OFFICIAL BRETT THE LIVING LEGEND THREAD

[Partial]

The drop by Bubba may have been the game right there; it's hilarious that haters will show up with their needles every time he falls.


There are a few posters here who don't talk anythign Packer. Mobb Deep, 007, Partial, Paco and I'm sure I'm missing one or two others.

They spend their entire time posting in the Favre thread or rip rodgers and take every opportunity to cut at TT (the Packers GM that many here really like). These people do not deserve any mercy. As far as I"m concerned if all they care about is Brett fAvre they should find a Jets forum to discuss it because what they do is trolling here.

LIke I said a couple days ago. I'm more than happy to take it, but it goes both ways and everyone will have their day.

WTF are you talking about? I discuss Packers more than just about anyone here... That is simply crazy talk.

Why must those three topics be lumped together? I think TT is doing a fine job. Brett Favre is a great quarterback. I haven't seen anything out of Aaron Rodgers to convince me he will be great. They are all completely unrelated, yet somehow you seem to think that if everyone doesn't agree with you then they're wrong.

[digitaldean]

1 TD, 6 picks in the last 4 games. Not my definition of playing well.

In his defense, he has been sacked 9 times. With the amt. of money they spent on that line, it's inexcusable. Coles dropping a clutch pass. Favre underthrows open receivers or throws baffling across the field passes for picks. Defense can't beat Seneca Wallace, SENECA FREAKIN' WALLACE!

Mangenious will be run out of town as the convenient scapegoat (though he has done just as much to contribute to their demise)

[cpk1994]

I wouldn't doubt if Mangini is fired after the season. Talk about horrible coaching today, wow. Especially not punting on the last possession that would allow Seattle to get a FG anyhow....just DUMB

Coles and Bubba also dropped balls on plays that would have been big gains. The Jets lost as a team today, that's for sure. On the other hand, you've got to give the Seahawk's credit, they were hell bent on winning that game for Holmgren.


The drop by Bubba may have been the game right there; it's hilarious that haters will show up with their needles every time he falls.Kind of like how hillarious it is everytine the haters show up every time Rodgers falls? :roll:

[Bretsky]

I wouldn't doubt if Mangini is fired after the season. Talk about horrible coaching today, wow. Especially not punting on the last possession that would allow Seattle to get a FG anyhow....just DUMB

Coles and Bubba also dropped balls on plays that would have been big gains. The Jets lost as a team today, that's for sure. On the other hand, you've got to give the Seahawk's credit, they were hell bent on winning that game for Holmgren.


The drop by Bubba may have been the game right there; it's hilarious that haters will show up with their needles every time he falls.Kind of like how hillarious it is everytine the haters show up every time Rodgers falls? :roll:


ah, and who is a AROD hater ? Being skeptical is far from being a hater :!: There are many more in here not fond of TT

[cpk1994]

I wouldn't doubt if Mangini is fired after the season. Talk about horrible coaching today, wow. Especially not punting on the last possession that would allow Seattle to get a FG anyhow....just DUMB

Coles and Bubba also dropped balls on plays that would have been big gains. The Jets lost as a team today, that's for sure. On the other hand, you've got to give the Seahawk's credit, they were hell bent on winning that game for Holmgren.


The drop by Bubba may have been the game right there; it's hilarious that haters will show up with their needles every time he falls.Kind of like how hillarious it is everytine the haters show up every time Rodgers falls? :roll:


ah, and who is a AROD hater ? Being skeptical is far from being a hater :!: There are many more in here not fond of TTPaco is. Merlin is. I can even pull up the quote. Yes there are haters in here.

[Joemailman]

1 TD, 6 picks in the last 4 games. Not my definition of playing well.

In his defense, he has been sacked 9 times. With the amt. of money they spent on that line, it's inexcusable. Coles dropping a clutch pass. Favre underthrows open receivers or throws baffling across the field passes for picks. Defense can't beat Seneca Wallace, SENECA FREAKIN' WALLACE!

