Vick goes to court today....

[Freak Out]

If you think he will serve his entire sentence, you are out of your mind. He spend a year in prison TOPS out of what he is actually sentenced.

There could be a lot of poop shoot violations in one year. Maybe there will still be justice for Rastak, a rough justice.

Not a chance in hell. His $$$$ saves him from becoming a pillow biter.

[Rastak]

Looks like the prosecutors are recommending 18-36 months. This sounds about right given the fact he's the ring leader according to the other three
criminals he went into business with.

From PFT.com

NEGOTIATIONS CONTINUE?

Though it appears that Mike Vick has opted not to plead guilty to pending federal conspiracy charges, CNN suggests that talks are ongoing.

Per CNN, the pending offer recommends a prison term of 18-36 months. Vick's lawyers are holding out for a recommended term of less than a year. Regardless, Judge Henry Hudson will have the final say on this.

CNN also reports that the Vick camp is hoping to hear from the NFL on Monday about the potential impact of a guilty plea on Vick's playing career. However, the league previously has indicated that it will not make such commitments in connection with the plea discussions.

[Partial]

Vick took a plea deal. Didn't he originally say he had nothing to do with dog fighting?

[Rastak]

Yea, he lied......

POSTED 2:32 p.m. EDT; UPDATED 2:39 p.m. EDT, August 20, 2007

VICK ADMITS GUILT

The Virginian-Pilot reports that Michael Vick has accepted a plea deal on federal conspiracy charges. But it's more than just a guilty plea. Vick is admitting that he did it. A statement from lawyer Billy Martin reads as follows:

"After consulting with his family over the weekend, Michael Vick ask that I announce today that he has reached an agreement with Federal prosecutors regarding the charges pending against him. Mr. Vick has agreed to enter a plea of Guilty to those charges and to accept full responsibility for his actions and the mistakes he has made. Michael wishes to apologizes again to everyone who has been hurt by this matter. The legal team and Mr. Vick will appear in court in Richmond on August 27th."

It's a far cry from Martin's initial statements regarding the case from July 23, when Martin had this to say: "You all heard and saw that this was the first step from Michael in proving his innocence. The indictment contains mere allegations."

In our view, Vick came clean because he realizes that there's no way he can ever return to the NFL without securing redemption, and that there can be no redemption without contrition.

The broader question is whether redemption is even available with contrition. Should he get credit for telling the truth only after it was clear that there was no way out? We don't think so.

It's unclear whether the deal includes any type of commitment from the NFL as to Vick's possible suspension, or any commitment from authorities in Virginia regarding possible charges for animal cruelty arising from eight dogs that were killed on Vick's property in April 2007, the same month in which Vick told the Commissioner that there was no dog fighting on his Surry County, Virginia property. If Vick's formal plea documents include an admission that he participated in the killings of the dogs, he's certain to face even more jail time in Virginia, where the total penalty will be up to 40 years.

The plea will be entered on August 27, at 10:30 a.m. EDT.

[packinpatland]

Shouldn't lying at least get you a 'soap in the mouth washing'?

[Rastak]

Shouldn't lying at least get you a 'soap in the mouth washing'?

Yea, he probably should. Here his lawyers were talking about how they were looking forward to clearing his name, then they turn around and say "yes, he did it".


Nice.

[Patler]

I think you see my point: Vick should be punished because he violated principles that were layed down in law. (the principle being that it is wrong to cause animals to suffer unnecessarily.) His punishment should not be determined by the degree of public outrage, but by the amount of suffering he caused.

Actually, one of the principles behind criminal punishment IS to satisfy the demands of society, in addition to punishing the wrongdoer, "satisfying" the victim and deterring others. So yes, factoring in public outrage is appropriate. Particularly in a case such as this that has no specifically identifiable human victim. Society is the victim, and retribution is ours.

[Patler]

Back to Vick: Vick is a pretty bad case, I agree he needs some serious punishment. But it has to be tempered by how other people are treated. I say 1 year TOPS in prison for the animal rights portion of his crime. Maybe 6 months. I've seen cases locally where people kept large numbers of animals and allowed them to starve to death. They got a couple months in jail, and a court order to stay away from all animals.

I don't have a clear opinion about animal rights, I'm a little confused. I'm for hunting and brats. I just think whatever policy we decide on ought to be applied uniformly to ALL incidents of gratuitous suffering by animals.

There is a lot of difference between Vick, who intentionally tortured animals apparently for the thrill of watching them suffer and die, and someone who through ignorance, poverty or whatever lacks the ability to care for the animals they have.

