O-LINE ANALYSIS, PACKERS VS. FALCONS (MOLL EDITION!)

[woodbuck27]

Every fan and GM says you shouldn't draft for need, and then when you don't, they complain. I remember Wolf taking a OG in the 2nd round. They tried to play him at OT and it failed. It took him a few years, but he became a great OG. His name is Mike Wahle.

Well let's not point the finger again at Ted in this discussion Harvey.

gbpackfan supplied us with very good stat's again this week, that examines the progress of the midddle of OUR OL.

Excellent work again by the way gbpackfan.Very solid.

Is Colledge out at LG and Moll in based on the excellent pass protection that Favre got? I don't know based on one game.

Spitz's numbers reflect that he's a Rookie of accomplishment with us so far. Between Spitz and Colledge "the facts" so far, support that Spitz will be useful to us in 2006.

There I go again. Screwing up ! Even mentioning 2006 in terms of getting it right. As this season is like the design phase of the project not actual construction.

Why do we even post here, now? Maybe just postpone posting - till we get to April 2007?

Free Agency and The Draft, and then the loooong slow period of time till . . OH BOY ! It's back again - Training Camp !!! The next 53 Man Roster and another long season of losing, and a high draft pick on and on into Ted's NFL World PLAN. . on and on and on. . .season after season . .on and on. .

Oh Boy!! Five years after this season we get to reminess about Brett Favre as we have Reggie White this Off Season, as Brett was a borderline first ballot selection to the NFL HOF.

Jeeee !!!

[woodbuck27]

Seems to me the Packers had more problems on the edges in game one than the interior. Frome the ol stats posted here Moll wasn't any better really than College, the ol was just better overall. I get the impression the tackles played better...It is my humble opinion that if Moll is the starter Green Bay is in trouble...The stats show me they were both about the same!! How did College do in his playing time!

It just might be a different personality thing between Colledge and Moll, and let's not ever forget that with Colledge in there - it was San Diego not Atlanta. Big difference.

First game of the season and high hopes based on no game plan? High personal expectations, as all that stuff crammed into these fellas in TC has to be used for REAL.

You can train the soldier, but you never know how he'll react till his head is getting near shot off.

DAM it - I'm not comparing WAR to NFL football.

In fact, I see litle difference bet. Colledge and MOLL in gbpackfan's nice set of Stat's. We have two more preseason games . . . and look out.

Next up . . .can kick OUR ass !!!

Is Carson Palmer going to have to be ready in TC? Good story there. I will get on it.

[the_idle_threat]

I don't see the problem with Moll winning the guard spot over Colledge. From what I've read, it sounds like Moll is plenty talented and he has that great intangible attitude to play interior line. He just suprised some people by being more ready to play than anticipated, given his background. He isn't going to be perfect, but there will be growing pains regardless of who we throw in there. Some have said we should put the veteran "Mookie" in there, but that guy gave up 2 sacks in Saturday's otherwise good game, and on top of that he's injury-prone ... so we'll be right back to where we are today at some point in midseason.

Is Colledge a failure because he was expected to fill that spot but lost out to Moll? Well ... yes and no. On one hand it's a setback for him and a change of plans. It would have been nice to give Moll the practice time in OTAs with the starters if he was going to end up there. But on the other hand, comparisons to Mike Wahle are spot on. Some guys take a little longer to develop than others. Nothing I've read about Colledge implies or states that he's less talented than we thought ... it's just that he hasn't been as quick to pick up playing guard as his immediate competitor. If he remains a backup and develops into a good tackle with the potential to take over after Cliffy hangs 'em up, he'll be well worth a #2 pick.

I don't understand why people are so quick to throw the G.M. under the bus when things don't work out perfectly and immediately. Best laid plans almost always go awry, and you just roll with the punches. In this case, we might end up way ahead of the plan if Moll & Spitz can nail down the guard jobs, leaving Colledge to develop into an eventual starting tackle. Years from now, we might be talking about this as one of the best drafts in Packer history if we get 3 starting offensive linemen out of it ... in addition to 2 star linebackers and a starting WR.

