OFFICIAL BRETT THE LIVING LEGEND THREAD

[mraynrand]

We're cutting away to FOX NFL studios, where our NFL rules guru is standing by to give us a ruling on the Favre penalty/fumble/non-turnover. You will be more confused afterwards than before, but you WILL be informed!

[mraynrand]

Hey, Wha Happened?

[HarveyWallbangers]

According to the referee's interpretation during the viking game yesterday, the penalty only negates a turnover if the QB had possession at the time of the penalty. Otherwise, if he does not have possession at the time of the penalty - both teams are essentially considered a defense at that point, and thus the penalty is assessed after some team gains possession.

Is this your theory or did the ref say exactly that during the game? I don't remember that, and it wouldn't make sense because if the defense doesn't have possession, then the act of the facemask could keep the offensive player for getting possession of the ball. Otherwise, if a fumble occurs and an offensive player has inside position on the recovery, a defensive player could just grab the offensive players facemask and keep him from getting to the ball. Makes ZERO sense. I'm fairly certain that until the defense has possession, the penalty would give the offense a first down. I've never heard of both teams essentially being considered "the defense".

[MadtownPacker]

Bretsky, Ziggy, GBM, Partial, Harvey, Bretsky, RG were all fun to hang out with. Madtown was a blast. Where the hell did he go?

It's not the same on the internet. In real life, people just seem to get along a lot better.

Whats up! Yeah it was fun drinking those gimlets with you and GBM. Shit gets you tore up with a quickness.

You should have met Tarlam, his drinking stamina puts all to shame.

[RashanGary]

haha. You find out quick what Wisconsin is all about. We don't mix a shot of vodka in our glass of lemonade. We mix a shot of lime juice in our glass of vodka. Those two statements are more different than they sound.

[MadtownPacker]

Yeah they dont serve those around here that I know of. Too bad cuz they where one-hitter-quitter level shit. What are the ingredients so I can make myself one tonight?

[sharpe1027]

Is this your theory or did the ref say exactly that during the game? I don't remember that, and it wouldn't make sense because if the defense doesn't have possession, then the act of the facemask could keep the offensive player for getting possession of the ball. Otherwise, if a fumble occurs and an offensive player has inside position on the recovery, a defensive player could just grab the offensive players facemask and keep him from getting to the ball. Makes ZERO sense. I'm fairly certain that until the defense has possession, the penalty would give the offense a first down. I've never heard of both teams essentially being considered "the defense".

I agree. If a fumbled ball goes out of bounds, both teams are not considered equal since the offense retains possession. I would guess that the same logic applies to a penalty.

[ThunderDan]

Favre was bailed out by the refs twice today. He threw an interception that was called back and then he fumbled after he got hit in the head. Even with those, he still managed to throw 2 more interceptions.

Too bad the helmet hit didn't happen to rodgers prior to his fumble/int in OT last year. It happened after he dropped it. If it happened before, it would of negated the turnover.
Favre hasn't played well at all this year, I wont dare say he is playing well. But, that OL his one of the worst pass protection OL's I have seen this season, right there iwth the eagles. What happened? They were much better last year in protection then they have been this season. At this rate, Matthews is going have 5 sacks a game against the vikings.

Sorry, but that isn't the rule on penalties stopping possesion changes. Any penalty that happens before the ball changes possesion stops the turnover. So Rodgers can drop the ball and as long as he is roughed before the Cardinals have the ball in their hands, with 2 feet down or maybe more if they are in the act of going to the ground, the Packers retain possesion. Which is exactly what happened in Arizona.

According to the referee's interpretation during the viking game yesterday, the penalty only negates a turnover if the QB had possession at the time of the penalty. Otherwise, if he does not have possession at the time of the penalty - both teams are essentially considered a defense at that point, and thus the penalty is assessed after some team gains possession.

However, if a hit in the head (or the facemask) occurs while Rodgers has possession, and then he drops the ball (or throws a pick, blah blah) that play no longer counts.

I am basing this 100% on the explanation the referee gave for overturning the fumble.

Then the ref is completely wrong and needs to look at the rules book again. The offense is deemed in possesion of the ball no matter what happens (other than kicking situations) until the defensive team has established complete control of the ball in bounds. I would cut and paste the rule but I can't find the PDF link of the NFL rule book right now.

[RashanGary]

Yeah they dont serve those around here that I know of. Too bad cuz they where one-hitter-quitter level shit. What are the ingredients so I can make myself one tonight?

Vodka and lime juice. 1.5 parts vodka, 1 part lime juice. Has to be really cold. Stir with ice and strain into your drinking glass.

You can go 2:1 for the 2nd one and it won't taste any different.

[MichiganPackerFan]

Yeah they dont serve those around here that I know of. Too bad cuz they where one-hitter-quitter level shit. What are the ingredients so I can make myself one tonight?

Vodka and lime juice. 1.5 parts vodka, 1 part lime juice. Has to be really cold. Stir with ice and strain into your drinking glass.

