Lost Season 4

[Partial]

I thought it was a great episode. Very revealing.

[Charles Woodson]

I have watched this show since the start in 2004 since the first week. For the first time ever I walked away with disappointment in an episode. Maybe it was more of the direction the storyline took. It was a decent episode but I dont like what Im seeing. I invested alot of time into this show and I expect more.

i agree, to me it seemed like a filler episode, dont get me wrong i thought it was pretty cool, but the fact that it revealed very little bothered me.

[red]

yeah, there was no kate what-so-ever in the episode

stroke ablility factor went waaaaaaaaaaay down this week

[oregonpackfan]

The time warp factor was something right out of Star Trek!

[MadtownPacker]

The time warp factor was something right out of Star Trek!

Yes and that is exactly my problem with the episode and the turn the story has taken.

[Fosco33]

A few things are clear - some we knew before...

the island was cloaked in electromagnetic shield of some sort to hide it - which desmond got a full brunt of when he turned the key

this caused his adverse effects

the new scientist was using tons of radiation and had side effects (memory loss) - and definitely met desmond in '96 but forgot (heck - he couldn't even recall 3 cards in a row). once desmond mentioned the island/etc - dude was probably searching for it for these 8 years (to '04) and took the notebook to help things along...

clearly there's only one way in/out of the island - meaning that all the planes/ships/etc must hit the right angle...

I liked the Blackrock book sold by Hanso to Penny's Dad - pretty interesting piece that some casual fan may overlook.

my new theory... all the survivors on the island have 'constants' - or connections with the pre crash world - probably to allow the mind to know where you're at

unknown - the pupils not dilating when you're out of balance - tons of episodes have closeup shots of peoples eyes

I'm glad they're finally giving some answers

[twoseven]

the new scientist was using tons of radiation and had side effects (memory loss) - and definitely met desmond in '96 but forgot (heck - he couldn't even recall 3 cards in a row).

GREAT OBSERVATION!

Others were leaning towards some kind of psychic twist, but this one looks much more appropriate to the story, memory loss and the inablity to retain new thoughts, especially important and ironic if what looks to be the most knowledgeable character concerning all of the science behind the island can't remember what he has learned about it. Every time he squints and murmurs to himself I imagine he is just perusing that big brain of his for the answers he needs, almost in an all-knowing manner. That he may also/instead be struggling to generate any thought at all based on past knowledge is a helluva speed bump and storyline twist..great catch fosco33!

[twoseven]

I liked the Blackrock book sold by Hanso to Penny's Dad - pretty interesting piece that some casual fan may overlook.

This is a bigger deal than it appears. Random thoughts about the Black Rock journal..

Hanso, unless I am remembering wrong, organized Dharma in the first place. Did the journal of the Black Rock lead them to find the island that Dharma inhabited, or did they find the journal on the Black Rock after Dharma was already on the island?

In the episode that shows the the helicopter pilot flashback, he was watching a search team video on TV of supposed oceanic 815 wreckage, he recognized that the pilot was not wearing a ring, disputed the validity of the wreckage being 815. The search team that filmed the footage of supposed 815 was actually searching for the Black Rock, it could have been on the island for close to 150 years.

We can tie either the Hanso Co. or Penny's father's company to the search efforts for the Black Rock that ended up stumbling onto what was claimed to be 815. My guess is Penny's father because Hanso had already found the island about 30 years earlier. The search team's footage of 815 came about 8 years after Penny's dad won the journal. The journal won in the auction would have probably led Penny's dad towards the island, or would have given him an idea as to where the island he may have already been looking for was located. What's potentially in that journal that could drive its owner to try and find or help locate the island..

The woman who was killed by Locke, Naomi, may be able to be tied to Penny's dad for the simple fact that she was toting around a picture of Desmond and Penny together for identification. Desmond got lost at sea competing in the trans global race that was organized by Penny's dad. Did he chart a course for the participants that would have steered them in the direction of the island, creepily using innocent people to search for it without them knowing?

