Ahman!

[Bretsky]

That said, Ahman was also used less so his career has had better longevity. He has played in 14 more games, yet has 1100 less yards. He averages fewer yards/carry, has fewer touchdowns, etc.


Want to again point out while in Holmgren's doghouse his stats will show he played 30 games his first two years and had 329yds and one TD

Yards per carry are nearly identical
Touchdowns are nearly identical
Green has more TD's receiving and more receiving yards

Green's biggest years were all behind a great offensive line. Without that, he has shown to nothing more than an average back. Taylor creates things for himself because he has never had a great line.

I did use Ahmans first two years because that is when he had the most yards/carry.

It's not like Taylor played a lot his first couple of years, he missed 23 games in his 2nd and 3rd seasons.

The only players in NFL History to average more yards/carry are Barry Sanders, Jim Brown, OJ Simpson and Tiki Barber. Thats right, he is 5th in NFL history in yards/carry.

His rushing yards/game is 6th all-time in the NFL. The only players with higher averages of rushing yards/game are Barry Sanders, Jim Brown, Edgerrin James, Walter Payton, and Rodger Craig.

That is some pretty damn fine company if I do say so myself.

He, like so many other Jaguars, don't get any respect because they are in a small-market team that historically has been pretty bad.

Ahman Green has had 1,000 plus yards in 6 of his last seven years; if you want to penalize his production because of his OL I guess you can. Regardless he still averages only one tenth of a point less than Taylor and I don't discredit either Taylor (who had some good OL's to run behind) or Green due to the OL. Green was, and is, a dam good RB. And the numbers show they are very comparable.

Ahman Green had 60 rushing attempts, or LESS than two a game, in his first two years. Not fair to use those two years to water down his yards per game. In fact, 60 attempts doesn't even help his average yards per game much anyways.

Fred Taylor had huge numbers his first two years while Ahman had no opportunities. He did play a lot his first three seasons.

http://www.nfl.com/players/fredtaylor/profile?id=TAY220162

Compared to Green's 2 attempts per game and 60 total rushes in two years, Taylor had 419 attempts in years one and two. Tayler played 9 games in 1999 and 13 games in 2000 (year 3).

[HarveyWallbangers]

Ahman has been every bit as good as Fred Taylor. Plus, he's been more durable.

I will say that, right now, I'd probably take Fred Taylor. I don't see a huge dropoff with Taylor. With Ahman, there has been a dropoff.

Ahman is extremely underrated by some. FAST, POWER, MOVES. Great goalline back. Not a receiver in the Faulk class, but could catch the dumpoffs, flareouts, and screens well. Great pass protector. He did fumble a bit (a lot early in the season, seldom at the end of the season). He will be missed.

[Partial]

I disagree but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. They are different types of runners and imo Taylor has a knack for creating things himself where as Green needs help.

[LEWCWA]

Wow, i just asked if anyone saw him against the girls. He looked good and tough to me. I like the way he plays the game and think the Pack is going to miss him. He is a Packer in my book!

[retailguy]

Wow, i just asked if anyone saw him against the girls. He looked good and tough to me. I like the way he plays the game and think the Pack is going to miss him. He is a Packer in my book!

Too many people have to justify their comments about whether or not it was a good thing that GB got rid of him... Lots of not being able to see the "big picture".

[wist43]

I've always contended that we'll miss Green... now I'm hoping we desperately miss him - as I took him in the 7th round of one of my FF drafts last night.

Took Taylor with my next pick in the 8th round.

Shallow league, so they're my 2nd and 3rd backs. PPR/PPC league, so ya win thru the air in this one.

[SkinBasket]

haha, I heard that too. That must suck. His whole paycheck is just pissed away.

There was a time when spreading your seed was more animalistic. It was about being a dominate man with traits that are desirable to a woman. The dominate men would spread their seed to many women and so would go the natural ways of evolution. (the women selected the traits from the best men and the sexual desires that revolve around reproducing the strongest offspring went on like in the rest of the natural world as we know it) Now, the dominate men are taught and learned how NOT to spread their seed. Be it an athlete or a brilliant laywer or doctor. Men know the reprocussions (most do anyway) and the more you ahve to lose and the more desirable your traits are to this world, the more you keep it in your pants.

My whole point is that this child support thing is interrupting the natural chain of the fit surviving and spreading their seed in favor of the fit keeping in their pants adn the desirable traits dying off.

