WOW! Bust out your hip waders!!!!!

[Green Bud Packer]

Re: WOW! Bust out your hip waders!!!!!

Two out of three at WR,RB or TE.

whos too say that your WR, RB,TE tandem will be any better than the WRs, RBs, TE thompson picked? noone will know til they put the pads on and even then it wont be known for sure although we'll have a better idea then. go pack.

[Lurker64]

That's what's strange. Dallas got a MUCH better deal than what apparently was offered us. That makes little sense. Dallas got a GREAT deal. The deal offered us was more 50-50.

I agree. It boggles the mind. Either the Browns were getting really desperate at that time, or Dallas just drove a harder bargain. If you think about it though, everyone in Cleveland is ecstatic, but if Brady Quinn flops, the Browns are going to suffer for another 4-5 years at least, especially because the mortgaged so much of the future on this year, including trading picks to move back into the second round. It really was a Shermanesque draft for the Browns (except Sherman never had higher than a #20 pick).

My guess is that Cleveland was getting desperate, as word on the draft day was that that Kansas City was going to take Quinn if he was still available, and Cleveland traded into the last possible spot they could before KC picked.

If they would have waited longer they wouldn't have gotten Quinn, and Dallas held all the cards for Cleveland got taken to the cleaners on the trade (they lost by several hundred when you consider points.)

[Lurker64]

Re: WOW! Bust out your hip waders!!!!!

The deal would have netted us another early second round pick.

Cleveland never offered us their second round pick, they only offered us the opportunity to switch picks in the second and third. As I explained previously, this is a huge loss on the points chart, and Ted Thompson would have been an idiot to accept it.

If Cleveland offers Thompson the deal Dallas got, Thompson probably takes it. Cleveland lowballed TT, and he said no.

[HarveyWallbangers]

It's also easy to say, Dallas called back--instead of just saying "no". I doubt Thompson is as pathetic as people make him out to be. Thompson said he called the four teams behind to look to trade down. It could be that in his 15 minutes to make the pick, it just didn't work out. You know he would have loved to trade down for the right value.


Perhaps he was working on trades with those other four teams, time was running short, and the Cleveland deal was on the table. Could be that he thought he could work out another deal.

Like Lurker said, KC was going to draft Quinn. At least, that was my prediction.


Could be Cleveland got desperate at pick #22. Until then, they might not have been so desperate. We'll never know.

[woodbuck27]

Re: WOW! Bust out your hip waders!!!!!

Two out of three at WR,RB or TE.

whos too say that your WR, RB,TE tandem will be any better than the WRs, RBs, TE thompson picked? noone will know til they put the pads on and even then it wont be known for sure although we'll have a better idea then. go pack.

touche but. . .

The tie breaker woud certainly have to go to 'the fact' that we would have two first Rd. picks in 2008.

That was HUGE !!!

That TT passed on that cannot ever be forgotten. I feel he made a mistake and I expand on that, by giving a very plauseable reason for TT rejecting such a solid deal.

[retailguy]

You are so sure of that before the first mini-camp. It's amazing to me. I find it interesting that because we didn't sign someone that the media annointed a big name to or that had really great production 3 years ago that we are absolutely destined to fail and that there is NO chance whatsoever that this bunch on no names could possibly make the playoffs because we play more teams that were good last year. The Bears had a good draft so I've heard. You'll never convince me that they're a stonger organization than the were a year ago. You'll also never convince me that the Lions couldn't make a sudden comeback. We just won't know til they get some uniforms on and start hitting each other. That's part of the joy of the game.

To be honest, I don't give a rat's ass (pun intended) about a big name. So what if the pundits know who someone is. It happens way too often that some kid comes out of nowhere and lights it up (Jennings anyone?) and suddenly is a big name. I don't care if someone was great a few years ago and could be for us. Bubba was great a few years ago and you guys want t string him up and get rid of him. He's still a very good blocker and with a little improvement on the o-line, which is to be expected, he has the potential to return to form. If not, one of the kids will. That's life in the NFL. You guys are ready to lay down and die. I'm so glad the team isn't.

Good rant.


Yes, I'm pretty sure. I'd love to be wrong.

I wasn't looking for a BIG NAME. Find where I said that. You've got me mixed up with someone else.

I was looking for HELP. HELP for the Offense specifically. Got an RB. Not sure what to make of him, but the general consensus is "he's no Ahman Green". Even an aging Green.

I do not believe that ANY rookie can run behind our line right now as well as Green could've. Yes, got a bad attitude about this one, so what?

I don't see good things right now. As I said, I'd love to be wrong, but I don't see that as likely right now.

As to Bubba, I've been talking about MAX PROTECT for weeks now. I don't see that changing before the bye week at the soonest, based upon the competition we'll face early in the season. Until the line can function solidly, WITHOUT max protect, Bubba doesn't matter much.

One of the reasons that the red zone offense sucked last year, is because Bubba blocked so much. I don't know if he's over the hill or not, but he had a bunch of drops last year, uncharacteristic for him, but he did it, but until he can run routes, it doesn't really matter. I pushed for an upgrade in free agency, because David Martin has always been a better receiver than Franks, and that loss will hurt (even in the limited time he'd have been on the field).

Bubba is not the problem. The line is the problem.

[Lurker64]

Like Lurker said, KC was going to draft Quinn. At least, that was my prediction.

