Running game - Is it really the guys up front?

[mraynrand]

That article answers your question nicely

how so?

[Harlan Huckleby]

how so?

Barry Sanders is better when the team is losing, Jerome Bettis is better when winning. Makes sense.

[mraynrand]

Barry Sanders is better when the team is losing, Jerome Bettis is better when winning. Makes sense.

I see the point and it makes sense, but it doesn't really address the central question.

[swede]

Go and look at the individual runs, the circumstances, and how they impact games. Barry Sanders sucked because his median was low: 1,1, -4, 12, 1, 4,1,38, 2, 60, 1, -1, -5,3, 45 - that's what his stat line looked like sometimes. Jerome Bettis looked like: 3,3,4,6,3,7,2,9,3,4,7,2,4,5,6...etc. Who was better??

Sanders' mode was 1. Bettis' mode was 3 and 4. I'm taking Bettis in third and short.

[Guiness]

Sanders' mode was 1. Bettis' mode was 3 and 4. I'm taking Bettis in third and short.

FWIW I don't recall Sander's numbers being anywhere near that inconsistent, you couldn't coach around that. I suspect that part of his legend grows.

I'd be curious to get some old charts or play-by-play transcripts to see what he actually did. All I can find is boxscores

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/game_query.cgi?tm1=gnb&tm2=det&yr=all

[mraynrand]

FWIW I don't recall Sander's numbers being anywhere near that inconsistent, you couldn't coach around that. I suspect that part of his legend grows.

I'd be curious to get some old charts or play-by-play transcripts to see what he actually did. All I can find is boxscores
http://www.pro-football-reference.co...tm2=det&yr=all

I was exaggerating to be sure, but the general point I think is indisputable: the more numbers you get the harder it is to tell what made the various runners exceptional/successful/?failures?. Harlan's reference all but says there is nothing special about LT - he's just a run of the mill guy that reflects and doesn't deviate from the NFL average.

I still wonder what Grant, Starks and others look like superimposed over that graph.

[RashanGary]

i like steady better, for ourr team. We get our explosive gains in the pass. We have the best qb. more good things happen when we pass no matter who the back would be.

[Harlan Huckleby]

i like steady better, for ourr team. We get our explosive gains in the pass .

Right. Same is true for most winning teams, you mostly need to just keep the sticks moving when you are ahead most of the time.

[Smeefers]

So... I don't have to back up my ass backwards math? Sweet.

Got you guys eating out of the palm of my hand.

[mraynrand]

So... I don't have to back up my ass backwards math? Sweet.

Got you guys eating out of the palm of my hand.

you got called out on your slight of hand. But in a league where the very best (LT) are only average, who cares?

[King Friday]

Sanders > Bettis behind the same OL

[swede]

Sanders > Bettis behind the same OL

No equality for people of color?

[sharpe1027]

Yes, Cedric was averaging a whopping 3.5 yards a carry. STUD!!! What you actually are remembering is that we CALLED running plays and got favorable down and distances early on. Something we stopped doing quickly as MM doesn't really like running the ball.

The difference with benson was that he was getting enough yards to keep drives alive when teams were daring the pack to run with cover 2. What the packers needed was 3.5 yards average without a 20 yarder offsetting several drive killing zero yarders.

[bobblehead]

The difference with benson was that he was getting enough yards to keep drives alive when teams were daring the pack to run with cover 2. What the packers needed was 3.5 yards average without a 20 yarder offsetting several drive killing zero yarders.

Look, I am the original poster to hammer the more favorable down and distance concept around here, but a 3.5 avg. is not special. Period. End of story. Cedric got carries. He got them early. MM using him properly was the most impressive thing about him. Lacy will do the same, but avg. 4.2 ypc and you will understand that benson stinks and is old. Starks and DeJuan Harris are better backs than Benson was last year.

[Pugger]

i like steady better, for ourr team. We get our explosive gains in the pass. We have the best qb. more good things happen when we pass no matter who the back would be.

But with the young tackles on our O line protecting Rodgers' backside having a RB back there that defenses have to account for will give Rodgers that couple extra seconds to slice and dice defenses if Lacy can keep running like he did the other night.