[woodbuck27]

It's all good!

Moll-Colledge. Colledge-Moll. Who really cares as long as OUR QB and RB's don't get mauled.

Could all three of the Offensive Lineman selected in Aprils Draft, be eventual starters? Sure they can. You mention OUR new WR Greg Jennings.

I love Will Blackmon (I predict he'll be very good) and arguably OUR best player on "D", considering both preseason games was S Tyrone Culver. DE Dale Tollefson and DT Johnny Jolly have been showing well of late. They may come on for a push to make OUR Roster.

Then (Yes . . . I forgot to mention) there's HAWK and HODGE. WOW !!

An outstanding Draft by Ted Thompson and OUR Scouting Dept.

Looking GREAT !! We are really discussing semantics.

WE won't hang Ted in efigy because Colledge gets moved to backup LT or Tackle. Some of us might want to hang Ted if Favre takes unusual punishment again this season and. . . FALLS.

GO PACKERS ! PROTECT FAVRE TED !!

[gbpackfan]

Thanks Woodbuck (and the rest of you gave me "props")

[Scott Campbell]

Those of you wanting to rip Ted a new one for the College pick need to remember to kiss Ted's butt in the Jennings threads. Fair is fair.

[Bretsky]

Those of you wanting to rip Ted a new one for the College pick need to remember to kiss Ted's butt in the Jennings threads. Fair is fair.

Point well taken Scott; I didn't fall in love with either pick as I really liked Chad Jackson. And it looks like I was really wrong.

[vince]

I respect the TT detractors' opinions. His unconventional approaches leave himself open to criticism... but some people appear to be so invested in ripping Ted Thompson that they don't see the forest through the trees.

2 things led to our downfall last year...both of which Ted Thompson either has addressed or is doing a good job of building. And as much as we all want it to happen, football teams don't get rebuilt overnight!

1. Inherited salary cap problems led to the departure of both our all-pro caliber guards. The fact that we had little or no depth along the line meant that we had to scour the free agent market (with no cap space to sign quality people) and waiver wires to find replacements - an impossible proposition.

2. Injuries decimated the offensive skilled positions. When injuries decimated the team, a lack of depth once again (granted, no team is going to have 5 quality RB's on the roster) forced us to pluck guys off of other teams' practice squads to come here and play for us.

As for the draft, it's a little early yet, but the Packers appear to be on the cusp of having the MOST successful draft in the league, and maybe in all of DRAFT HISTORY.

There will be a plethora of first, second and third rounders that just don't pan out - for a number of reasons. My money's on Colledge NOT being one of them.

If he can come in his rookie year and be either a starter or a quality backup... That's a quality pick.

The fact that Jennings, Hawk, Spitz, and Hodge appear to be everything anyone hoped for and then some, and the fact that that the guy people expected to be a project is handling Pro-Bowl defenders also means they are QUALITY PICKS.

You guys that expect Ted Thompson to be a frickin clairavoyant, and hit a grand slam on EVERY SINGLE pick are being a little unrealistic, I'd say.

And to Woody...

Man you are a great roller coaster ride.... Sarcasm, Optimism, Pessimism, and Realism - all wrapped into each post...

[Scott Campbell]

One other thing to keep in mind is that he employed a draft strategy of trading down to accumulate more picks knowing full well that the draft is a crap shoot. He wanted more picks so that he could make more draft mistakes and still produce a quality number of contributors. More picks means more mistakes as well as more contributors. So there is no doubt that there will be draft mistakes.

Even though I'm talking about mistakes, I'm not close to writing off Daryn Colledge yet.

[MuttnJeff]

Colledge could certainly save our bacon as a backup OT; so could any other backup on our roster. But Teddy didn't draft him to be a backup on one of the worst OL's in football in 2005.

It really doesn't matter what Thompson intended 6 months ago. What matters is to try and move players to their best positions. You can't count on any rookie to be an immediate starter, maybe with exception of top 10 picks.