Why am I bringing this up? I don't know but it's a theory of mine, one that is probably already out there and I thought it related.

Yes, we've heard your "theory" before. To me it simply sounds like a way for you to justify not getting any ass. Then you get to claim you're simply one of your "super males" who's been trained by the sex ninjas to withhold their seed from the world. Of course, according to your "theory," when you finally trick a pony into standing still long enough for you (HINT: they like hay), you'll then have to admit that you lack the desirable male traits that you've evidently put so much thought into.


As far as green goes, if he stays healthy, which was a much larger question when we had to decide to resign him or not, then it looks like a bad decision. I'm just not convinced he makes it through 10 games this year.

[woodbuck27]

sorry !

[woodbuck27]

..........would you take the money to you're grave with you and never spend it..........

I don't think your analogy works. Much of the money that Ahman would have got will eventually be spent on another player(s). Or car in your example. So nobody will be riding a bike.

There is where TT can't be given an out.

If he banked 5 Grand for Ahman and that was his top dollar and The Texans pushed t outside of TT's ego boundry then TT had to get something equitable in terms of talent in return. IMO.

To hear him (TT) spout off on his confidence in what we had (slash) have at RB in Greens absence and nothing else brought in. Is like a neglectful stock portfolio manager failing to upgrade the portfolio to the standard expected by his client. Our position at RB in 2006 (with Green clearly as our finest RB) and a respected Packer as well. He was on the verge of setting records at his position, a long time top producer in our colors who was extremely valuable and had a loyal fan following and respect.

To see Ahman go over money and nothing done after that but play the carte blance card is 'the real suck'.

It's like going into a poker game for six, with five others at the table all buying in for a grand each, and TT the 6th player decides to play with $400.00 as his stake.

TT begins the game with a decisive advantage against him (NO compensating POWER).

His incompetence demonstrated in saying or standing on what he has remaining at RB is like the worlds worst poker player who trys a bluff tactic too soon into the game and too often before he's the first removed.

In other words TT has demonstrated clear stupidity in terms of our needs in the running game.

That's the proper word here. STUPID !

Man, you sure seem to hate the guy. I don't buy into any of this "ego" stuff. Just because you don't like what he's doing, it doesn't make the guy an egomanic. He certainly doesn't grab the microphone or preen for the cameras like an egomaniac.

You are also wrong about "nothing else brought in". He drafted 2 RB's. You could argue that Jackson and Wynne aren't good enough, but you can't say he didn't do anything. It's factually incorrect and makes you sound like an angry hater.

Baloney.

No ROOKIE could ever be expected to compensate the loss of Ahman in too many respects Scott.

Again I don't hate TT or feel that need for anyone of some measure of importance to me. The success of my team is much depended on the success of it's GM.

I believe that. The emotion of hatred if unfounded in anything but evil is weakness.

I'm a Christian Scott, so I don't choose to resort to such low or weak emotion.

[woodbuck27]

There is where TT can't be given an out.

If he banked 5 Grand for Ahman and that was his top dollar and The Texans pushed t outside of TT's ego boundry then TT had to get something equitable in terms of talent in return.

That is all well and good.

But WHO could Thompson have gotten that would've provided an equitable return in talent for a fair price? That is the point you are missing. Who did he fail to get that is tearing it up right now?

It isn't as easy to just pluck players out of thin air and make them a part of your roster as you make it out to be...it sounds like grocery shopping the way you put it. Guys available as free agents weren't wanted by another team for a reason. Guys who can be pursued via trade can often be as expensive as the guy you let go...and often aren't all that proven of commodities, especially in YOUR system.

I agree that Thompson should be taken to task if this group of RBs is a dud in 2007. However, I'm willing to let the season play out before I call Thompson stupid...because I really don't see a simple solution that he somehow overlooked.

Here . . .some options that TT flat out decided to clearly ignore,that does reflect his questionable ego.

The distressing part for Packers fans is that the running back position is shaping up to be to the 2007 Packers what the guard position was to the 2005 Packers: a total mess.

It is Thompson's responsibility to fill open positions, regardless of the circumstances. It is his job to recognize that Morency has a durability problem, that he probably won't get a shot at drafting California's Marshawn Lynch in the first round and that the options after Lynch weren't all that good.

It's his job to make sure the Packers don't fall into the same hole they did in '05 when they couldn't get anything done because their guards were so bad.

