2020 Wide Receivers

[GB-Brandon]

This says it all. You are a total monday morning QB who doesn't have time to respond to JHs point, but has plenty of time to bitch and moan non stop.

I on the other hand loved TT and defended him often. I also have been extremely anti Gutes so far. I think we reversed course. Great GM horrible coach. Now we have horrible GM great coach. But I'm a realist and am aware of my table image. We won 13 games and made the NFCC last year with a new offense and a rookie head coach. Thats impressive unless you are a whiny bitch that thinks you are entitled to 4 Owls every 5 years. If we have a horrible year and Gutes picks continue to not impress then I was right. If we have a great year and Gary steps up and Tonyan and Jace step up then Gutes is putting a winner on the field. If fat mike wins 14 games next year in dallas with that loaded roster he is a better coach than I gave him credit for. My guess is jason garrett like results.

Lets not get crazy here. TT regressed quite a bit the last few years and more then likely it had to do with his condition. It was not the same TT.

Yes, they had a successful season. The concern is the moves or lack of moves made to actually improve on that season.

4 out 5 years? Maybe a little overboard here? It's been since 2010 and could get a lot longer.

[pbmax]

I'll take a TE to unlock the offense like KC or SF. Bit I am not sure he is here.

Stormbringer might be the answer, I don't know.

I do know they needed some depth and development at WR. Whether such a pick makes a difference this year, even in first round, hard to say. Much depends on those already on roster.

[GB-Brandon]

Well...you are because you keep trying to compare a 5'9" speedster like Tyreek Hill to a 6'5" mauler like Kelce. You say our WR suck. Then you want to use TE as the reason why. Thats the apples to oranges. What you really mean is we don't have the WEAPONS that KC has. Then you must include Jones who was better than any RB KC had last year and the weapons are back to even.

The truth is that KC had it come together last year. Maholmes at his best with enough weapons to work with and all being in the same system for years. Andy Reid arguably designs the best offense in the game, and next would be Shannahan. They played in the big game. We were year one with Flower and just maybe we get better in year 2.

Were stuck living and dying with these guys and hoping for the best. I like how PB put it earlier with a different player. The Chiefs are paying Sammy Watkins 9 million this year. Other then Adams what salary would any of our WR's command on the open market? Some might not even get picked up let alone paid anything of real significance.

That's right. "60-1 Ponies" These odds don't usually work out well.

[GB-Brandon]

Your coming off a 14-4 season and the NFC Champ Game and you have all these "Unknown's" at your areas of your two biggest needs along with pissing off your franchise QB. To me that just isn't smart practice. In fact I find it to be unacceptable. Something is lurking and it doesn't feel right.

[GB-Brandon]

Can you have a top 5 WR in the entire league while being so horrible everywhere else as to drop to 26? Doesn't having your #1 WR being better than 27 other teams warrant you finishing ahead of at least 15 of them?

Not when the rest of bunch is considered mediocre at best. Its also very dangerous to play this game where it all hinges on Adams. There were plays last year where he was triple covered. That's how little respect the rest of the guys get.

[GB-Brandon]

I'll take a TE to unlock the offense like KC or SF. Bit I am not sure he is here.

Stormbringer might be the answer, I don't know.

I do know they needed some depth and development at WR. Whether such a pick makes a difference this year, ben in first round, hard to say. Much depends on those already on roster.

Every team in the league would but as the draft has shown they are hard to hit on. That ship has sailed for the Packers. Much better chance the last few years being able to get a high quality receiver and the Packers passed on a lot of them.

[GB-Brandon]

I can see it now. 3rd down conversions wont be consistent. Guys wont be able to get open other then Adams beating double coverage sometimes. The camera will focus in on Rodgers face and he will be rolling his eyes and making smirks. Fans will get mad and say Rodgers has completely regressed and has a bad attitude etc etc. People will start talking and chirping about Love.

Disaster!!! It's almost like a set up job.

[GB-Brandon]

Well...you are because you keep trying to compare a 5'9" speedster like Tyreek Hill to a 6'5" mauler like Kelce. You say our WR suck. Then you want to use TE as the reason why. Thats the apples to oranges. What you really mean is we don't have the WEAPONS that KC has. Then you must include Jones who was better than any RB KC had last year and the weapons are back to even.

The truth is that KC had it come together last year. Maholmes at his best with enough weapons to work with and all being in the same system for years. Andy Reid arguably designs the best offense in the game, and next would be Shannahan. They played in the big game. We were year one with Flower and just maybe we get better in year 2.

