TED THOMPSON---WORTHY OF CRITICISM ???????????????????????????

[bobblehead]

Not sure how injuries explain the continued piss poor tackling and complete lack of fire? These are things that can and should be coached, but sadly have not been. While injuries certainly contribute to our woes, I personally believe the injuries are just exposing the packers for what they are, mostly an average team with average coaches. I hope the board of directors recognize this and make changes accordingly.

This is the criticism of TT, tackling would fall on MM and Capers.

[woodbuck27]

The short answer is this. He is certainly not BEYOND criticism. I don't think he is WORTHY of it though. MM and TT dropped the ball regarding a backup. The strategy they used has been in GB since Wolf/Holmgren. Problem is that the 2 guys they were developing didn't develop. They deserve criticism for that. They also deserve a bit of credit for recognizing it and making the move for seneca Wallace when they did. We will never know for sure if that move would have been enough or not.

Again, we must look at the body of work. I thought cutting Bishop was crazy...he was healthy, he played ok in Minnesota early. TT proved to be right though, and the hammy left problems that lead to another injury (maybe, or it was a fluke). Giving Hawk that big contract was a mistake, it was remedied. I can't hammer TT for the OL though, not unless Bulaga and Sherrod line up together and suck.

What I do not accept from people is criticism such as "TT fucking blows. He is an idiot. I could GM better than that asshole. He hasn't done anything other than draft Arod."

I agree as Packer fans lets try to contain ourselves and look at him and MM etc. with some sense of respect...some class/decency/manners.

I often go to humor when I feel somehow frustrated. Is humor OK?

I'm also Canadian and a part of our culture or where I come from in Canada is to use satire a lot.

See humor above.

[bobblehead]

I think TT deserves plenty of critisism

And the overpaying for our own average talent. People like to say its good to stay out of free agency because you always have to overpay. Well we have ovepaid for tramon, hawk, finley, brad jones, bush, and i'm sure theres a few more.

I disagree we overpaid for Tramon, Bush, and Finley. Tramon got hurt, but he was HUGE in us winning the superbowl. He earned that contract, he just hasn't played up to it. He has returned to being solid, but is overpaid, but the injury is the reason. Bush isn't paid all that much. He is very good on ST but I do agree, he should NEVER see the field otherwise. Finley was given a 2 year deal. It was fair, we could have cut him at anytime with minimal hit. It was a "prove you deserve a big deal with guaranteed money" deal. He didn't, and we weren't hurt by it. Hawk was restructured, but it was a bad deal. Jones got starter money, he is a nickel player. The gripe is where I have had it for a long time. We suck at LB after clay. Perry and project neal look promising, but we will see.

[mmmdk]

Packers were the youngest team for years and yet Packers have been declining since the SB win. That's just terrible management and apparently a lack of abilty to judge talent by coaches as well. I guess that ultimate success can make one blind and hence feel invincible on draft day. TT and coaches drank a magic posion and the effect wore of pretty quickly.

I still think TT is our GM and a fairly good one but he also hired our teaching coaches and has let our DL, our front seven as a Whole plus OL decline faster than you can say 'Brett Favre one man show'!

It's now the Aaron Rodgers one man show and Packers are looking stupid these days. Big offseason coming and all is NOT lost.

Lastly, it's ok in my book to be clutching at straws, during the remaining season, and hold up hope for some miracle for the Packers to turn Things around. Just don't be too dissapointed when reality checks in.

[bobblehead]

Ted Thompson seems to me to be a stubborn man.

As long as it acts that way the Green Bay Packers will be at a disadvantage.

In my life I've learned that what isn't working simply needs to be fixed or renewed.

I believe that Ted Thompson needs to change somehow.

I believe that TT needs a brand new blueprint for that change.

My concern as a Packer fan...TT's simply never going to get there.

Back to the meaning of the word... stubborn:

adjective: stubborn

Having or showing dogged determination not to change one's attitude or position on something, especially in spite of good reasons to do so.

Now post the definition of convictions. TT simply knows his is the best way to build a winner and isn't subject to HUGE emotional swings that fans are. In many ways he reminds me of myself which is probably why I largely defend him.

Example. During the housing boom I sold my house and condo and rented. Everyone around me told me I was crazy. I would NEVER be able to afford another house at the rate they were going up. I was an idiot. I sold 2 paid for properties that would be going up ANOTHER 100% in the next 2 years. God was I stupid.

Granted, this is a more extreme example than fans calling TT an idiot, but the point is, I knew I was right. I didn't engage in pointless arguments or bother defending my position to people who were being irrational (I save that for packerrats fans that are being irrational). TT knows how to build a winner. He is not immune to the injury bug or occasional mistakes. He also doesn't waste his time engaging discussions with overreacting media/fans.