Mangenious will be run out of town as the convenient scapegoat (though he has done just as much to contribute to their demise)

Brett's the greatest Packer ever, but his struggles this December continue a trend that's been going on for a few years. Not sure if his arm is dead after about 12 games, if the pressure to be Brett Favre gets the best of him, or if it's weather-related. Whatever, I kind of hope he calls it a career this time. Don't want to see him end like Johnny U.

[b bulldog]

Brett is a shell of what he once was and as his legs tire, his throws get very eratic. Brett is a top 3 GBP player of all-time but at best he is average now. Thomas Jones is their Offensive MVP.

[packinpatland]

I don't mind where you post em, though I may not agree with them.

Is this the real Scott Campbell?

[RashanGary]

Brett is a shell of what he once was and as his legs tire, his throws get very eratic. Brett is a top 3 GBP player of all-time but at best he is average now. Thomas Jones is their Offensive MVP.


Best offensive Jets IMO:

Thomas Jones
Alan Faneca
Lavernius Coles
Jerico Cotchery
Brett Favre


His legs are gone. I agree. He was getting taken down with two fingers of a defender. I was switching between games and one QB would be breaking arm tackles and the next couldn't break a finger tackle. It was shocking how physically weak he was. Then his passes where he didn't have his feet set were just pathetic. In the past he could actually do that stuff. You see the occasional flash, but the impressive physical play has deteriorated to an embarassing low. Him not working out this offseason and his age caught up. He's done. When he didn't put the work in to stay up to NFL level, I think MM/TT thought it was time to move on. In hindsight, they were right.

[packinpatland]

Legs are gone? He had a 27 yard (called) play last week.
OK........they aren't what they used to be.

[Zool]

Brett is a shell of what he once was and as his legs tire, his throws get very eratic. Brett is a top 3 GBP player of all-time but at best he is average now. Thomas Jones is their Offensive MVP.


Best offensive Jets IMO:

Thomas Jones
Alan Faneca
Lavernius Coles
Jerico Cotchery
Brett Favre


His legs are gone. I agree. He was getting taken down with two fingers of a defender. I was switching between games and one QB would be breaking arm tackles and the next couldn't break a finger tackle. It was shocking how physically weak he was. Then his passes where he didn't have his feet set were just pathetic. In the past he could actually do that stuff. You see the occasional flash, but the impressive physical play has deteriorated to an embarassing low. Him not working out this offseason and his age caught up. He's done. When he didn't put the work in to stay up to NFL level, I think MM/TT thought it was time to move on. In hindsight, they were right.

I think I'd throw Leon Washington right in there near the top.

[channtheman]

Legs are gone? He had a 27 yard (called) play last week.
OK........they aren't what they used to be.

Yup, Favre is clearly still at the top of the game and should be the MVP this year. Also, Rodgers and Pennington are both horrible.

[GrnBay007]

The drop by Bubba may have been the game right there; it's hilarious that haters will show up with their needles every time he falls.


There are a few posters here who don't talk anythign Packer. Mobb Deep, 007, Partial, Paco and I'm sure I'm missing one or two others.

They spend their entire time posting in the Favre thread or rip rodgers and take every opportunity to cut at TT (the Packers GM that many here really like). These people do not deserve any mercy. As far as I"m concerned if all they care about is Brett fAvre they should find a Jets forum to discuss it because what they do is trolling here.

LIke I said a couple days ago. I'm more than happy to take it, but it goes both ways and everyone will have their day.

Nice

[Partial]

Brett is a shell of what he once was and as his legs tire, his throws get very eratic. Brett is a top 3 GBP player of all-time but at best he is average now. Thomas Jones is their Offensive MVP.