We know Abadon (creepy black man) was above Naomi in organizing the 'team' to go to the island looking for something, probably Ben. So Abadon is possibly working for Penny's dad? My guess is only Penny's father or Penny herself could have supplied the photo that Naomi had. Season 3 finale, Penny had NO knowledge of 'the boat', so I would assume she did not supply the picture. Desmond confronts the chopper pilot at the end of 'the economist' and asks him if he knows Penny. He says no. Though he did refer to her as 'senior management.' Last mintues of last epsiode, Penny tells Desmond she knows about the island, has been searcing for him for three years, since 2001. So did she eventually go to her dad to find out about the island?

If Penny's father is at the head of this, might he be the other power player that has been going to extreme measures to locate Benjamin Linus? Miles Strraum, psychic medium asian guy, tells Ben 'you know who I represent and that he's gone to great lengths to find you.' Could Penny's dad have been the boss or 'the economist' that Sayid is after in the future? The woman that shot Sayid called her boss, said 'he'll never give us the name now. Ok, I'll bring him to you.' Weird that this boss would need a name if he's already after Ben. So what name is he looking for, and maybe he is just unaware that Sayid is kiling people for Ben. What is the relationship between Ben and Penny's father?

My head hurts.

[Charles Woodson]

the new scientist was using tons of radiation and had side effects (memory loss) - and definitely met desmond in '96 but forgot (heck - he couldn't even recall 3 cards in a row).

GREAT OBSERVATION!

Others were leaning towards some kind of psychic twist, but this one looks much more appropriate to the story, memory loss

Hey, i called that it was memory loss last episode

[Partial]

I think you guys are wrong, because he it is impossible that he knew they met in 96. That's not how the theory of time travel works. You can't go back in time and change an event without the future being changed, and with that being a significant event don't you think they'd remember? Further more, without Desmond meeting Dan and flying to the freighter would he have had to go back and meet Dan?!? To me, the answer is no.

I think the stuff started happening to Dan when they came to the Island. The guessing card thing was him jumping to the future like Desmond could do, but he was having a hard time controlling it.

[Fosco33]

I think you guys are wrong, because he it is impossible that he knew they met in 96. That's not how the theory of time travel works. You can't go back in time and change an event without the future being changed, and with that being a significant event don't you think they'd remember? Further more, without Desmond meeting Dan and flying to the freighter would he have had to go back and meet Dan?!? To me, the answer is no.

I think the stuff started happening to Dan when they came to the Island. The guessing card thing was him jumping to the future like Desmond could do, but he was having a hard time controlling it.

Why would he write that Desmond was his constant in his notebook then? It was simply memory loss.

He knew it was 96 in desmond's conscious and asked him to meet him there - it wasn't time travel but consciousness slippage.

[twoseven]

the new scientist was using tons of radiation and had side effects (memory loss) - and definitely met desmond in '96 but forgot (heck - he couldn't even recall 3 cards in a row).

GREAT OBSERVATION!

Others were leaning towards some kind of psychic twist, but this one looks much more appropriate to the story, memory loss

Hey, i called that it was memory loss last episode

Good job CW.

[Fosco33]

I liked the Blackrock book sold by Hanso to Penny's Dad - pretty interesting piece that some casual fan may overlook.

This is a bigger deal than it appears. Random thoughts about the Black Rock journal..

Hanso, unless I am remembering wrong, organized Dharma in the first place. Did the journal of the Black Rock lead them to find the island that Dharma inhabited, or did they find the journal on the Black Rock after Dharma was already on the island?

In the episode that shows the the helicopter pilot flashback, he was watching a search team video on TV of supposed oceanic 815 wreckage, he recognized that the pilot was not wearing a ring, disputed the validity of the wreckage being 815. The search team that filmed the footage of supposed 815 was actually searching for the Black Rock, it could have been on the island for close to 150 years.