[bobblehead]

I agree as Packer fans lets try to contain ourselves and look at him and MM etc. with some sense of respect...some class/decency/manners.

I often go to humor when I feel somehow frustrated. Is humor OK?

I'm also Canadian and a part of our culture or where I come from in Canada is to use satire a lot.

See humor above.

I think so. In fact anything is ok. You can act however you want, but you might have to pay a price of others ridiculing you, or being banned if you are like rbaloha or tank.

[red]

Purely a guess, butI think Wallace was probably going to be out for a week or two and would be playing again by now. I also think when Flynn cleared waivers and with Tolzien being the only healthy QB on the roster at that point they felt their hand was forced. You have to have 2 QBs on the gameday roster.
Of course, it's possible Wallace really wrecked the muscle, but IIRC he pulled it on basically a non-contact (for him) play...so I'm inclined to think the injury wasn't serious.

I just saw the other day that wallace was going to have surgery for the injury

So it looks like it was a pretty serious injury that was going to keep him out for awhile. Not the little injury that most of us thought would just keep him out a week but our hand was forced and we had to IR him

Edit. Found the link. Hes having surgery on the groin this week or next and he'll be down for 4weeks

http://www.tmz.com/2013/11/29/seneca-wallace-groin-surgery-green-bay-packers-injury/

[red]

I disagree we overpaid for Tramon, Bush, and Finley. Tramon got hurt, but he was HUGE in us winning the superbowl. He earned that contract, he just hasn't played up to it. He has returned to being solid, but is overpaid, but the injury is the reason. Bush isn't paid all that much. He is very good on ST but I do agree, he should NEVER see the field otherwise. Finley was given a 2 year deal. It was fair, we could have cut him at anytime with minimal hit. It was a "prove you deserve a big deal with guaranteed money" deal. He didn't, and we weren't hurt by it. Hawk was restructured, but it was a bad deal. Jones got starter money, he is a nickel player. The gripe is where I have had it for a long time. We suck at LB after clay. Perry and project neal look promising, but we will see.

Tramon got his money and has been nothing since then, he got paid and has turned to shit, althoug he likes to blame this mystery injury for him being shitty for 3 or 4 years now. If we had signed tramon from another team and he had gotten hurt rigt away, we would be sittinghere yelling about him being a flop. Him and namdi, not much difference. But he' s one of our own, so its ok

Bush is making almost 2 million bucks to be a gunner on the worst special teams in the nfl

Finley was te highest paid TE in the nfl this year, at no point in his career has he ever been the best TE in the nfl. Again if we had signed him from another team we would be screaming about the free agent bust

Hawk is still making over 5 million this year, will be over 6 next year. Restructured or not, he is greatly overpaid

If any of these guys had been signed from other teams, people on here would be blasting TT for wasting money on free agents

[woodbuck27]

Now post the definition of convictions. TT simply knows his is the best way to build a winner and isn't subject to HUGE emotional swings that fans are. In many ways he reminds me of myself which is probably why I largely defend him.

Example. During the housing boom I sold my house and condo and rented. Everyone around me told me I was crazy. I would NEVER be able to afford another house at the rate they were going up. I was an idiot. I sold 2 paid for properties that would be going up ANOTHER 100% in the next 2 years. God was I stupid.

Granted, this is a more extreme example than fans calling TT an idiot, but the point is, I knew I was right. I didn't engage in pointless arguments or bother defending my position to people who were being irrational (I save that for packerrats fans that are being irrational). TT knows how to build a winner. He is not immune to the injury bug or occasional mistakes. He also doesn't waste his time engaging discussions with overreacting media/fans.

This discussion 'of course' omits any discourse with Ted Thompson.

This discussion will not receive input from anything official and the Green Bay Packers.

This discussion is one among Packer fan (fans) exclusively.

It's fair to observe that some (fans) will overreact. That is A-OK as their fans.

[red]

Now post the definition of convictions. TT simply knows his is the best way to build a winner and isn't subject to HUGE emotional swings that fans are.

Fans also have a whole hell of a lot more invested in the teams then coaches, gms, or players. They come and go and move on to the next team

We stay

[woodbuck27]

Now post the definition of convictions. TT simply knows his is the best way to build a winner and isn't subject to HUGE emotional swings that fans are. In many ways he reminds me of myself which is probably why I largely defend him.

Example. During the housing boom I sold my house and condo and rented. Everyone around me told me I was crazy. I would NEVER be able to afford another house at the rate they were going up. I was an idiot. I sold 2 paid for properties that would be going up ANOTHER 100% in the next 2 years. God was I stupid.