Best offensive Jets IMO:

Thomas Jones
Alan Faneca
Lavernius Coles
Jerico Cotchery
Brett Favre


His legs are gone. I agree. He was getting taken down with two fingers of a defender. I was switching between games and one QB would be breaking arm tackles and the next couldn't break a finger tackle. It was shocking how physically weak he was. Then his passes where he didn't have his feet set were just pathetic. In the past he could actually do that stuff. You see the occasional flash, but the impressive physical play has deteriorated to an embarassing low. Him not working out this offseason and his age caught up. He's done. When he didn't put the work in to stay up to NFL level, I think MM/TT thought it was time to move on. In hindsight, they were right.

Impossible to tell. Too many variables.

[Partial]

Legs are gone? He had a 27 yard (called) play last week.
OK........they aren't what they used to be.

Yup, Favre is clearly still at the top of the game and should be the MVP this year. Also, Rodgers and Pennington are both horrible.

Why the sarcasm for a nice person pointing out that obviously his legs are not completely gone?

Assbag.

And yes, Pennington has always been below average to average. Rodgers is TBD but hasn't shown anything yet.

[GBRulz]

I'll be lookign forward to 007 posting all of the great NY articles this week, haha. Oh wait, I'll have to dig them out this week ;)


1 TD, 6 INTs in last 4 games. Not Brett's fault :) :)

Why do you have to be such a fucktard? If people want to post articles, they can.

[Partial]

I really think that Justin Harrell has stepped over the line today. He's an asshole, and I vote to ban him. He doesn't contribute any knowledge, all he does is cause controversy in the RARE occasion he gets something right (IE Brett having one bad game).

[HarveyWallbangers]

I vote for banning Harrell, but only if Partial goes with him. Unfortunately, you are as over the top as he is, but I guess it depends on your point of view. BTW, do you have any more "facts" that I can prove wrong?

[Partial]

I vote for banning Harrell, but only if Partial goes with him. Unfortunately, you are as over the top as he is, but I guess it depends on your point of view. BTW, do you have any more "facts" that I can prove wrong?

Ha. Right. I surely go around attacking people, relating their personal life to their enjoyment of watching Brett Favre. Whatever you say, Harv.

[Tarlam!]

Why do you have to be such a fucktard?

Uhumm - you told us what a delightful guy Nick is in person.

[Tarlam!]

I really think that Justin Harrell has stepped over the line today. He's an asshole, and I vote to ban him. He doesn't contribute any knowledge, all he does is cause controversy in the RARE occasion he gets something right (IE Brett having one bad game).

I completely disagree with your opinion on Nick's contributions. He starts threads these days with a pseudo journalistic slant. I don't always agree with what his content reveals, but it's far from drivel. Indeed, some sports writers out there could learn a lot about the Pack from our very own Nick.

I also find calling for bannings childish. We are a community and, Tank notwithstanding, we're in this together.

I know Mad well enough to know nothing will materialize from your plea Parsh. But, you should be the last person around here calling to ban another poster, since you are on just about eberybody's shitlist as far as I can tell.

[RashanGary]

I spend enough time here that the Favre trolling just gets darn right annoying. I'm not the type to call the authorities (or mad in this case) to cry. I'll take the trolling shit all season long, but I'll give it back too. A week ago the trolling hit an all time high so Packer fans fighting back should have been expected.

As far as dragging up peoples personal lives, I don't do that. I don't take any time to dig up peoples personal lives nor will I ever.

[Partial]

I spend enough time here that the Favre trolling just gets darn right annoying. I'm not the type to call the authorities (or mad in this case) to cry. I'll take the trolling shit all season long, but I'll give it back too. A week ago the trolling hit an all time high so Packer fans fighting back should have been expected.

As far as dragging up peoples personal lives, I don't do that. I don't take any time to dig up peoples personal lives nor will I ever.

http://blog.pharmalive.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/o_rly.jpg

"Don't bother Smile Brett lovers fall under three categories.