Correlating it to humans, the ones you describe are more like manslaughter or some lesser degree of homicide. Many do not intend or even wish for the suffering and death of their animals. Vick's was more like 1st degree or intentional homicide. He intended to kill them in terrible ways.

Punishing one significantly more than the other is fair and just.

[Brohm]

It will be interesting to see what jail time Vick gets. Remember the dog fighting/inhumane treatment of animals is the nastiest headline but probably the most minor (in legal terms) of the offenses. They got mulitple interstate violations involving conspiracy/illicit gambling/transport of said animals across state lines for said illicit gambling. What was the final count? 90? (really I don't remember). Oh yeah now let's tack on the additional charges for abusing/killing the dogs when he was done with the illegal transport/illegal dogfighting/illegal gambling.

That's where the 40 years came from...the grand total. That's a lot of soap bars (and whatever else) crammed where the sun don't shine.

[Kiwon]

It will be a while before the whole story comes out but I will be very interested to hear about two aspects of this case:

1. The transition from a state and local investigation to a federal one. The Feds stepped in after local officials never executed some search warrants and eventually let them expire. Does this indicate that some Surry county officials, police included, were attempting a cover-up?

It seems that the Feds were able to collect a mountain of evidence in a short period of time. Why couldn't state and local investigators do the same thing?

2. How much behind the scenes pressure, if any, did the NFL and its supporters put on prosecutors to get a plea deal done?

The case began in April as a drug investigation when the dog fighting activity came to light. Having guilty pleas from all four defendants by August (the preseason) is a boon for the NFL. April to August, 4 months, that's very fast.

Had this case gone to trial, it would have been ugly on so many levels and had the potential to really color the season. The continuing bad press is the last thing that the NFL would want.

One of the few things left is determining Vick's playing status. Does he get a lifetime ban or not. This decision could be the defining moment for Roger Goodell as NFL commissioner. He has the perfect chance to send a message to the other Michael Vicks out there and, more importantly, to the fans about the extent to which society will hold the NFL players accountable for their off-the-field behavior.

Are these athletes heroes and role models? Of course, they are. But will we then treat them as such and hold them accountable for their actions?

[Rastak]

It will be a while before the whole story comes out but I will be very interested to hear about two aspects of this case:

1. The transition from a state and local investigation to a federal one. The Feds stepped in after local officials never executed some search warrants and eventually let them expire. Does this indicate that some Surry county officials, police included, were attempting a cover-up?

It seems that the Feds were able to collect a mountain of evidence in a short period of time. Why couldn't state and local investigators do the same thing?

2. How much behind the scenes pressure, if any, did the NFL and its supporters put on prosecutors to get a plea deal done?

The case began in April as a drug investigation when the dog fighting activity came to light. Having guilty pleas from all four defendants by August (the preseason) is a boon for the NFL. April to August, 4 months, that's very fast.

Had this case gone to trial, it would have been ugly on so many levels and had the potential to really color the season. The continuing bad press is the last thing that the NFL would want.

One of the few things left is determining Vick's playing status. Does he get a lifetime ban or not. This decision could be the defining moment for Roger Goodell as NFL commissioner. He has the perfect chance to send a message to the other Michael Vicks out there and, more importantly, to the fans about the extent to which society will hold the NFL players accountable for their off-the-field behavior.

Are these athletes heroes and role models? Of course, they are. But will we then treat them as such and hold them accountable for their actions?

1. Not sure about a coverup but they certainly came off as idiots. It's possible they wanted to sweep in under the rug to avoid a legal battle a very rich man. The feds could care less HOW much money you have....they have more.

2. I doubt the NFL had much to do with this, although they benefit from not having the horrific details coming out of a trial.


The judge in this case is fairly heavy handed from what I read. He already warned the other two clowns that he reserved the right to depart upward due to the aggrevating circumstances and outragous conduct. Vick was running the show so I doubt he gets a lighter sentence. He'll be accountable.

[Freak Out]

I'm hearing now that Vick has NOT agreed to a deal just yet. Anyone else getting this?

[Rastak]

I'm hearing now that Vick has NOT agreed to a deal just yet. Anyone else getting this?

No, not hearing that at all. His attorney went on TV and stated he agreed. Where are you hearing this conflicting info?

[MJZiggy]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/2007-08-20-86403916_x.htm

http://www.ajc.com/wireless/content/sports/falcons/stories/2007/08/20/0921_vickticket.html

[Merlin]

Now that Vick reversed his lie, he will now become the "victim" in all of this. First it will be race and when that doesn't fly it will be because ge has ADD or some shit. You watch, this is all going to be a damn circus. "Poor Michael Vick thought the rules didn't apply to him and now look, he is suffering. Poor Michael Vick".

Mark my words...