Allen to Vikings... "is close to being in place"

[motife]

This is the Vikings biggest trade since Herschel Walker, which sent Dallas to the Super Bowl and the Vikings to the dumpster.

WHY is Aaron Rodgers wearing #12? WHY haven't the Packers retired that number, worn by the GREAT Lynn Dickey??

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well, draft day will be fun:

The Packers will have made 6 picks by the time the Vikings make their 3rd pick.

Round 1, Pick 30 (30)
Round 2, Pick 25 (56)
Round 2, Pick 29 (60)
Round 3, Pick 28 (91)
Round 4, Pick 29 (128)
Round 4, Pick 36 (135)

Round 2, Pick 16 (47)
Round 4, Pick 18 (117)

It's not destined to fail, but giving up a 1st and two 3rds and $31M guaranteed for a guy who is one strike away from a one-year suspension is a huge risk. Basically, they gave that much for an Aaron Kampman with character issues.

I guess the moral of the story is that it's better to draft Aaron Kampman than be forced to trade for Aaron Kampman because of your inability to draft two solid DEs.

LOL, so that makes your draft day "fun"?

Why not? It's better than the Vikings have the 6 and the Pack being short on them. When I'm driving around listening to KFAN, they might devote less time on the Vikings.

[hoosier]

As far as what it would have costs to move up to get one of the top rated DE's, that would have been equally as silly of a move. We picked 16th last year and I don't think you trade Harrell, Jones, and Rouse for one player.

Thats a great comparison. When you look at it like that you have to wonder about the future.

Interesting comparison but it also assumes that the Vikings would have been capable of using their 2 and their two 3s wisely. Something tells me they wouldn't have gotten a Harrell, a Jones and a Rouse out of those three picks. Hell, the Packers wouldn't always get that.

[Rastak]

Well, draft day will be fun:

The Packers will have made 6 picks by the time the Vikings make their 3rd pick.

Round 1, Pick 30 (30)
Round 2, Pick 25 (56)
Round 2, Pick 29 (60)
Round 3, Pick 28 (91)
Round 4, Pick 29 (128)
Round 4, Pick 36 (135)

Round 2, Pick 16 (47)
Round 4, Pick 18 (117)

It's not destined to fail, but giving up a 1st and two 3rds and $31M guaranteed for a guy who is one strike away from a one-year suspension is a huge risk. Basically, they gave that much for an Aaron Kampman with character issues.

I guess the moral of the story is that it's better to draft Aaron Kampman than be forced to trade for Aaron Kampman because of your inability to draft two solid DEs.

LOL, so that makes your draft day "fun"?

Why not? It's better than the Vikings have the 6 and the Pack being short on them. When I'm driving around listening to KFAN, they might devote less time on the Vikings.

Well, I might ask why you drive around listening to the Vikings flagship station in the first place!

[red]

This is the Vikings biggest trade since Herschel Walker, which sent Dallas to the Super Bowl and the Vikings to the dumpster.

good point, this could be the boom or bust for the Minnesota vikings

he could save the team and help get them their new stadium that they need. or he'll sink them like the walker trade did. and that might be the final nail in minnesotas nfl coffin

[motife]

btw, the Packers had NO problem in pass blocking with Jared Allen this year when they played KC.

He's a very ordinary player, in my opinion.

[Tarlam!]

I hope this works out. I haven't loathed the Vikings since the "Culpepper to Moss" days, which I really miss, actually.

I want us to win the N-North, obviously, but, I want the other 3 teams to be capable, at least. That makes the victory so much more gratifying.

BTW, AP still scares me to fuckin' death!

[GoPackGo]

btw, the Packers had NO problem in pass blocking with Jared Allen this year when they played KC.

He's a very ordinary player, in my opinion.

the cowboys didn't have any problems pass blocking Kampman either. Do you think he's an ordinary player?

[Bossman641]

That Viking front 4 is gonna be terrifying. Who do you double when you have the Williams brothers and Allen lined up side by side? Still not sure about their offense at all and how far they can take that team, but I actually like the move for the Vikings. Will this lead to another offseason of the Vikings being crowned the paper champs?