Well since you want to get down to the "Nitty Gritty" they could run the ball when they wanted to. Obviously Jones is better and also in the passing game but the Chiefs averaged "per carry' pretty much on the same mark on the ground.

CARRIES
11140th
RUSHING YARDS
49836th
RUSHING TOUCHDOWNS
5T-24th
YARDS / CARRY
4.5

Jones averaged 4.6 so its not like Williams is some scrub.

[GB-Brandon]

Comparing the offensive firepower between the Packers and the Chiefs is like comparing a Ford Explorer to a Ferrari.

I think we know who the Ford Explorer is.

[Zool]

Well then why do you think they belong in the top 10 in the league? Why are ours horrible? This thread is about the WR position and honestly KCs is marginally better than ours.

Pass catching unit as a whole, they are pretty damned good. Show me where I said ours is horrible. All I said was KC has to be in conversation for best.

[Zool]

Well since you want to get down to the "Nitty Gritty" they could run the ball when they wanted to. Obviously Jones is better and also in the passing game but the Chiefs averaged "per carry' pretty much on the same mark on the ground.

CARRIES
111 - 40th
RUSHING YARDS
498 - 36th
RUSHING TOUCHDOWNS
5T-24th
YARDS / CARRY
4.5

Jones averaged 4.6 so its not like Williams is some scrub.

Took me a minute to figure out what you were saying. I updated the numbers.

[GB-Brandon]

This should end the discussion. Guys running open everywhere. Matt Moore beat the Vikings with these guys and almost beat the Packers.

[RashanGary]

Aaron Rodgers - poor first camp but everyone knew he was sitting
Aaron Jones - I don't get this one, he was obviously the best back on the roster even when hurt - it showed all of camp
Jace Sternberger - he was hurt
Davante Adams - don't get this one either, was a great 3rd WR as a rookie
Zadarius Smith - dunno
Kenny Clark - played well, wasn't dominating until late. Got better as rookie season progresses. Compare him to Mt Adams or Keke.
Kevin King - was hurt otherwise looked fine

You can make a case Lazard showed just as much as any of these guys is the point. They showed something and then got a lot better and more consistent. Lazard could too. A lot of guys get better after their first 10 games. It's not uncommon.

[GB-Brandon]

You can make a case Lazard showed just as much as any of these guys is the point

I understand you love Lazard and that's cool. My thing is I don't understand what you really expect Lazard to be or your vision of him. Do you see the second coming of Jordy Nelson? I am trying to figure out what your seeing here cause I want to see it.

Yeah he came in the Detroit game and Rodgers put a ball on him and he caught it and beat a shitty corner in Tevin Coleman and had a half step on him. Still credit to Lazard for coming in and making that play to help the Packers win the game. He had a nice TD against the Giants and another nice catch in that game. Another nice conversion in Detroit. Nothing earth shattering here. Nothing that just pops off on film where your like wow this guy could be something special.

Now this isn't to say that he can't develop into something but after re-watching some specific film last few nights I see some limitations that are concerning. He isn't very twitchy or explosive(at least on film) and he can struggle with separation at times in and out of cuts. I don't see him running away from people and certainly not someone that would be a major threat after the catch. I am not seeing high end consistent explosive play potential. I'm seeing a guy that you can plug in a pinch. At least at this time I really believe he would be in over his head as a down in down out no.2

So with all this said I am not counting him out. He is young and from everything I can gather he is an extremely hard worker so all the "intangibles" are there. Him and Rodgers seem to like each other which is a plus but lets not ignore needed talent over friendship. I would really much rather like him as a guy that is kind of waiting in the wings for another year so that can maybe overcome some of these things with hard work. I definitely think he is a guy worth developing that can come in and in certain situations give some production. I'm not seeing on film what we need at this time. I think if this is the plan the Packer are asking for a massive jump. I will use Adams as an example. You go watch his rookie tape and he has that film where you go "WOW! This guy could be something special". Adams also was doing things very early in camp his rookie year where you would go "WOW". Lazard just doesn't appear to be quite on that level yet.

So basically that is where i get back to the final analysis that I am not comfortable with this being the big option. If we were rebuilding then fine, give him reps. If were really trying to contend for a Super Bowl we need better at this time.

[RashanGary]

More Mike Evans than Davante Adams....