2014 Free Agency Rumors and or Speculation

[wist43]

Wist43...Don't allow these deluded Homers to get to you. Watch your health...their not worth taxing that Packer fan.

Of course your right. You've always been right and you'll be right until the Green Bay Packers ever get around to replacing Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy. . .; .thus EXIT stage (finally he's left) Dom Capers.

We simply have to be patient as soon TT and MM will be gone.

When it comes to the 2-4, and how Capers misuses the personnel TT has given him - yeah, I know I'm right. It's right there on the screen for everyone to see - and the statistics bear me out.

As for TT and MM, I don't want those guys gone... but I do want them to get in Capers face, and force him to start using the personnel appropriately. If Capers won't, which he won't, he has to go. I would already have fired him, but then again, I would have put my foot down about the 2-4 and the dismal results it was producing a long time ago.

As others have noted, Capers has a track record of coming to a new team - straightening out the mess he inherited, and then making a new mess of his own design - which predictably leads to his firing. Well, we're at that firing stage here in Green Bay, but TT and MM haven't done anything about the mess Capers created, they just keep whistlin dixie.

[Zool]

If you disagree with a loud shouting guy, you're a homer. I've said this many times. You don't even have to have a counter argument, just call someone out on something stupid they've said and you're instantly a know-nothing homer while the shouting guy is Bellichick 2.0

[run pMc]

Diggin the vibes in this thread right now.

Yeah, pretty awesome.
I'd comment on the 2-4 but will pass. (wrong thread)
I will mention that stops on 3rd/4th down are more important IMHO than yds/play. Any offense could methodically march down the field with 4 yard dump offs to the RB, quick screens to the WR and outs to the TE which would make your pass defense look pretty good on a yd/play avg...but if the defense can't get off the field it doesn't matter. Wins matter and that happens by scoring points.

Back to Free Agency Rumors, any info on Vance Walker? Is he any good? He's listed at 6-2" 305, so he's squatty for a DE.
Will we have to wait until next week for TT to sign someone?

[Packers4Glory]

sure hope Hyde can make the transition to safety.

[wist43]

If you disagree with a loud shouting guy, you're a homer. I've said this many times. You don't even have to have a counter argument, just call someone out on something stupid they've said and you're instantly a know-nothing homer while the shouting guy is Bellichick 2.0

Take issue with the breakdown of the numbers ayn posted then - and get the plank out of your eye.

I gave a far different interpretation of the plays that ayn posted - I think my analysis holds up far better than his. Instead of uselessly running your mouth, why don't you take issue with the analysis I provided??

[pbmax]

Of those 7 plays on 1st and 2nd down, we gave up 4 first downs, 115 yds, and had 1 sack.

That's an average of 16.43 yds/play on those downs.

Are you seriously going to argue those stats should be regarded as successful?? And that I'm in "denial", and in an "uncomfortable place" in arguing that this alignment, as played by Capers is junk??

Who's in denial??

1+10 90-79; 25 y pass to Davis (85)
2+5 27 yard pass to 81
2+13 52 sack, -5
2+10; 79-90 (hyde on run blitz from left end), Run for 1 yard
1+10; 96-98; pass for 31 to (81) blown coverage on right sideline
2+9; 76-98; pass for 36 to (85)
2+13; 90-79; run for 0 yards


Pass plays on 2-4, on first and second down: 119 yards - 5 yd sack = 114 yards net

Run plays in 2-4 on first and second down: 001 yard

Well, this is the confusion right here. I thought all along wist thought the 2-4 was too soft and small and prone to be run against. What he was ACTUALLY complaining about was the pass defense in nickel 2-4.

[Zool]

Take issue with the breakdown of the numbers ayn posted then - and get the plank out of your eye.

I gave a far different interpretation of the plays that ayn posted - I think my analysis holds up far better than his. Instead of uselessly running your mouth, why don't you take issue with the analysis I provided??

