the truth isn't telling it right away.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--document--anthony-hargrove-was-instructed-to-lie-by-gregg-williams--joe-vitt.html;_ylt=Arnkgbb2NP4FHWR2TRE.4rJDubYF

[Zool]

Ex-Saint: Coaches said to 'play dumb'

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7901702/anthony-hargrove-says-joe-vitt-gregg-williams-told-play-dumb-bounties

[Gunakor]

NFLPA to counter that Hargrove never once in that statement admitted to participating in or having knowledge of said bounty program. That the fact he was told to play dumb doesn't necessarily mean he knew what he was playing dumb about, and certainly doesn't implicate him as a participant.

Rapistburger only got 4 games. Hargrove's suspension will be reduced, I'm almost positive of that.