Randy Moss refused to play for Packers, hung up on calls

[Carolina_Packer]

I was one who advocated for signing Moss last offseason, and obviously he has produced like no other receiver in history over the course of this regular season. However, Moss's upside potential was clearly not without an equal potential for a cancerous presence if things didn't go the way he wanted them to. His continuing personal problems are also a negative weight to the team.

I think the approach taken by the organization was justified, particularly when you look at the fact that they've put together a potent receiving group without the potential cancerous presence. With the production and depth we now have, it's hard to argue we'd really be much better off with him. Someone already mentioned it, but Moss would not likely have made a big difference against the G-Men.

You can second guess every decision a GM makes. You obviously have to look at the overall body of work and the actual results.

We keep sidestepping the real issue here and turn the argument to PRO Randy Moss or not. To lay the judgement on Randy Moss based in his past. By doing this we miss the right bus out of town. We get on the wrong journey.

The real issue is.

If we wanted Randy Moss on our roster (specifically if TT did)? Then how did he slip away to NE after we are aware that TT thought that he had him on our side before retiring to bed Draft weekend - Sat. night ?

TT thought he had him? What's that about?

TT isn't paid to think he had's but to know he had's.

Now we have this reveas;ling article on TT"s method of recruitinfg that is nothing short of being purely Juvenile and an insult to the Packer Organization if it"s true.

This article on Randy Moss and why not the Green Bay Packers places the ball straight into the corner of TT's court and will be a difficult return for him. He may in his way even decide to ignore or sidestep it.

I see that as a serious error to only compound recruitment strategy's and give us the experienced talent we do need in specific positions or we just wait and wait. I hate to wait. I've waited another ten years. Favre hates to wait and the time is short in his hour glass.

The question now that any NFL player will have is:

''What kind of a person (personality) in Ted Thompson, am I going to have to deal with, if I consider Green Bay as my future team?''

When do you let it go, Woody? When you fall short in life, but succeed the majority of the rest of the time, do you appreciate someone constantly bringing up your failures to keep stomping on you? It does no good to keep harping on this issue as there is nothing to be gained from it. Everyone is painfully aware of how you feel about it. Move on already. Don't be a one trick pony.

[woodbuck27]

What does anyone take from his statement that he never really wanted to come to Green Bay anyway? Doesn't that kind of say it all, regardless of how he thought he was treated? The other question I would have is, how would a team be able to legally speak with a player under contract with another team who is potential trade-bait? It's one thing if they are an UFA, but another thing if they are property of another team. I'm not sure what the rules are, but I would think it would be a no-no for any team to have contact with a guy who belongs to another team. Perhaps they didn't directly speak with him, but relayed messages through Oakland to Moss' representatives.

Bottom line is, this issue has been beaten to death and if you are still hanging onto it, you need to let it go and move on. If you want to use it as ammo to villify TT, go ahead. It will do you about as good as someone still wishing Randy was coming to Green Bay. The ship has sailed long ago. Move on!

I didn't post the article.

All we really know (maybe TRUTH) is that Favre never spoke to Randy Moss and prior to this I believe we had the idea that Favre was personally all bellied up with Randy Moss and they were re-designing the play book.

Now we know it was never anywhere close to that.

We know fr. the article that Randy Moss was fine with playing with Favre and we know that it works the other way too. That's all good.

So an article is posted and it should be examined and as always happens when the heat goes on and the Nay TT side (that's really tiny) steps up, we become the fella's with two ugly heads.

Let's simply debate as gentlemen and gentlemaen and Ladies etc. without getting our shorts all in a bunch. Please. Hurling the derogatories.

No! It"s not time to move on as it's about TT"s style of doing his important job for me and OU. Us Packer fans. It's about the fans. US!!

TT will be very much under the gun this season. as TT felt he had the horses before TC this past season. Let's then take the leap. Now we can't be far out after 13-3 and losing the NFC Championship game.

A reality of having, or a fluke or a mirage? TT has to make moves now to get us there. All the heat is on Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy. Especially if Favre stays on.