[Scott Campbell]

Why not? It's better than the Vikings have the 6 and the Pack being short on them. When I'm driving around listening to KFAN, they might devote less time on the Vikings.

Well, I might ask why you drive around listening to the Vikings flagship station in the first place!

Probably for the same reason our GI's in Asia listened to Tokyo Rose during WWII. Or, maybe Harv is a spy.

[Lurker64]

This is a risky move for the Vikings, not necessarily a bad one, just a risky one. Here's what would worry me if was a Vikings fan:

1) There still exists a need at DE. Last year they needed a pass-rushing DE with Udeze doing a decent job as a run-stopping DE. They probably don't have Udeze this year, Erasmus James is a never-was-and-never-will-be, and none of the other guys they have are particularly spectacular, even if Allen is a good player.

2) There seems to be an odd tension on the Vikings team which has some aging top flight talent and some young players that the world is waiting on. Pat Williams, who's the key to the DL, is 35. Matt Birk who's key to the OL is 31 and on a contract year. Sharper is 32. It seems like this ought to be a win-now move while they still have Fat Pat on the DL, but there are enough question marks elsewhere on the roster that I wouldn't be sure Minnesota wouldn't be better off with three first day picks instead of Allen. They still need a DE, QB with eventual starting potential, the right side of an OL (maybe more considering the potential pending suspension of McKinnie), a WR (Berrian, Rice, and Wade aren't embarassing but the cupboard is bare after those guys), and likely a CB. Not to mention guys to eventually groom into replacements for their aging stars. I'm not convinced that Minnesota wouldn't be a better team this year and years to come with the three first day picks they gave up. The trade just seems to teeter tenuously on the "mortgaging the future" level.

3) Allen is a suspension risk. He's one saturday night away from missing a year. That has to make you worry if you're giving up 30m and 3 first day picks.

It's not necessarily a bad move, but it's a risky one. I almost think that if I were the GM and was confident in my squad I'd almost rather give up first round picks in 2009 and 2010 than what Minnesota traded. If you are confident that Allen will "put you over the top", 17 and the two thirds they gave up grade out to about the same as two late first round picks (26-27ish). You'd get this whole draft plus Allen to try to put you over the top this year and get into the playoffs and win a game putting you drafting late in the first and then you try to do it again next year.

It might be a great trade, but if I were a purple fan I would be a little uncomfortable. I know if my squad had just completed this trade, I would be excited but a little worried since this could be really bad if it doesn't work out well.[/i]

[HarveyWallbangers]

Well, I might ask why you drive around listening to the Vikings flagship station in the first place!

What should I listen to, MPR? I like sports. I live in Minnesota. I don't have a lot of choices. At least, I can get the Packers and Brewers games on 106.3 FM.

[HarveyWallbangers]

This is a risky move for the Vikings, not necessarily a bad one, just a risky one. Here's what would worry me if was a Vikings fan:

1) There still exists a need at DE. Last year they needed a pass-rushing DE with Udeze doing a decent job as a run-stopping DE. They probably don't have Udeze this year, Erasmus James is a never-was-and-never-will-be, and none of the other guys they have are particularly spectacular, even if Allen is a good player.

2) There seems to be an odd tension on the Vikings team which has some aging top flight talent and some young players that the world is waiting on. Pat Williams, who's the key to the DL, is 35. Matt Birk who's key to the OL is 31 and on a contract year. Sharper is 32. It seems like this ought to be a win-now move while they still have Fat Pat on the DL, but there are enough question marks elsewhere on the roster that I wouldn't be sure Minnesota wouldn't be better off with three first day picks instead of Allen. They still need a DE, QB with eventual starting potential, the right side of an OL (maybe more considering the potential pending suspension of McKinnie), a WR (Berrian, Rice, and Wade aren't embarassing but the cupboard is bare after those guys), and likely a CB. Not to mention guys to eventually groom into replacements for their aging stars. I'm not convinced that Minnesota wouldn't be a better team this year and years to come with the three first day picks they gave up. The trade just seems to teeter tenuously on the "mortgaging the future" level.