1. My dad didn't love me so Brett is my adopted father. He's always been there for me and can do no wrong (Partial)

2. I couldn't stay loyal to a husband so I spend my lonely days proving I can be loyal to Brett (007)

and

3. I'm a wanna be football player so I live my life through Favre (Nutz)



As you can see, there is an emotional connection that is stronger to these people than reality Wink. There is no need to have conversations with anyone that you suspect belongs to affore mentioned emotionally invested groups.

You're welcome. I just saved you a lot of wasted time."


Then, when everyone says you're out of line and out of control, you respond with.

"You're a big boy, you can handle it".

Dems da facts.

[Tarlam!]

Just stop it. This is garbage any an potential new members are being influenced. Both of you are vets here and have a significant responsibility to keep this a Packers friendly site.

[The Shadow]

Dear, it's Christmas! The children!
Show a little charity.

[Partial]

Just stop it. This is garbage any an potential new members are being influenced. Both of you are vets here and have a significant responsibility to keep this a Packers friendly site.

I agree, thats why I don't post garbage like above. That's Harrell taking unnecessary shots. It's pretty low when you've got to personally attack someone on the internet.

[Tarlam!]

I agree, thats why I don't post garbage like above. That's Harrell taking unnecessary shots. It's pretty low when you've got to personally attack someone on the internet.

Then use the damned PM option, Parsh. This crap has got to stop in public. We are losing contributors because they can't be bothered to sift threw the crap to get to the valued posts. We used to have the most knowledgeable board in all Packerdom.

[Bossman641]

I agree. JH's post was a little over the top. Wish he would cut that crap out. He goes in spurts where he makes good posts and then he slips one of those in there and we are right back at square one. Even if I understand the emotional connection many people feel that he was trying to convey it is unnecessary to attach names.

[run pMc]

I decided to finally look at this thread, starting about 2 pages back. I'm glad I didn't start from page 1.

I'll try to get it back on target...
Seems like BF had a bad day yesterday and is slumping. No surprise there -- he didn't put in the offseason work, and the weather is getting worse. (FWIW, I think the NYJ have a talented team.) He's always good for a couple of clunkers per year (e.g., the L to OAK), and Holmgren usually has his number.

He's a decent QB, but he didn't put up Pro Bowl worthy numbers and is going thru a tough stretch. He would be going through the same struggles if TT hadn't traded him, and we'd still be posting crap (myself included) complaining about the OL and DL.

Whatever.
I think he'll be playing for NY next year, Rodgers will still be the QB here and he will improve, and life will go on (for most of us).

It would be interesting to see how the fans handle it if the Jets don't make the playoffs by losing to Pennington and the 'Fins.

[pack4to84]

I decided to finally look at this thread, starting about 2 pages back. I'm glad I didn't start from page 1.

I'll try to get it back on target...
Seems like BF had a bad day yesterday and is slumping. No surprise there -- he didn't put in the offseason work, and the weather is getting worse. (FWIW, I think the NYJ have a talented team.) He's always good for a couple of clunkers per year (e.g., the L to OAK), and Holmgren usually has his number.

He's a decent QB, but he didn't put up Pro Bowl worthy numbers and is going thru a tough stretch. He would be going through the same struggles if TT hadn't traded him, and we'd still be posting crap (myself included) complaining about the OL and DL.

Whatever.
I think he'll be playing for NY next year, Rodgers will still be the QB here and he will improve, and life will go on (for most of us).

It would be interesting to see how the fans handle it if the Jets don't make the playoffs by losing to Pennington and the 'Fins.Ouch that would hurt. Who has done more for there team Brett or Chad? 1-15 team to the playoffs next year. Bill P. is looking like a genius.

[Cheesehead Craig]

It would be interesting to see how the fans handle it if the Jets don't make the playoffs by losing to Pennington and the 'Fins.
Especially with how the 2 have played this past month when it's been crunch time. Chad has been fantastic while Favre has faltered.