If Favre retires then they have a back door if Aaron Rodgers doesn't fit the system. They can say it'll just take time. Well that is what this is about. . . time.

I want a Super Bowl and a GM that offers me a real plan and the parts to produce just that. Ted Thompson is in my certain view now, if Randy Moss is totally up front here too far away in his personality to ever get us to that Super Bowl game.

I want to be wrong of course but the assured reality of it is that I'm DAM well stuck with him for too much time if I'm right. the bottom line is my role is to be his critic and where I'm totally out to lunch to learn fr. all of you.

Now I can be his critic and also what I am in real life. A DAM fine person with the ability to view events,issues and managerial moves and reason and comment on it all. That's all we do here is share thoughts so let's do that without feeling it's personal.

TT is, will be always in the spotlight as he's immensely important for our elevation of success. Thus he's receive support and criticism. He's not going anywhere for awhile. For those who LOVE him he'll be OK.

[woodbuck27]

The other question I would have is, how would a team be able to legally speak with a player under contract with another team who is potential trade-bait? It's one thing if they are an UFA, but another thing if they are property of another team. I'm not sure what the rules are, but I would think it would be a no-no for any team to have contact with a guy who belongs to another team. Perhaps they didn't directly speak with him, but relayed messages through Oakland to Moss' representatives.

When a team and player under contract recognize that a trade is in the interest of both parties, the team might allow a limited window for the player to seek a trade. This usually occurs when the player has a "no trade" clause, which gives him final approval anyway, or when the trade would require the player to revise his contract to make it work. It is not uncommon. The trade ends up involving both teams and the player to make it work.

Ladies and Gentleman of PackerRats I introduce Y'all to Ted Thompson.

[Partial]

I don't cast a ton of blame on TT for this. I will say, his weakest ability seems to be communication. He seems to have no clue what people want to hear (as evident by his "we'll win some games" quotes). He's just not a shmoozer. I respect that, but not everyone appreciates it.


There will be oppertunities to bring players in. I think it's important to talk them up, make them feel good about themselves and about the Packers. I'm not big on getting too many, but I would have loved to of gotten Moss. I hope TT learns because he's been pretty good in almost every other department and he's got this team on the doorstep. I'm not saying he HAS to do something this off season, but if it's there, I hope we don't miss it because the player feels underappreciated.

No, he is humble and simiiar to a jedi. He rarely speaks in absolutes.

[Cheesehead Craig]

I don't cast a ton of blame on TT for this. I will say, his weakest ability seems to be communication. He seems to have no clue what people want to hear (as evident by his "we'll win some games" quotes). He's just not a shmoozer. I respect that, but not everyone appreciates it.


There will be oppertunities to bring players in. I think it's important to talk them up, make them feel good about themselves and about the Packers. I'm not big on getting too many, but I would have loved to of gotten Moss. I hope TT learns because he's been pretty good in almost every other department and he's got this team on the doorstep. I'm not saying he HAS to do something this off season, but if it's there, I hope we don't miss it because the player feels underappreciated.

No, he is humble and simiiar to a jedi. He rarely speaks in absolutes.

Give me your draft picks you will.

[Patler]

Woodbuck;

Have you read the article about Wolf and his circuitous relationship getting Favre on his team?

According to Wolf, while with the Jets he had Favre ranked as the best player in the draft. The Jets had no 1st round draft choice, and figured Favre would go late first or early second. They thought they had a trade worked out a day ahead of time to move up in the draft and get him. At the last minute, just before the trade would have been announced, the other team pulled out of the trade because a player they really liked was still available. Favre didn't last to the Jets pick in the 2nd. Of course a year later Wolf got him for his team, but it was the Packers by then not the Jets.

How does Wolf thinking he had a deal enabling him to draft Favre for the Jets differ from TT thinking he had a trade for Moss? Until it is actually submitted to the NFL, either team can pull out. It happened to TT, it happened to Wolf.

[twoseven]

One point I will definitely agree with JH on.

If you want the guy you need to learn how to set the tone for getting him here.

In sales people often have to balance getting the deal with saying anything that will scare the buyer away or setting a negative tone before the deal is sealed.