3) Allen is a suspension risk. He's one saturday night away from missing a year. That has to make you worry if you're giving up 30m and 3 first day picks.

It's not necessarily a bad move, but it's a risky one. I almost think that if I were the GM and was confident in my squad I'd almost rather give up first round picks in 2009 and 2010 than what Minnesota traded. If you are confident that Allen will "put you over the top", 17 and the two thirds they gave up grade out to about the same as two late first round picks (26-27ish). You'd get this whole draft plus Allen to try to put you over the top this year and get into the playoffs and win a game putting you drafting late in the first and then you try to do it again next year.

It might be a great trade, but if I were a purple fan I would be a little uncomfortable. I know if my squad had just completed this trade, I would be excited but a little worried since this could be really bad if it doesn't work out well.[/i]

Great points. My Vikings fan co-worker--who tends to keep an even keel--thinks the move is risky for the Vikings and he's not sure he likes it. He's one of the few in this market that feel that way. Here was my response to him.

You have a reasoned view of this deal. I'm not sure others share your view.

Trading a 1st, 3rd, and 3rd for a very good, young DE isn't a bad move, IMHO. I don't like wasting draft picks because that's how you build a team, but the odds are Allen will give you more than those 3 picks. However, there's no guarantee that he will. You are giving up the chance to draft 3 good players--even though the odds say you won't. For a team that has struggled to evaluate DE talent, it's a good move if you stop there. I think Allen is really good, but he's not Reggie White. He's more like Aaron Kampman. I think his pass rush abilities might even be better than Kampman, but he's not as good against the run. He's at least a solid player, and he could be coming into his own as a dominant force, but there's also a chance that he was making a contract run last year and that he'll settle into his career norms of around 10 sacks/year.

Now, here's where it gets dicey. The Vikes also had to give him $31M guaranteed. Maybe that's not a big deal, but fans shouldn't kid themselves. The cap isn't going to go up every year, and no matter what you do, if you continue to throw money around like it's nothing, you'll find yourself in a bind regarding the cap. The other monkey wrench is that he's one mistake from a year-long suspension.

Like you said, I think if I thought this would move would buy them a title, I'd think more of it. I'm not sure it does. I do think Chilly and Spielman are desperate to make a move this year. Otherwise, they are probably gone. I'm sure they feel the Packers can be had. This move makes a division title a necessity or the year was a bust. Which makes it harder to understand what they are doing at QB.

I know some fans are impatient, but I got the feeling that Vikings fans would have been okay with a slow rebuilding process... building through the draft... building the corps of a team that can compete every year. I think fans saw that the team had a good draft last year and, as long as they were taking steps forward, their fan base would have been okay with that. All the fans really wanted was a secondary option at QB. Jackson likely makes or breaks this team, Chilly's future, and the future of the team for the next several years. They threw away the 2005 draft and throwing away another draft would be very detrimental to the team.

The reward though is a division title and potential strong run in the playoffs, if their QB is ready to lead them on that run.

[Guiness]

Yes, risky, and I'm not sure what they think the reward is going to be.

The Vikes are not one (or even two) players away. They're a solid team, with a good mix of some young talent and good vets who are holding up, but not a contending team - they didn't even make the playoffs last year.

A good draft might've changed that, with a few contributing rookies. What they got instead was a known (albeit good) quantity, and IMO it isn't enough. So they improve a little, maybe make the playoffs, and get a couple of first round exits and pffft.

[Scott Campbell]

The Vikes are not one (or even two) players away.

I don't think I agree with that. They look like paper tigers to me at this point. I wouldn't be surprised at all if they get picked by many of the experts to win the division. That'd be ok I guess, as it would take the target off our backs.

A great D, combined with a great grind it out running game could be a lethal combo - even without a decent passing game.