I rarely take issue with your game analysis, only your treatment of people who disagree with you. You and I are usually pretty close to the same opinions on players and whatnot. (remember Nick Barnett?) I myself choose to not assume I'm 100% correct because I'm a football fan and realize I have limited knowledge. I pointed out a few weeks ago that the Patriots run a large amount of 2-4 and that their D was almost as bad as the Packers D in 2011 yet no one is calling for Bellichick's head. This is my point. We know about exactly fucking nothing compared to these guys. I'd like Capers gone yesterday but shouting it in every post I make on this messageboard does not make me sound smart. It makes me sound like a lunatic with a vengeance. McCarthy said a couple years ago he wanted a bend but don't break D that causes a lot of turnovers. That's a very apt description of Capers' scheme over his career and even LeBeau's version in Pitt right now. They give up yards, but not a lot of points while causing a large number of turnovers.

I even stated early in the offseason that it looks more like our personnel is shifting to a 4-3 group of front 7 players.

[denverYooper]

When it comes to the 2-4, and how Capers misuses the personnel TT has given him - yeah, I know I'm right.

[red]

and here come the numbers i've been waiting for

aqib talib, who signed that "monster" long term contract that included 26 million "guaranteed"

well, only 11.5 million is actually guaranteed. it includes a 5 million dollar signing bonus, a 2million dollar roster bonus this year, and a fully guaranteed 2014 salary of 4.5 million

his 2015 and 2016 are guaranteed for injury only, and he has to be on the roster on the third day of the league year to get them

the broncos could cut him after this season if things don't work out and actually gain cap space.

his 2014 take home pay would be 11.5 million, less then sam shields

he he stays with the team for 2015, it will be a 2 year 17 million dollar deal or 8.5 million per year, less then sam shields

[Zool]

1+10 90-79; 25 y pass to Davis (85)
2+5 27 yard pass to 81
2+13 52 sack, -5
2+10; 79-90 (hyde on run blitz from left end), Run for 1 yard
1+10; 96-98; pass for 31 to (81) blown coverage on right sideline
2+9; 76-98; pass for 36 to (85)
2+13; 90-79; run for 0 yards


Pass plays on 2-4, on first and second down: 119 yards - 5 yd sack = 114 yards net

Run plays in 2-4 on first and second down: 001 yard

Well, this is the confusion right here. I thought all along wist thought the 2-4 was too soft and small and prone to be run against. What he was ACTUALLY complaining about was the pass defense in nickel 2-4.

Until the safety play improves, it really doesn't matter if they play a 0-6-5. I could complete a pass with McMillian/Doc Jennings/Banjo(sorry PB)/Bigby/Manuel on the field.

Edit: Peprah/Bush/Anthony Smith/Rouse. Geeze that's bad when you look back. Collins and Burnett would have been a good combo I suppose, but no good backup plan for injuries.

[wist43]

1+10 90-79; 25 y pass to Davis (85)
2+5 27 yard pass to 81
2+13 52 sack, -5
2+10; 79-90 (hyde on run blitz from left end), Run for 1 yard
1+10; 96-98; pass for 31 to (81) blown coverage on right sideline
2+9; 76-98; pass for 36 to (85)
2+13; 90-79; run for 0 yards


Pass plays on 2-4, on first and second down: 119 yards - 5 yd sack = 114 yards net

Run plays in 2-4 on first and second down: 001 yard

Well, this is the confusion right here. I thought all along wist thought the 2-4 was too soft and small and prone to be run against. What he was ACTUALLY complaining about was the pass defense in nickel 2-4.

That's only one of my complaints about the alignment; the complaint next in line would be that it presents a very limited pass rush look; and if you have the fat guys in there at DT, and don't blitz someone else - you're basically looking a 2 man pass rush, b/c the fat guys, at least our fat guys, can't collapse the pocket.