We can tie either the Hanso Co. or Penny's father's company to the search efforts for the Black Rock that ended up stumbling onto what was claimed to be 815. My guess is Penny's father because Hanso had already found the island about 30 years earlier. The search team's footage of 815 came about 8 years after Penny's dad won the journal. The journal won in the auction would have probably led Penny's dad towards the island, or would have given him an idea as to where the island he may have already been looking for was located. What's potentially in that journal that could drive its owner to try and find or help locate the island..

The woman who was killed by Locke, Naomi, may be able to be tied to Penny's dad for the simple fact that she was toting around a picture of Desmond and Penny together for identification. Desmond got lost at sea competing in the trans global race that was organized by Penny's dad. Did he chart a course for the participants that would have steered them in the direction of the island, creepily using innocent people to search for it without them knowing?

We know Abadon (creepy black man) was above Naomi in organizing the 'team' to go to the island looking for something, probably Ben. So Abadon is possibly working for Penny's dad? My guess is only Penny's father or Penny herself could have supplied the photo that Naomi had. Season 3 finale, Penny had NO knowledge of 'the boat', so I would assume she did not supply the picture. Desmond confronts the chopper pilot at the end of 'the economist' and asks him if he knows Penny. He says no. Though he did refer to her as 'senior management.' Last mintues of last epsiode, Penny tells Desmond she knows about the island, has been searcing for him for three years, since 2001. So did she eventually go to her dad to find out about the island?

If Penny's father is at the head of this, might he be the other power player that has been going to extreme measures to locate Benjamin Linus? Miles Strraum, psychic medium asian guy, tells Ben 'you know who I represent and that he's gone to great lengths to find you.' Could Penny's dad have been the boss or 'the economist' that Sayid is after in the future? The woman that shot Sayid called her boss, said 'he'll never give us the name now. Ok, I'll bring him to you.' Weird that this boss would need a name if he's already after Ben. So what name is he looking for, and maybe he is just unaware that Sayid is kiling people for Ben. What is the relationship between Ben and Penny's father?

My head hurts.

I agree with this mostly. Miles can communicate with the dead - I don't think he's psychic. I think he was brought there to find Ben and Jacob. I wonder though - who was on the boat to open the locked door to the sick bay - did the producers let us conjure that it has to be a ghost or spirit... OR was it just some guy?

[Partial]

I think you guys are wrong, because he it is impossible that he knew they met in 96. That's not how the theory of time travel works. You can't go back in time and change an event without the future being changed, and with that being a significant event don't you think they'd remember? Further more, without Desmond meeting Dan and flying to the freighter would he have had to go back and meet Dan?!? To me, the answer is no.

I think the stuff started happening to Dan when they came to the Island. The guessing card thing was him jumping to the future like Desmond could do, but he was having a hard time controlling it.

Why would he write that Desmond was his constant in his notebook then? It was simply memory loss.

He knew it was 96 in desmond's conscious and asked him to meet him there - it wasn't time travel but consciousness slippage.

I don't understand what you're saying. I don't think it was shown whether it was previously written or if he wrote it then.

It was time travel, not consciousness slipping. Events changed in the past yet did not alter events in the future. Since something happened in the past than all of history from that moment moving forward should be reflective of that change, since the future did not happen yet.

Certainly, it is a weird topic and a weird episode.

[twoseven]

I think you guys are wrong, because he it is impossible that he knew they met in 96. That's not how the theory of time travel works. You can't go back in time and change an event without the future being changed, and with that being a significant event don't you think they'd remember? Further more, without Desmond meeting Dan and flying to the freighter would he have had to go back and meet Dan?!? To me, the answer is no.

I think the stuff started happening to Dan when they came to the Island. The guessing card thing was him jumping to the future like Desmond could do, but he was having a hard time controlling it.

Since when did Desmond physically travel in time? He was having an alternate consicence experience, not traveling physically through time. He was catatonic in front if Sayid, meanwhile his conscience is in 96', he was for all intents and purposes IN TWO PLACES AT ONCE, just only able to consciously participate in one at a time. Did Des' info from 04' Dan to 96' Dan change anything, or did it just speed things up? If 96' Dan would have figured out the .231 and 10Hz figures eventually Des' info didn't CHANGE anything, just accelerated it.