Next week should be a fun game to watch in NY. Heaven help the Jets if they lose.

[prsnfoto]

Favre has played in 92 games in which his team trailed by 8 or less points with 5:00 or less to play in the 4th...

His record in those games 23-69.

Partial will conveniently ignore this.


This seems very suspect since he has over 40 game winning drives to his credit. Did you pull this out of your ass right before you inserted TT.

[Zool]

Favre has played in 92 games in which his team trailed by 8 or less points with 5:00 or less to play in the 4th...

His record in those games 23-69.

Partial will conveniently ignore this.


This seems very suspect since he has over 40 game winning drives to his credit. Did you pull this out of your ass right before you inserted TT.

40 is in the 4th or OT. The 4th quarter is 15:00. The stat that Chevelle put up is the final 5:00.

[Badgerinmaine]

It would be interesting to see how the fans handle it if the Jets don't make the playoffs by losing to Pennington and the 'Fins.
Especially with how the 2 have played this past month when it's been crunch time. Chad has been fantastic while Favre has faltered.

Next week should be a fun game to watch in NY. Heaven help the Jets if they lose.
The New York media would lead one hellacious beatdown, especially after the Jets lost to Seattle.

[digitaldean]

NY Post and other sites calling that team "GAG GREEN"

Favre really should call it a career. No hokey pokey, soap opera, tearful farewell. Just say, "It's been great, but I'm done". The NY media will be flat out merciless if he comes back next year and has a worse year than this one.

[prsnfoto]

Favre has played in 92 games in which his team trailed by 8 or less points with 5:00 or less to play in the 4th...

His record in those games 23-69.

Partial will conveniently ignore this.


This seems very suspect since he has over 40 game winning drives to his credit. Did you pull this out of your ass right before you inserted TT.

40 is in the 4th or OT. The 4th quarter is 15:00. The stat that Chevelle put up is the final 5:00.


He has 93 losses and 160 wins as a QB it is a lot easier to believe 25% of his wins are comeback than it is to believe that 74% of his losses have been in the last 5 minutes down by 8 or less. I am pretty sure TT found a warm new home.

[Gunakor]

Favre has played in 92 games in which his team trailed by 8 or less points with 5:00 or less to play in the 4th...

His record in those games 23-69.

Partial will conveniently ignore this.


This seems very suspect since he has over 40 game winning drives to his credit. Did you pull this out of your ass right before you inserted TT.

40 is in the 4th or OT. The 4th quarter is 15:00. The stat that Chevelle put up is the final 5:00.


He has 93 losses and 160 wins as a QB it is a lot easier to believe 25% of his wins are comeback than it is to believe that 74% of his losses have been in the last 5 minutes down by 8 or less. I am pretty sure TT found a warm new home.

Why don't you produce a stat then that proves Chevelle's story wrong then? None of this "It's a lot easier to believe" crap, just the black and white facts that cannot be disputed. Chevelle posted a fact that is not reliant on ones "belief". Favre has 40 fourth quarter comebacks, most of those coming with the winning points scored well before the 5 minute mark and the defense protecting that lead until the final gun. This isn't opinion or belief, it is reality and can be proven simply by looking in a stat book. If you'd like to dispute his claim, then provide supporting evidence to the contrary. Otherwise, how would we know you aren't pulling your facts out of your ass right before you insert BF?

[HarveyWallbangers]

23-69 may not be a bad record for being behind with 5 minutes left. We don't know if he even got the ball in position to score the tying or go ahead points in some of these games. We don't know whether the offense scored and then the defense gave it up. We don't know if the team was down 8 and needed a TD and two point conversion. We don't know if he got the team in position and the kicker missed. Heck, there wasn't even a two point conversion his first two years with the Packers, so some of these games could have been played when an 8 point deficit with 5 minutes left was nearly insurmountable. We need more context. I'd guess most QBs are well under .500 in these same situations.

