The Cullen Jenkins Mistake

[Patler]

Best to let this one go Patler. He's baiting you.

I suspect you are correct, and I respond to his posts not so much to engage him in a discussion, but to correct any misunderstandings that exist among the silent majority who frequent this site. All the regulars on here know what the deal was at that time, it has been discussed at length before. But I really do try to expose blatant errors and falsehoods just in case there are some who may not know.

[Guiness]

I suspect you are correct, and I respond to his posts not so much to engage him in a discussion, but to correct any misunderstandings that exist among the silent majority who frequent this site. All the regulars on here know what the deal was at that time, it has been discussed at length before. But I really do try to expose blatant errors and falsehoods just in case there are some who may not know.

Yes, I can see what you are trying to do, but this discussion has obviously reached the point of one I had with my son the other day over the teacher's strike/non-strike/work to rule campaign here in Ontario. The government has declared them an essential service, taking away their right to take any significant job action. He doesn't think teachers should be allowed to do any of that because it hurts the students who are innocent bystanders. No amount of pointing out that the government is using an heavy hand in the negotiations will convince him otherwise, because the students are innocent bystanders and are being hurt. And not only that, but students are innocent bystanders and are being hurt, so the teachers should not be allowed to strike.

That argument seems very close to the one LotP15 was using.

On the topic of contracts at that time, I was also disappointed when neither Wahle or Rivera were retained. All the talk leading up to that time was that one would stay, there wasn't money for both of them. There was discussions about who was the favorite, why one of them (Whale?) had never been on the cover of some Packer's publication. He really seemed to take this as a slight, that he was under appreciated.

I do think the team could have held on to one, but TT, and I think he has admitted as much, decided guards were easily replaceable. The next part of the issue was as you said - Whale got LT money. I think he refused to negotiate an extension that year, knowing he would cash in on the open market. As it turned out he did not work at LT and went back to guard. I don't think we ever had a chance to resign Wahle. Rivera we probably could have retained, Dallas gave him a monster contract though.

[sharpe1027]

Hey Patler, I believe this is the site that you were referring to. Here's the 2005 link after Sharper and Wahle were cut. This guy was pretty on top of his stuff as I recall.

http://sports-boards.net/reports/packsalarycap.htm

The sad part is I already gave Legand that link earlier in the thread to show him the true numbers but he still had the gall to say patler didn't use accurate figures. If you can't be bothered to look at the basis behind someone else's opinion at least have the decency to give them the benefit of the doubt.

[LegandofthePack15]

this is great. we finally get everyones favorite poster back, and now some new asshat with the gayest avatar on the site is gonna piss him off and run him off again

Talk about irony. Doctor, check thy own avatar.

Ok, lesson learned. Never criticize Ted Thompson on this site. Do so and you get showered with some nice nicknames like"noob", "asshat", "troll", and "PacoPete".

Harlan's back? I would say he's everyone's favorite poster, but what do I know? I am just a newbie.

[Patler]

I do think the team could have held on to one, but TT, and I think he has admitted as much, decided guards were easily replaceable. The next part of the issue was as you said - Whale got LT money. I think he refused to negotiate an extension that year, knowing he would cash in on the open market. As it turned out he did not work at LT and went back to guard. I don't think we ever had a chance to resign Wahle. Rivera we probably could have retained, Dallas gave him a monster contract though.

Either TT or Brandt said as much one time. The story as I recall it was that it became clear that Wahle expected to get such a big contract that the Packers wouldn't be competitive anyway. Leading up to free agency, they asked Rivera to check the market and give them a chance to try and workout something competitive, which he agreed to do because he really would like to have stayed in GB. Dallas gave him such a fantastic deal that the Packers basically told him to take the money and enjoy it. Both knew he likely only had a couple years left anyway.

[Patler]

Ok, lesson learned. Never criticize Ted Thompson on this site. Do so and you get showered with some nice nicknames like"noob", "asshat", "troll", and "PacoPete".