This is just one bloated ego's view in RM, but if true it sounds like GB should have considered that more

Thank you Bretsky for better wording my basic point. Be it Moss or whoever, know someting about your target audience/market, including how they might be inclined to handle an interview and everything you plan to discuss with them before you start popping questions. Anybody that fails to recognize this should avoid sales as a career choice.

As I stated to begin with, RM gave his side which could be BS, maybe we did everything right, all I added is if we did not, let's figure it out before we call anyone else. For me this is not about Moss, it's wondering how we handle our communication with anyone.

This is a gross exagerration, but if we did call Briggs: do you bring up that we are set at LB and he is more of a luxury than a necessity, if he comes to play he may be on the sidelines often, he should expect to see his sack and tackle totals drop- because of this we would like to make his deal a performanced based contract, and he'd better not pull any Lamborghini stunts in GB, noting that Barnett and Hawk are our guys and Briggs better not step on their toes? Hey, maybe it is, I'm just wondering..does the want and the need mean you disclose all of your true intentions for the player upfront, or do you just close the deal and let them in on it after they are locked in? We did tell Woodson he could catch some passes, didn't we?

[MJZiggy]

You guys keep dancing around what I read in that article...IF TT wanted Moss. IF. I got the impression from that article that TT didn't even really want Moss and went into those discussions because Favre wanted him on the team. I get the impression that TT was more like those other 30 GM's than we think. And if I'm going after a malcontent that I'm not completely sold on, I'm damn sure gonna make certain he knows what's expected of him if he steps foot in my team's locker room. If he's not willing to play as a team, then let the other guys have him. Our boys did fine and in the end, I agree that Randy Moss wouldn't have gotten us any further than we got.

[GBRulz]

I agree that Randy Moss wouldn't have gotten us any further than we got.

I agree as well. Unless the guy can play CB as good as he is a WR!

[RashanGary]

No, he is humble and simiiar to a jedi. He rarely speaks in absolutes.

haha, good comparison. That is exactly what he does. I think it's honest and shows his awareness that you never really know what you have but nobody wants to hear that. Everyone wants to hear that the GM knows exactly what he has "like it's somehow possible".

[Patler]

You guys keep dancing around what I read in that article...IF TT wanted Moss. IF. I got the impression from that article that TT didn't even really want Moss and went into those discussions because Favre wanted him on the team. I get the impression that TT was more like those other 30 GM's than we think. And if I'm going after a malcontent that I'm not completely sold on, I'm damn sure gonna make certain he knows what's expected of him if he steps foot in my team's locker room. If he's not willing to play as a team, then let the other guys have him. Our boys did fine and in the end, I agree that Randy Moss wouldn't have gotten us any further than we got.

I agree, except I doubt TT was influenced that much by what Favre wanted. Wasn't there an article last spring that stated some members of the Executive Committee or the Board were real interested in Moss, and others were dead set against getting him? Perhaps TT was under a directive to gather facts about what a deal would entail.

[Carolina_Packer]

What does anyone take from his statement that he never really wanted to come to Green Bay anyway? Doesn't that kind of say it all, regardless of how he thought he was treated? The other question I would have is, how would a team be able to legally speak with a player under contract with another team who is potential trade-bait? It's one thing if they are an UFA, but another thing if they are property of another team. I'm not sure what the rules are, but I would think it would be a no-no for any team to have contact with a guy who belongs to another team. Perhaps they didn't directly speak with him, but relayed messages through Oakland to Moss' representatives.

Bottom line is, this issue has been beaten to death and if you are still hanging onto it, you need to let it go and move on. If you want to use it as ammo to villify TT, go ahead. It will do you about as good as someone still wishing Randy was coming to Green Bay. The ship has sailed long ago. Move on!

I didn't post the article.

All we really know (maybe TRUTH) is that Favre never spoke to Randy Moss and prior to this I believe we had the idea that Favre was personally all bellied up with Randy Moss and they were re-designing the play book.

Now we know it was never anywhere close to that.

We know fr. the article that Randy Moss was fine with playing with Favre and we know that it works the other way too. That's all good.