[Zool]

23-69 may not be a bad record for being behind with 5 minutes left. We don't know if he even got the ball in position to score the tying or go ahead points in some of these games. We don't know whether the offense scored and then the defense gave it up. We don't know if the team was down 8 and needed a TD and two point conversion. We don't know if he got the team in position and the kicker missed. Heck, there wasn't even a two point conversion his first two years with the Packers, so some of these games could have been played when an 8 point deficit with 5 minutes left was nearly insurmountable. We need more context. I'd guess most QBs are well under .500 in these same situations.

I dont think anyone is saying its a bad stat, but its a very telling stat to the "Aaron Rodgers sucks" crew.

[Gunakor]

23-69 may not be a bad record for being behind with 5 minutes left. We don't know if he even got the ball in position to score the tying or go ahead points in some of these games. We don't know whether the offense scored and then the defense gave it up. We don't know if the team was down 8 and needed a TD and two point conversion. We don't know if he got the team in position and the kicker missed. Heck, there wasn't even a two point conversion his first two years with the Packers, so some of these games could have been played when an 8 point deficit with 5 minutes left was nearly insurmountable. We need more context. I'd guess most QBs are well under .500 in these same situations.

If Rodgers wasn't at or slightly over .500 in these situations this season, we still don't make the playoffs and it's still Aaron's fault. Because, of course, regardless of Favre's record in these situations during his career, he'd have been 6 for 6 in that situation THIS year. And we'd be going to the playoffs. Just ask Partial or Paco, they'll tell you. They know.

[prsnfoto]

Favre has played in 92 games in which his team trailed by 8 or less points with 5:00 or less to play in the 4th...

His record in those games 23-69.

Partial will conveniently ignore this.


This seems very suspect since he has over 40 game winning drives to his credit. Did you pull this out of your ass right before you inserted TT.

40 is in the 4th or OT. The 4th quarter is 15:00. The stat that Chevelle put up is the final 5:00.


He has 93 losses and 160 wins as a QB it is a lot easier to believe 25% of his wins are comeback than it is to believe that 74% of his losses have been in the last 5 minutes down by 8 or less. I am pretty sure TT found a warm new home.

Why don't you produce a stat then that proves Chevelle's story wrong then? None of this "It's a lot easier to believe" crap, just the black and white facts that cannot be disputed. Chevelle posted a fact that is not reliant on ones "belief". Favre has 40 fourth quarter comebacks, most of those coming with the winning points scored well before the 5 minute mark and the defense protecting that lead until the final gun. This isn't opinion or belief, it is reality and can be proven simply by looking in a stat book. If you'd like to dispute his claim, then provide supporting evidence to the contrary. Otherwise, how would we know you aren't pulling your facts out of your ass right before you insert BF?


I googled the stats and could not find his to be true he did not give a reference and yet you take his to be fact I did not state mine to be a fact but simply find that hard to believe. I did look at Favre's overall record and found it on Stat's to be 160-93 now if you think the Packers only lost 24 games in 16 years by 8 points or less then by all means I am a fucktard I was not taking a shot at AR or loving BF I simply don't believe it, as far as Chevelle goes he is TT lover BF hater on this site and Packerchatters, I don't like TT and make no bones about it but he has been GM for 4 years and has a losing record and has to have at least 10 loses by 8 or more.(Just a guess buddy)

[Gunakor]

Favre has played in 92 games in which his team trailed by 8 or less points with 5:00 or less to play in the 4th...

His record in those games 23-69.

Partial will conveniently ignore this.


This seems very suspect since he has over 40 game winning drives to his credit. Did you pull this out of your ass right before you inserted TT.

40 is in the 4th or OT. The 4th quarter is 15:00. The stat that Chevelle put up is the final 5:00.


He has 93 losses and 160 wins as a QB it is a lot easier to believe 25% of his wins are comeback than it is to believe that 74% of his losses have been in the last 5 minutes down by 8 or less. I am pretty sure TT found a warm new home.