(Sigh)...... The lessons you should learn from this are:

- If you are going to make vehement assertions you would do well to have some legitimate support for them, and state it upfront.
- If you challenge another posters comments, at least have the decency to restate the challenged comment accurately.

and most importantly:

- If you are treated with respect and courtesy, respond in kind.

[Guiness]

Either TT or Brandt said as much one time. The story as I recall it was that it became clear that Wahle expected to get such a big contract that the Packers wouldn't be competitive anyway. Leading up to free agency, they asked Rivera to check the market and give them a chance to try and workout something competitive, which he agreed to do because he really would like to have stayed in GB. Dallas gave him such a fantastic deal that the Packers basically told him to take the money and enjoy it. Both knew he likely only had a couple years left anyway.

Yup. On the surface of it, he got almost the same money as Wahle, and over a third of it up front! I think everyone was surprised by that deal.

[red]

Talk about irony. Doctor, check thy own avatar.

Ok, lesson learned. Never criticize Ted Thompson on this site. Do so and you get showered with some nice nicknames like"noob", "asshat", "troll", and "PacoPete".

Harlan's back? I would say he's everyone's favorite poster, but what do I know? I am just a newbie.

i could give a shit what you think of TT, i'm not his biggest fan either. my problem is your non-stop attack on the most respected poster on this site

and don't even get me started on the difference between our avs. mine is a great original movie with briliant acting all the way through. yours is from a movie with a story that has been done hundreds of times, with horrible acting, geared towards 10 year old little girls.

[LegandofthePack15]

Note that I said , "the then most accurate source of cap information that I knew of" (Emphasis added.)

Yes, I saw that statement. What I failed to see when you initially made that statement was WHAT or WHO your source was.

Now you claim your source is some guy posting on the internet. I checked out the link and he took a lot of his data from sources like NFLPA, MJS and ESPN. So unless he was a Packer employee or he had inside info, his guess was as good as the MJS or GBPG.

Plus, you failed to acknowledge that the majority of the Packers' cap surplus came from the TV deal that was signed in 2006. The only way the Packers could go from being 7.5 M under at one point in 2005 to being 35 M under in 2006 without the new deal was if they cut ties with a bunch of their highest paid players.

So all in all, you're telling me that it was mathematically impossible for the Packers to retain Wahle, Rivera and Sharper?

I find that hard to believe. Since the beginning of the salary cap era, teams have been manipulating the cap and restructuring existing contracts to make more room.

[LegandofthePack15]

i could give a shit what you think of TT, i'm not his biggest fan either. my problem is your non-stop attack on the most respected poster on this site

and don't even get me started on the difference between our avs. mine is a great original movie with briliant acting all the way through. yours is from a movie with a story that has been done hundreds of times, with horrible acting, geared towards 10 year old little girls.

Lol, I have no clue what "great" movie you're talking about. As far as I know, your avatar is that of Diesel, you know the wrestling guy. Have you seen Stone Cold and Cena's acting? The Rock is the only guy worth watching.

[red]

Lol, I have no clue what "great" movie you're talking about. As far as I know, your avatar is that of Diesel, you know the wrestling guy. Have you seen Stone Cold and Cena's acting? The Rock is the only guy worth watching.

no, that is not kevin nash

its "the dude" from the big lebowski

[Smidgeon]

I suspect you are correct, and I respond to his posts not so much to engage him in a discussion, but to correct any misunderstandings that exist among the silent majority who frequent this site. All the regulars on here know what the deal was at that time, it has been discussed at length before. But I really do try to expose blatant errors and falsehoods just in case there are some who may not know.

And we appreciate you for that.

[denverYooper]

no, that is not kevin nash

its "the dude" from the big lebowski

You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

[Zool]

You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

Well that's just like....your opinion man.

[Lurker64]

Back to the original topic, I think that the whole "the Packers screwed up by letting Cullen Jenkins walk" narrative is just a classic case of mistaking correlation for causation. Jenkins left, and the Packers defense all of a sudden started playing poorly, but those two things aren't necessarily causally connected.

If Jenkins were actually a huge loss for the Packers, he probably would have been a bigger gain for the Eagles. Let's not forget that he wasn't even starting during the 2010-2011 playoff run.