At this point, signing Tennessee free agent Chris Brown wouldn't have been such a bad option. Brown, an unrestricted free agent, was interested in signing with the Packers during the off-season, but talks never got off the ground and he wound up going back to the Titans for very little money.

Through three games, Brown is averaging 5.1 yards per carry and is in a heated race with LenDale White for the starting halfback job. Brown has a reputation for running too high and getting hurt, but at this point he'd look like a pretty good option for the Packers.

Jacksonville's LaBrandon Toefield was available, too. And he'll probably be available after the cutdown to 53. At this point, he'd be a viable option. He's not much of a breakaway threat and he's not going to make anyone forget Green, but he can pound it between the tackles.

Then there's San Diego's Michael Turner.

Comment woodbuck27:

It's very obvious to us at packerrats, that TT flat out decided to bank money and ignore options to go experience at RB. If our record suffers and that is in large part due to a lousy running game. Then it all falls on Ted Thomopson and he should be fired.

He's not going to change or grow into what we need as a GM. It's due certainly in part to his slowness to react to our neds and insure that the bases are at least attempted by him to be covered. He can't step up to the plate and today we sit on $15 Million below the CAP.

That is in our face, and on TT outrageous, given the way our running game will sputter. Toss the ace of spades down on our running game. It's dead on the beach before the swim begins.

Then TT has the balls to stand on this as the season he wants to win.

What a joke!! A joke on himself as it will play out. Bank on it.

He in that fantasy demonstrates foolishness and an utter deceit and advertises his incompetence in neon lights.

We deserve a lot more.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Here . . .some options that TT flat out decided to clearly ignore,that does reflect his questionable ego.

Whatever.

[woodbuck27]

Here . . .some options that TT flat out decided to clearly ignore,that does reflect his questionable ego.

Whatever.

It's now in our faces Harvey and time to seriously consider the negativity offered by TT towards our future as Packer fans.

How much longer do you Harvey (or any other Packer fans here) sit on TT's fence while more and more Packer fans see reality in failure with TT's ways and manners?

He set our team up to fail in 2007 with an exceedingly inept effort to secure for our needs.

He did nothing for us that could even marginally be conceived as positive for 2007.

[Zool]

Here . . .some options that TT flat out decided to clearly ignore,that does reflect his questionable ego.

Whatever.

It's now in our faces Harvey and time to seriously consider the negativity offered by TT towards our future as Packer fans.

How much longer do you Harvey (or any other Packer fans here) sit on TT's fence while more and more Packer fans see reality in failure with TT's ways and manners?

He set our team up to fail in 2007 with an exceedingly inept effort to secure for our needs.

He did nothing for us that could even marginally be conceived as positive for 2007.

I hate to play the other side of this, but what can you do to change it? He did not specifically set this team up to fail. No one is that stupid or arrogant. You might think he has designs on getting Favre out, but TT has been around enough to know that young QB's struggle.

You're more than entitled to your take on the matter, but do you really want to live with all that negativity?

[The Leaper]

He set our team up to fail in 2007 with an exceedingly inept effort to secure for our needs.

So far I've seen Brown and Toefield pointed out as possible options to "secure our needs".

How in the hell are either of those guys going to make a huge difference in this team?

Brown has often been criticized for his durability. Toefield and Turner would also have those questions since he isn't proven as a starter. They could have just as easily been in camp right now and hurt just like Morency or Jackson.

I'm sorry, I don't see how Thompson missed some golden opportunity to improve the team. He drafted a guy in the second round who has talent comparable to any of the above mentioned RBs along with already having a guy who seemed to have the talent to compete for the spot and also is as talented as the above mentioned QBs.

Did you want Thompson to keep 8 RBs on the roster? RBs get hurt...especially when they are fighting for spots in camp. It is easy for guys with nothing to prove to avoid injury. Our guys are getting nicked up fighting to get a job. That wasn't going to change regardless of what second/third tier guy Thompson brought in.

[MJZiggy]

It is Thompson's responsibility to fill open positions, regardless of the circumstances. It is his job to recognize that Morency has a durability problem, that he probably won't get a shot at drafting California's Marshawn Lynch in the first round and that the options after Lynch weren't all that good.

Seems to me that I read one of our stat geniuses post that Jackson's numbers are far superior to Lynch's so far, so that kinda blows the theory that the options after Lynch weren't good...and, funny, I don't recall Morency being continually injured...