Why don't you produce a stat then that proves Chevelle's story wrong then? None of this "It's a lot easier to believe" crap, just the black and white facts that cannot be disputed. Chevelle posted a fact that is not reliant on ones "belief". Favre has 40 fourth quarter comebacks, most of those coming with the winning points scored well before the 5 minute mark and the defense protecting that lead until the final gun. This isn't opinion or belief, it is reality and can be proven simply by looking in a stat book. If you'd like to dispute his claim, then provide supporting evidence to the contrary. Otherwise, how would we know you aren't pulling your facts out of your ass right before you insert BF?


I googled the stats and could not find his to be true he did not give a reference and yet you take his to be fact I did not state mine to be a fact but simply find that hard to believe. I did look at Favre's overall record and found it on Stat's to be 160-93 now if you think the Packers only lost 24 games in 16 years by 8 points or less then by all means I am a fucktard I was not taking a shot at AR or loving BF I simply don't believe it, as far as Chevelle goes he is TT lover BF hater on this site and Packerchatters, I don't like TT and make no bones about it but he has been GM for 4 years and has a losing record and has to have at least 10 loses by 8 or more.(Just a guess buddy)

Well, you have a valid point. Chevelle, please post a link to where you have gotten your info from.

That said, I tend to believe him not simply because I agree with him, but moreso because he presented his argument as fact. He used clear numbers rather than estimates (i.e. "92" games in that situation as opposed to "90" or "100", and has "23" wins in that situation as opposed to "20" or "25"), and refrained from the phrase "I find it easier/harder to believe...". His LOOKS like fact, yours obviously is a guess.

[Chevelle2]

Heres the link fellas

http://www.madison.com/wsj/mad/sports/318605



According to STATS, Inc., before Sunday's game, Favre had played in 92 games in which his team was trailing by 8 points or fewer with 5 minutes or less remaining in the fourth quarter. Favre's record in those games? 23-69.

[Gunakor]

Heres the link fellas

http://www.madison.com/wsj/mad/sports/318605



According to STATS, Inc., before Sunday's game, Favre had played in 92 games in which his team was trailing by 8 points or fewer with 5 minutes or less remaining in the fourth quarter. Favre's record in those games? 23-69.

Prsnfoto, is the Wisconsin State Journal wrong here? I don't think they could print/post a story like this if they didn't do their homework and verify their facts first. I don't think they are guessing.

[gex]

another bad game by favre. he is wearing out his welcome on jets fans.

just make the playoffs so i can get my 2nd round pick old man

Oh, c'mon........you guys that continue to "keep an eye" on Favre use the excuse that it's just all about the draft pick the Packers will get. Can't admit you still want to follow him! :D

....it's ok, really! :P

Jets fans will be just fine as long as the Jets are winning games.


QFT...

packers would certainly switch records

Most of the threads srtarted with Favre in the title or directly related to him are started by these very same people.

[Fritz]

Heres the link fellas

http://www.madison.com/wsj/mad/sports/318605



According to STATS, Inc., before Sunday's game, Favre had played in 92 games in which his team was trailing by 8 points or fewer with 5 minutes or less remaining in the fourth quarter. Favre's record in those games? 23-69.

Prsnfoto, is the Wisconsin State Journal wrong here? I don't think they could print/post a story like this if they didn't do their homework and verify their facts first. I don't think they are guessing.

Nicely done, Chevelle. Partial likes to throw "facts" out there all the time. Seems he's having a hard time with this one.

[Chevelle2]

Heres the link fellas

http://www.madison.com/wsj/mad/sports/318605



According to STATS, Inc., before Sunday's game, Favre had played in 92 games in which his team was trailing by 8 points or fewer with 5 minutes or less remaining in the fourth quarter. Favre's record in those games? 23-69.