So an article is posted and it should be examined and as always happens when the heat goes on and the Nay TT side (that's really tiny) steps up, we become the fella's with two ugly heads.

Let's simply debate as gentlemen and gentlemaen and Ladies etc. without getting our shorts all in a bunch. Please. Hurling the derogatories.

No! It"s not time to move on as it's about TT"s style of doing his important job for me and OU. Us Packer fans. It's about the fans. US!!

TT will be very much under the gun this season. as TT felt he had the horses before TC this past season. Let's then take the leap. Now we can't be far out after 13-3 and losing the NFC Championship game.

A reality of having, or a fluke or a mirage? TT has to make moves now to get us there. All the heat is on Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy. Especially if Favre stays on.

If Favre retires then they have a back door if Aaron Rodgers doesn't fit the system. They can say it'll just take time. Well that is what this is about. . . time.

I want a Super Bowl and a GM that offers me a real plan and the parts to produce just that. Ted Thompson is in my certain view now, if Randy Moss is totally up front here too far away in his personality to ever get us to that Super Bowl game.

I want to be wrong of course but the assured reality of it is that I'm DAM well stuck with him for too much time if I'm right. the bottom line is my role is to be his critic and where I'm totally out to lunch to learn fr. all of you.

Now I can be his critic and also what I am in real life. A DAM fine person with the ability to view events,issues and managerial moves and reason and comment on it all. That's all we do here is share thoughts so let's do that without feeling it's personal.

TT is, will be always in the spotlight as he's immensely important for our elevation of success. Thus he's receive support and criticism. He's not going anywhere for awhile. For those who LOVE him he'll be OK.

I'll put it in Dr. Suess format for you...

WB: I am Woodbuck, Woodbuck I am...
TT: That Woodbuck fan, that Woodbuck fan, I do not like that Woodbuck fan.
WB: Would you, could you sign that Moss?
TT: I would not, could not sign that Moss.
WB: Would you sign him if I called your boss?
TT: Not calling my boss, not signing Moss, I do not like that Woodbuck guy, it's my job I'd like to see him try.
WB: Would you sign Moss for a 3rd?
TT: No, then of James Jones Packer fans never would have heard.
WB: Would you sign Moss on Day 2?
TT: I'll see, I'll see what I can do.
WB: Would you sign to a long term deal? Get him, get him, he's a steal.
TT: You realize that you are just a fan and that the Green Bay Packers made me the man?
WB: You suck, you suck, you never do what I say.
TT: I have, I have a different way.
WB: You are under pressure, you have much to fear.
TT: No shit Sherlock! It's like that every year.
WB: Would you, could you do as I say?
TT: I could, I could, there's no pleasing you anyway. If 13-3 did not do it for you Woodbuck, then I suggest it's you and not me and please take a flying...&%#$@

[Zool]

I'll put it in Dr. Suess format for you...

WB: I am Woodbuck, Woodbuck I am...
TT: That Woodbuck fan, that Woodbuck fan, I do not like that Woodbuck fan.
WB: Would you, could you sign that Moss?
TT: I would not, could not sign that Moss.
WB: Would you sign him if I called your boss?
TT: Not calling my boss, not signing Moss, I do not like that Woodbuck guy, it's my job I'd like to see him try.
WB: Would you sign Moss for a 3rd?
TT: No, then James Jones of Packer fans never would have heard.
WB: Would you sign Moss on Day 2?
TT: I'll see, I'll see what I can do.
WB: Would you sign to a long term deal? Get him, get him, he's a steal.
TT: You realize that you are just a fan and that the Green Bay Packers made me the man?
WB: You suck, you suck, you never do what I say.
TT: I have, I have a different way.
WB: You are under pressure, you have much to fear.
TT: No shit Sherlock! It's like that every year.
WB: Would you, could you do as I say?
TT: I could, I could, there's no pleasing you anyway. If 13-3 did not do it for you Woodbuck, then I suggest it's you and not me and please take a flying...&%#$@

Dude, whats your paypal account #?

[Cheesehead Craig]

That's hysterical Carolina!

[Scott Campbell]

Carolina popped a Woody!