On ESPN they actually said "Kansas City has announced that they will take Brady Quinn if he is available at 23" so it's not that strange a prediction.

[HarveyWallbangers]

On ESPN they actually said "Kansas City has announced that they will take Brady Quinn if he is available at 23" so it's not that strange a prediction.

If you go back to the draft thread, I predicted it after Miami passed on him.

It was going to happen--until Cleveland usurped my prediction.

[PackerBlues]

Mwa ha ha ha ha ha !!!!

Yeah, and if you go back to my posting on draft day, I predicted that TT is a Jackass. How was I to know that he is actually just a hypocrite.

TT : "I believe in building and that sort of thing. But I think you have to try to help your team. Quite frankly, I'd rather help us now rather than help us a year from now."


Sorry, that one was just to hard to pass up!

[Partial]

holy cow this is a heated debate. It's as if its just me and merlin going back and forth

[PackerBlues]

Ted's first first round pick for the Packers: Aaron Rogers. TT's way of saying "Hey Brett, I want you gone, and I am not going to do anything to help this offense." I sure am glad Ted used this pick on a QB, Rogers sure has come in handy since Teddy drafted him hasnt he <---SARCASM!!!

Teds second first round pick for the Packers: A.J. Hawk. Easily the safest pick in the draft and not a pick that makes TT a genius, it just makes him the GM that took the safest pick this year. Also not a guy that was going to help put points on the board. Am I happy we have him? Yes. Were there other players that could have improved our offense? Yes, without a doubt. Again, a silent message is sent to Favre.

Teds third first round pick for the Packers: Justin Harrell. Another "safe" pick? Not exactly......a little injury history here. Was there another "silent message" sent to Favre? I think so.

I can tell you one thing, If I were the starting QB for the Packers from the time that TT took over up til now.........I would have been cut for sure.
I dont think any GM would put up with his QB walking into his office and Bitch Slapping the living shit out of him. Lucky for Teddy that Farve has a much nicer temperment than me.

[MJZiggy]

Ted's first first round pick for the Packers: Aaron Rogers. TT's way of saying "Hey Brett, I want you gone, and I am not going to do anything to help this offense." I sure am glad Ted used this pick on a QB, Rogers sure has come in handy since Teddy drafted him hasnt he <---SARCASM!!!

What if *spits on the ground, knocks on wood and throw salt over shoulder* Brett had gone down last year **SHUDDER**?? He is 37 years old and has been on the retirement merry-go-round for several years now after 17 years in the league

Great. Draft a nice weapon and have the QB go down without a good replacement to pass to your new weapon. I am TRULY glad we've so rarely had to use the heir apparent, but that doesn't mean he offers nothing to the team.

[packrulz]

I had Harrell on my board going in the 1st round, as did many other boards, his stock was rising up to draft day. If TT had made the trade, Harrell would've been gone. From the clips I've seen, Harrell goes all out every play, takes on double teams, and plays hurt. He sort of reminds me of a guy from Tenn named Reggie White. I'm not saying he's the next Reggie, but he's a hell of a DT and would've been snapped up right away had TT traded. The trade wasn't a very good deal anyway. I don't buy the notion that TT isn't getting Favre any help, Off the top of my head he drafted 2 RB's, 2 WR's, 1 OL, 1 TE, a K, & a FB. If you look at the games the Pack lost last year it was because the defense couldn't shut the other team down, Favre was pretty well protected, Green ran the ball ok, the WR's dropped a few but were a threat, but The D couldn't get off the field. TT improved the depth of the team, players work a lot harder when there's someone trying to take their job. TT didn't make the popular picks, but almost every player he drafted had slipped due to various circumstances and he really does try to draft the best player regardless of position, he was trying to get the best value at each round. I'm not for or against TT but I can see his reasoning.

[Spaulding]

This thread has the makings of West Berlin/East Berlin. Heated discussion is good but neither rampant negatism nor blind optimism holds much weight and reminds me of the JSO.

Obviously everybody is entitled to opinions but the speculation on this board sometimes makes me spit up my beer and I hate wasting beer. Who knows what went down in the discussions with Moss or potential trade ups or trade downs. Makes for great debates but every post is pure speculation and thus how vehement people are in their thoughts (bashing or defending Thompson) being the truth are getting old. Last year evidently Thompson offered more or the same money to Vinatieri and Arrington and they opted for a place other than Green Bay due to demographics, going to a contender, etc. What was said behind closed doors - who knows. Maybe he rubbed the FA's the wrong way or not, don't know, don't care as long as the team improves.

Bring back Patler and his facts as that holds weight. Speaking of which, where has he been?

Thompson for right or wrong is the GM and being a Packer fan I have to believe that Harlan made the right choice in bringing him onboard and that Thompson in turn made the right move in hiring McCarthy.

I've paid my dues in the 70's and 80's and thus even 8-8 years I can stomach if I see progression and two years is not enough to define Thompson's reign as GM. My vote gets cast at the end of year three.

[PackerBlues]

Kewl Avatar Packrulz! heh heh......one might argue that the Offense could not stay on the field thereby wearing our Defense out. As in 3 and out by our offense......Defense did a good job. You can only have so many 3 and outs by your offense before the "law of averages" says your Defense is going to wear down and give up points.

In effect, you could argue that Defense wins games, but you still need points on the board, and they could use a longer rest inbetween our offenses "3 and outs".

(had to edit this one to add.......Very kewl avatar Mrbojangles!)