You can go 2:1 for the 2nd one and it won't taste any different.

Best Vodka Gimlet: Ton of ice (your drink should be on the rocks, not your rocks on the drink ) Good vodka, and just a little bit (maybe a teaspoon) of Roses lime. Saturating it with roses is really overkill

[denverYooper]

From Peter King's Factoid of the Week section:

The Green Bay Packers can thank Brett Favre for one more thing, other than a lot of memories, when they take the field tonight in Chicago.

The Packers traded Favre to the New York Jets for a conditional draft choice in 2008. The pick became the Jets' third-rounder in the 2009 draft because Favre played more than 50 percent of the snaps in the 2008 season. So when the Packers started looking for an extra pick to pair with the 41st and 73rd overall picks to send to New England for the 26th overall pick in the first round on that draft day, GM Ted Thompson reached into his trove of choices and pulled out the Favre pick -- the 83rd. He sent the three picks to New England for that first-rounder and a fifth- to get a prospect many in the league thought had some holes because of a very spotty college career. The prospect started only eight games in five years, but Thompson had a feel for him. He thought the prospect would be just what his front seven was missing. And so the deal got made, and Thompson used the ultimate headache that had been the Favre nightmare to help him get his man.

NFL sack leader Clay Matthews.

THANKSTED

[Fritz]

Favre was bailed out by the refs twice today. He threw an interception that was called back and then he fumbled after he got hit in the head. Even with those, he still managed to throw 2 more interceptions.

Too bad the helmet hit didn't happen to rodgers prior to his fumble/int in OT last year. It happened after he dropped it. If it happened before, it would of negated the turnover.

Favre hasn't played well at all this year, I wont dare say he is playing well. But, that OL his one of the worst pass protection OL's I have seen this season, right there iwth the eagles. What happened? They were much better last year in protection then they have been this season. At this rate, Matthews is going have 5 sacks a game against the vikings.

wow....I wish I had time to repeat all the crap I read about making his teammates so much better for the last 2 and a half years.

I thought the call that took the interception away from Detroit was a total bs call. The contact was - I thought - within five yards, and on top of that the receiver kept running straight downfield while Favre threw the ball inside.

Had the refs realized that Favre could've faulted the receiver for that one, maybe they wouldn't have thrown the flag.

I'm amazed at the plastic nature of Favre logic. What I'm hearing now is that he CAN'T make his receivers better because his offensive line isn't giving him enough time to...

[ThunderDan]

Favre was bailed out by the refs twice today. He threw an interception that was called back and then he fumbled after he got hit in the head. Even with those, he still managed to throw 2 more interceptions.

Too bad the helmet hit didn't happen to rodgers prior to his fumble/int in OT last year. It happened after he dropped it. If it happened before, it would of negated the turnover.

Favre hasn't played well at all this year, I wont dare say he is playing well. But, that OL his one of the worst pass protection OL's I have seen this season, right there iwth the eagles. What happened? They were much better last year in protection then they have been this season. At this rate, Matthews is going have 5 sacks a game against the vikings.

wow....I wish I had time to repeat all the crap I read about making his teammates so much better for the last 2 and a half years.

I thought the call that took the interception away from Detroit was a total bs call. The contact was - I thought - within five yards, and on top of that the receiver kept running straight downfield while Favre threw the ball inside.

Had the refs realized that Favre could've faulted the receiver for that one, maybe they wouldn't have thrown the flag.

I'm amazed at the plastic nature of Favre logic. What I'm hearing now is that he CAN'T make his receivers better because his offensive line isn't giving him enough time to...

Wasn't that the knock on ARod? That Favre made the offensive line in GB better.

[mraynrand]

I'm amazed at the plastic nature of Favre logic. What I'm hearing now is that he CAN'T make his receivers better because his offensive line isn't giving him enough time to...

Not to drag FYI over here, but it's like Evolution and Manmade Global Climate Disruption: There isn't a single piece of information that can't be subsumed into the larger model. Anything that happens to the VIkings and the "Favre is Blameless" paradigm is fully adaptable.

[Pugger]

From Peter King's Factoid of the Week section:

The Green Bay Packers can thank Brett Favre for one more thing, other than a lot of memories, when they take the field tonight in Chicago.

The Packers traded Favre to the New York Jets for a conditional draft choice in 2008. The pick became the Jets' third-rounder in the 2009 draft because Favre played more than 50 percent of the snaps in the 2008 season. So when the Packers started looking for an extra pick to pair with the 41st and 73rd overall picks to send to New England for the 26th overall pick in the first round on that draft day, GM Ted Thompson reached into his trove of choices and pulled out the Favre pick -- the 83rd. He sent the three picks to New England for that first-rounder and a fifth- to get a prospect many in the league thought had some holes because of a very spotty college career. The prospect started only eight games in five years, but Thompson had a feel for him. He thought the prospect would be just what his front seven was missing. And so the deal got made, and Thompson used the ultimate headache that had been the Favre nightmare to help him get his man.

NFL sack leader Clay Matthews.

THANKSTED