Granted, this is a more extreme example than fans calling TT an idiot, but the point is, I knew I was right. I didn't engage in pointless arguments or bother defending my position to people who were being irrational (I save that for packerrats fans that are being irrational). TT knows how to build a winner. He is not immune to the injury bug or occasional mistakes. He also doesn't waste his time engaging discussions with overreacting media/fans.

" Now post the definition of convictions. " bobblehead

Sure:

convictions 'defined':

The plural of the word 'conviction' ...

conviction

1. a formal declaration that someone is guilty of a criminal offense, made by the verdict of a jury or the decision of a judge in a court of law.

ie "she had a previous conviction for a similar offense"

synonyms: declaration of guilt, sentence, judgment More ..... ie "his conviction for murder"

antonyms: acquittal

2a. a firmly held belief or opinion.

ie "his conviction that the death was no accident"

synonyms: belief, opinion, view, thought, persuasion, idea, position, stance, article of faith

I'm convinced that this describes you bobblehead, in terms of the topic and focus of this discussion:

Even though we may be on separate sides of a fence... which remains to be seen. This usage of the word certainly might be used to describe me amongst other adjectives.

2b. the quality of showing that one is firmly convinced of what one believes or says.

ie .... "his voice lacked conviction"

synonyms: certainty, certitude, assurance, confidence, sureness, no shadow of a doubt

ie .... "she spoke with conviction"

antonym: uncertainty

[woodbuck27]

I think so. In fact anything is ok. You can act however you want, but you might have to pay a price of others ridiculing you, or being banned if you are like rbaloha or tank.

Back to you too bobblehead on that note.

" if you are like rbaloha or tank" bobblehead

What in Jaysus Blue Thunder are you getting at above?

Don't even imagine the name woodbuck27 in any association with rbaloha and/or Tank and the manner and /or ways that those former members behaved. In that sense don't use my name ...woodbuck27 in the same sentence and sense of what they offered Packerrats.

Are you trying to establish some point above RE: me?

What are you even suggesting? Please respond to this question in regards specifically to me.

Before you go there think about this:

I've been a member here since what the Spring of 2005 and have made over 17 K posts and have survived any banning.

I conduct myself and have well within the boundaries acceptable for some respect and not an outright banning.

As far as any ridicule. I know how to deal with ignorance. I know how to deal with name calling and misdirection in terms of defensive rhetoric.

[pbmax]

This is the criticism of TT, tackling would fall on MM and Capers.

That is a fantastic question though, isn't it?

Thompson loves born and bred football players (see his AJ Hawk comments) but he also more typically engages in projection about what kind of athlete might eventually make a good NFL player (Finley, a lot of O lineman, Jeremy Thompson, Nick Collins, Blackmon, Matthews). This is especially true later in the draft and the best example might be Sam Shields.

Like Wolf he is looking for physical advantage. Does such an approach hurt the basic football ability of the team? Under today's conditions, can a coaching staff teach the unfamiliar how to tackle well?

[pbmax]

Tramon got his money and has been nothing since then, he got paid and has turned to shit, althoug he likes to blame this mystery injury for him being shitty for 3 or 4 years now. If we had signed tramon from another team and he had gotten hurt rigt away, we would be sittinghere yelling about him being a flop. Him and namdi, not much difference. But he' s one of our own, so its ok

Bush is making almost 2 million bucks to be a gunner on the worst special teams in the nfl

Finley was te highest paid TE in the nfl this year, at no point in his career has he ever been the best TE in the nfl. Again if we had signed him from another team we would be screaming about the free agent bust

Hawk is still making over 5 million this year, will be over 6 next year. Restructured or not, he is greatly overpaid

If any of these guys had been signed from other teams, people on here would be blasting TT for wasting money on free agents

I will say this about Tramon, I think everyone overvalued him*.

They year after his deal, prior to the injury, he was struggling in a big way.


* Myself included. Football Outsiders never ranked him as elite save for his big year and his nickname prior to that was Admiral Armbar for the penalties he accrued for sticking out his arm to stay with receivers. He probably was not as bad as the worst criticism, but not as good as he looked for 2010.

[Bossman641]

I can't hammer TT for the OL though, not unless Bulaga and Sherrod line up together and suck.

Spot on. If we were looking at Bulaga-Sitton-EDS-Lang-Barclay with Bakh/Sherrod as the top OT backup and Tretter as the top interior we'd be in a completely different position than where we are now.

The thing that's really killed the team is not just injuries, but injuries to both sides of the ball. People around here like to bitch about the Bear injuries but they've only had injuries to one side of the ball. They've lined up every offensive starter for every game, except Cutler, and McCown has been the same if not an upgrade there.

I'm learning more and more the NFL is simply a matter of who has the healthiest team. The Chiefs have had pretty good injury luck this year. Of course, 2 weeks ago they lose Hali and Houston. Guess who they are forced to trot out - Zombo and Dezman Moses.