Last Dance Green Bay

[RashanGary]

I think Sparkey has really nailed it with this post. You can quibble with some of the details, but the fact of the matter remains that had the Packers done all that, they'd have been even older and slower than they were when they got blown out by a much faster Atlanta Falcons team in the NFC Championship game in, what, the 2016 season?

Sounds like the ghost of the late George Allen and his "Over the Hill Gang" is the influence for Arod's player personnel ideas.

Yep. Rodgers gets attached to guys and doesn't want to see them go.

Jordy for 5 instead of Graham at 10 made sense for a year or two
Hayward should have stayed
Hyde should have stayed



Other than that, the FO made mostly right moves. We would have been worse with ARs plan than with Gutes.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Yep. Rodgers gets attached to guys and doesn't want to see them go.

Jordy for 5 instead of Graham at 10 made sense for a year or two
Hayward should have stayed
Hyde should have stayed



Other than that, the FO made mostly right moves. We would have been worse with ARs plan than with Gutes.

If you look at all cuts of veteran players from all teams you'll find that about 40% of them are "wrong", in that players continue in productive careers.

I hate how the NFL works, but the second guessing is tedious. EXCEPT in the case of Jared Cook where those fuckers really fucked up.


ps. pbmax was the chief defender of that Jared Cook cut. now he's gone and hiding in shame.

[hoosier]

GMing is like baseball: even the best are going to swing and miss more often than we would like. Tony Gwynn whiffed three times in a game once in his career. That was his Jared Cook.

[RashanGary]

GMing is like baseball: even the best are going to swing and miss more often than we would like. Tony Gwynn whiffed three times in a game once in his career. That was his Jared Cook.

It's crazy that my least common ground FYI posters are the most reasonable packer posters.

It's the same as nitpicking Brady or Rodgers on the multiple interception games. It happens to the best.

[Bretsky]

Yep. Rodgers gets attached to guys and doesn't want to see them go.

Jordy for 5 instead of Graham at 10 made sense for a year or two
Hayward should have stayed
Hyde should have stayed



Other than that, the FO made mostly right moves. We would have been worse with ARs plan than with Gutes.

To me keeping Julius Peppers at 3MIL/ Year for another year was a way easier call than some of the others

[call_me_ishmael]

To me keeping Julius Peppers at 3MIL/ Year for another year was a way easier call than some of the others

He's Julius Freaking Peppers, one of the greatest athletes EVER. I am sure he could still suit up and be a deal at 3M. I'd call him if I am loading up for the last dance. Probably has fresh legs.

[Fritz]

After reading about AR's press conference, I do see a little more his point of view. For the team to not see him as an asset in recruiting free agents or at least keeping him informed of hires/draft picks is short-sighted at best, and really just plain stupid. Do you need his approval for every move? No. But if you can use him to recruit free agents at the cost of keeping Jake Kumerow rather than Malik Taylor (or whoever the end-of-roster receiver was at the moment) and calling Rodgers to let him know you're drafting a QB or hiring Coach X, that's not too big a price to pay.

Ted Thompson was a great talent evaluator before the dementia began to catch up to him, and he constructed some really good rosters while keeping the Packers in good cap shape along the way. But he was also short-sighted and not attuned to the way the game (and our culture) was changing. Some of this is on him, though he was from an older generation - like many of us, he just couldn't adapt to the changes brought on by the younger generations.

But Gutekunst was supposed to be the next-gen guy, and it sounds like he's worse than Ted. Rodgers seemed to have some grudging respect for Ted, though he also seems to have had some resentment, but as for Gutekunst, Rodgers seems to think he's just a dildo. Gutes could have come in to the GM role playing the good guy role - "Hey, Aaron, I know Ted was all old-school, but I get how important you are to the franchise and I'd like some input on _____ and I wonder if you'd like to help us recruit _____ to come play in Green Bay." Instead, he sounds like an old-school "I'm the boss and you're the employee" type.

The jury's still out on Gutekunst as GM, but the way he's botched the Rodgers situation is a severe black mark.

Having said that, while it may have benefitted the Packers to keep Hyde (though why the defensive coaches couldn't see he was a safety is beyond me) and a couple others for an extra year, had they kept all the vets Rodgers mentioned, they'd be old, slow, and cap-heavy, with no extra SB's to show for it. I think there's some space between doing everything Rodgers wants them to and doing nothing at all that he would like. The Kumerow thing was bad - the day after Rodgers touted Kumerow, they cut him? Without a call to explain to your HOF QB why you're cutting the guy he just finished praising?

[King Friday]

Yeah, Gute does not come out of this looking strong at this point. He had to cave and do something he had no interest in doing just to get Rodgers back in the fold. His interviews are filled with numerous short, choppy responses...very cold and robotic. I expect this to some extent from that position, but in light of the current situation, it is alarming that Gute has no desire or ability to eke out even a little emotion and empathy.