[Cobra Kai]

It really doesn't matter what Thompson intended 6 months ago. What matters is to try and move players to their best positions. You can't count on any rookie to be an immediate starter, maybe with exception of top 10 picks.

That's a good point. Sometimes it doesn't matter what position a draft choice was picked to play. What matters is that a coaching staff and the player are flexible enough (which doesn't always happen because of egos and/or poor coaches) to move to other positions that best help the team. They are doing that with the O-line, now if they could only do that with the LB's and get Barnett on the outside where he should be. And while they're at it, here's another suggestion, move Carroll to Safety. He's already a pretty solid talker and his coverage skills or lack there of will be less of a liability there...

[woodbuck27]

And to Woody...

" Man you are a great roller coaster ride.... Sarcasm, Optimism, Pessimism, and Realism - all wrapped into each post..." Vince

Your taking me back . . . to the Merry GO Round Vince.

Believe that !!

I'm really for Ted Thompson - RESULTS Chapter.

I just watched that 7 minute Falcons at Packers Highlights Video and Favre and Driver looked like "Oh MERCY - NFLN Division - LOOK OUT !!" We are coming at you.

A solid TEST coming this weekend. PACKERS - BENGALS

This joint will be tuned in for that Vince.

Let's see what we really have after that game. The Falcons "D" couldn't handle Donald Driver and Favre, and Brett had other options to go to Saturday night, Favre's is already focused, and that's not good for. . .
" the NFLNorth " opponents.

Just a preseason game, but LORDY, that was needed for this young and talent ridden team. Poor TED and the headaches he'll have, in regard to cuts. Can't keep em all, but some good one's will be cut, and that's all a testament to Ted Thompson and OUR Scouting and Player Department.

Prop's there!

I'm almost riding the Ted Thompson bandwagon, but is that my role as a Packer fan at PACKERRATS?

Bretsky, might say NO !??

Thanks for mentoring to me Vince.

GO PACKERS ! HOLD THE FAITH PACKER FANS !!

[Guiness]

MuttnJeff hit the nail on the head - doesn't matter what was intended. What matters is what we've got now, and what we're doing with it.

I also agree with earlier observations that Havel's article was fluff. But he's writting an opinion column, and I guess that's what he gave us. I just wish he'd put in at least one observation where he thought Colledge was too tentative.

Oh ya - props to gbpackfan for his analysis. Not necessarily to my taste, but the effort put into it was obvious.

Lastly - GregJennings, wtf was that??? I liked your original post, but there was no reason for a young buck like yourself to beat up on an (admitedly) out of shape old man

Seriously - they Polish Grail Rat voiced an opinion, and shouting him down is not what this place is all about 8-(

[pbmax]

Colledge ought to stay at left tackle
By Chris Havel

.....

THIS MAY BE RIGHT BUT I HATE THE CONTENTS HERE

IF Colledge can't play OG, TEDDY Botched this pick. He was slated as the OG starter from day one and a 4-12 team in desperate need of OG help doesn't use a 2nd round draft pick for a backup at one of the few positions that we have an excelling starter at.

Clifton is still one of the better OT's in the game, as is Tauscher.

The Packers coaching staff needs to help him develop as an OG, and if he doesn't have the ability to play there then TT Blew It.


B

C'mon Bretsky, did Wolf blow the Wahle pick because he had to switch positions tofind success?

[pbmax]

Whoops, jumped the thread and Harvey had beaten me to this nugget of 20/20 hindsight. Apologies.

In any event, I am only concerned if Colledge can't contribute. Then I am concerned only as far as it impacts getting 2 starting contributors on average each year.

If Colledge becomes misplaced at Guard but Moll can be sufficient, then TT is ahead of the curve because he has upgraded both talent and depth.

Remember his anchor and strength were both things people were concerned about before the draft. Wahle could also struggle with his anchor and bull rushers.

A year in the weight program could easily be all that he needs.