Combine that with the fact that 2 of our "4" in the 2-4 look, are 2 of our most pedestrian defenders - Hawk and Jones... neither of whom can rush the passer to save their lives. So right there, the way Capers uses the personnel - 4 of the 6 players in the front are incapable of generating any pass rush.

There's no shortage of criticism that can be leveled at Capers and the 2-4. Maybe a team like the Niners, who have all-pro personnel throughout their front, can get away with running that alignment, but certainly not the Packers the way Capers runs it.

[pbmax]

I will mention that stops on 3rd/4th down are more important IMHO than yds/play.

This.

Bad run defense has gotten this team into trouble, but its been bad in base and sub with some notable exceptions for a 3 years now. This prevents Capers from getting into preferred alignments on longer yardage down and distance situations. This is not good.

However, the larger issue, as the San Fran game pointed out, was that the pass defense has hemorrhaged yardage in big plays for quite a while and no longer gets INTs to end drives. That is partially, perhaps mostly, a result of the backend defenders being injured, old (Woodson), young or terrible safety play. But its also generating a controlled pass rush when you face a team that can run and pass and chooses to pass.

When McCarthy says (or at least Silverstein reports it as his desire) he wants to be able to generate a pass rush from taller more athletic DEs, he means he wants someone on the field besides his LBs to provide the pass rush. Daniels and Neal were OK at this last year, but neither played regularly in base (until Jolly got injured and Daniels subbed in). Pickett at nose, Raji at DT, Jolly or Wilson at DE weren't getting it done. Wist says ( I would argue rightly) that there is talent on this team. However, there is not the talent they need to play base and pass rush effectively.

[wist43]

Until the safety play improves, it really doesn't matter if they play a 0-6-5. I could complete a pass with McMillian/Doc Jennings/Banjo(sorry PB)/Bigby/Manuel on the field.

To which, I think all of us have argued a variety of remedies to address the mess in the back end. If the players aren't communicating properly - and that is what is going on more often than getting beat physcially - then that comes back to Capers, again.

If the guys back there are a bunch of retards, or if they're so wet behind the ears that they don't understand what they're doing - then it is on Capers to simplify things to the point where they can understand it, and at least not be busting coverages every 3rd play.

[Zool]

To which, I think all of us have argued a variety of remedies to address the mess in the back end. If the players aren't communicating properly - and that is what is going on more often than getting beat physcially - then that comes back to Capers, again.

If the guys back there are a bunch of retards, or if they're so wet behind the ears that they don't understand what they're doing - then it is on Capers to simplify things to the point where they can understand it, and at least not be busting coverages every 3rd play.

I'd be happy with only every 3rd play right now. It seems there's always someone running free somewhere. Not like bad coverage, but just no coverage at all. There's too little pass rush to compensate for the terrible secondary play.

[pbmax]

That's only one of my complaints about the alignment; the complaint next in line would be that it presents a very limited pass rush look; and if you have the fat guys in there at DT, and don't blitz someone else - you're basically looking a 2 man pass rush, b/c the fat guys, at least our fat guys, can't collapse the pocket.

Combine that with the fact that 2 of our "4" in the 2-4 look, are 2 of our most pedestrian defenders - Hawk and Jones... neither of whom can rush the passer to save their lives. So right there, the way Capers uses the personnel - 4 of the 6 players in the front are incapable of generating any pass rush.

There's no shortage of criticism that can be leveled at Capers and the 2-4. Maybe a team like the Niners, who have all-pro personnel throughout their front, can get away with running that alignment, but certainly not the Packers the way Capers runs it.

It has been your main complaint about the alignment.

If there is a risk of pass, such as the San Fran game, you have to have Hawk and Jones in there instead of another lineman and trusting Matthews or Perry to cover. Not to say you could not mix it up, play zone or zone blitz, but putting Matthews regularly in coverage is only using his third best skill.

The problem is that the Packer have more 3 down LBs than 3 down lineman.