While I can see where Rodgers is coming from, and he certainly deserves the right to give input and have his viewpoint considered when making certain moves on the roster, building a team is not about merely keeping a bunch of cohesive veterans together. With the cap, you have to sometimes cut someone you may want to keep in order to have the funds to sign this other guy 2-3 years from now. It's not like the front office is making decisions on who to keep only when their contract comes up. They are looking out 3-5 years to see who they want to keep long term and who they need to pay to make that happen. Rodgers seems completely oblivious to this reality.

I'm sure the Packers would love to keep Adams going forward. However, if it comes down to a choice of paying Adams now or having the funds to pay Jaire later... I'm going with Jaire. He's younger and will help the team more long term. That's the kind of approach a front office takes, not merely an immediate look at can we stuff this guy under our cap. The Packers use excess cap room now to help fund how they pay for guys in the future. If Rodgers thinks the front office business is only about stuffing as many guys under the cap as you can now, he is incredibly naive.

[Sparkey]

All of those people bashing Gutes for not communicating info to Rodgers: It really is on Murphy, since he is the so called roof of the three silo system.

This is more of an indictment of the decision making silo system Murphy installed and a flaw of a system that does not have a GM that takes care of all football stuff.

https://zonecoverage.com/2021/packer...ss-conference/

After reading this, it sort of confirms my thoughts that ever since Bob Harlan left, the main issue is Murphy. The obvious take on the SILO system is that Murphy consolidated control over the team with that move. Bob Harlan always let football guys take care of football and business guys, like himself, deal with the other side. However since Murphy played and was an AD for so long, I think he operates as a defacto "owner" er micro manager.

[Fritz]

All of those people bashing Gutes for not communicating info to Rodgers: It really is on Murphy, since he is the so called roof of the three silo system.

This is more of an indictment of the decision making silo system Murphy installed and a flaw of a system that does not have a GM that takes care of all football stuff.

https://zonecoverage.com/2021/packer...ss-conference/

After reading this, it sort of confirms my thoughts that ever since Bob Harlan left, the main issue is Murphy. The obvious take on the SILO system is that Murphy consolidated control over the team with that move. Bob Harlan always let football guys take care of football and business guys, like himself, deal with the other side. However since Murphy played and was an AD for so long, I think he operates as a defacto "owner" er micro manager.

Another good post from Sparkey. PBMax, when he was around, was highly critical of the three-heaed silo, and it does seem Murphy has created a system that isolates all parties. Gutes is not my favorite part of the equation, but Murphy created this system.

[Sparkey]

With Rodgers reworked contract, In 2022 the Packers will be almost 50 million over the projected 208.2 million dollar cap. This really is the "last dance" with this group. Rodgers cap hit in 2022 will be around 46 million.

[Tony Oday]

With Rodgers reworked contract, In 2022 the Packers will be almost 50 million over the projected 208.2 million dollar cap. This really is the "last dance" with this group.

Good. Honestly I would LOVE to see Love start, a mountain of picks and prospects for AR, DA, ZS.

[Spaulding]

The likely prospect of this being the last dance would hurt a lot more if Rodgers wasn't in the twilight of his career and Adams wasn't going to be on the wrong side of 30 for the vast majority of a max contract. Guess next year is the step back after three steps forward over the past two years and hopefully this coming year.

Two years ago the team took a step forward to the NFC Championship game but were clearly outclassed.

One year some would say it wasn't a step forward but it felt like it was out year and the team certainly had chances to win the Tampa game and thus in my eyes although not a win, a small step forward as it indicated we belonged there.

This year, hopefully the final step back to the Super Bowl and a 5th title.

If this isn't all in I don't know what is given the signing of Cobb and Kelly and the pushing of more money to the cap strapped 2022 season.

[HarveyWallbangers]

With Rodgers reworked contract, In 2022 the Packers will be almost 50 million over the projected 208.2 million dollar cap. This really is the "last dance" with this group. Rodgers cap hit in 2022 will be around 46 million.

There are easy ways to get by that--especially if Rodgers isn't here. We would be able to kick the can another year--like we did this year--when the salary cap should skyrocket. That's assuming the Wuhan Virus doesn't ruin another season. From what I've read:

Cutting Preston Smith would save $12M.
Cutting Randall Cobb would save $8M.
Restructuring Kenny Clark and Bakh would save $12M.
Extending Big Z, Jaire, and Amos could save $20M.
What is Adams cap hit next year? I'm guessing extending him might free up space next year.

Finally, trading Rodgers would free up $17M.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Adams cap hit next season? His contract expires after this season. If 12 returns and the 3 headed monster of Ball/Gutekumst/Murphy refuses to make 17 the highest paid Wr in the universe, the Pack can always tag 17.

Tag should be around 18-21M.