Prsnfoto, is the Wisconsin State Journal wrong here? I don't think they could print/post a story like this if they didn't do their homework and verify their facts first. I don't think they are guessing.

Nicely done, Chevelle. Partial likes to throw "facts" out there all the time. Seems he's having a hard time with this one.

No doubt....although I could have avoided this by just linking it the first time

:D

[gex]

Phins vs Bretts Jets............its gonna be good!

[Badgerinmaine]

"The Jets, and Brett Favre, are done", saith New York Magazine:
http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2008/12/the_jets_and_brett_favre_are_d.html

[packinpatland]

Honest, I'm not trying to rationalize this.......but geeez, I've watched every Jet game this season......when the protection was there, Favre was too. He doesn't lead the league with the 30 sacs, but that's alot.
This probably would be a good time to call it quits.

[denverYooper]

"The Jets, and Brett Favre, are done", saith New York Magazine:
http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2008/12/the_jets_and_brett_favre_are_d.html

That's pretty harsh.

I'd like to see the old man pull one more bit of magic out against the 'phins.

[GrnBay007]

Merry Christmas JH!




http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/12/23/sports/FBN-Seahawks-Holmgren-Favre.php

Mike Holmgren: Brett Favre's still got it


RENTON, Wash.: People in and around New York — and quite a few more across the NFL — are starting to think Brett Favre's career may be as done as the Jets' playoff chances.

Mike Holmgren is definitely not in New York. And he's just days from being out of the NFL.

Favre's friend, confidant and former coach defended the three-time MVP on Monday.

Holmgren said the Seahawks having perhaps their best defensive game of the season, and not Favre being 39, had more to do with No. 4 throwing two interceptions and getting sacked four times Sunday in an upset loss at lowly Seattle, which may have crushed the Jets' playoff hopes.

The Jets (9-6) managed a season-low three points in their third loss in four games. They now must beat Miami at home Sunday and have either New England or Baltimore lose to get into the playoffs.

A season that turned on the very last corner
Favre was selected to the Pro Bowl for the 10th time last week and earlier this season threw six touchdown passes in a win over Arizona. But he has one touchdown pass and six interceptions in the last four games. He had his second-lowest passer rating of the season on Sunday (48.7).

"You get to expect so many great things from him — and he's had games this season that were incredibly good — that when it's not incredibly good some people have a tendency to say, 'What's wrong?' Well, there's nothing wrong," Holmgren said Monday, seven days before his one-year sabbatical from football begins.

"It's just that our defense played pretty well. It was snowing like crazy. We got to him, we sacked him a couple times, which was good. We hadn't done that lately. I have a tendency to say I think he played his game. I just think we were better on defense."

Favre started 8-for-9 but finished 18-for-31 with the two interceptions and just 187 yards, his seventh game below 200 yards passing this season. And it came against a defense that entered Sunday allowing a league-high 260.9 yards passing per game.

Passing through at-times heavy snow, the quarterback renowned for his excellence in such conditions — "which is true," Holmgren said Monday — continually underthrew receivers. He was short to Laveranues Coles near the Seahawks 30 in the fourth quarter while New York trailed 10-3, and behind David Clowney in the third quarter at the Seahawks 40.

That gave more credence to the theory a 39-year-old passing shoulder is finally betraying Favre.

"I felt comfortable. Never really felt uncomfortable," an obviously disappointed and somber Favre said after the game. "We were just never able to get it going.

"Once again: Three points. I don't care how well you're moving it between the two goal lines ... the bottom line is getting it into the end zone."

New York was still down 10-3 while at its own 12 with 3:06 left, but Darryl Tapp sacked Favre on first down. On fourth-and-2, Favre heaved perhaps his longest and best pass of his otherwise poor day. The ball reached Coles in stride at the Seahawks 40, but bounced off his hands then chest, then the hands of defensive back Kelly Jennings before falling to the turf.

Seattle kicked the clinching field goal a few plays later.

Holmgren brought Favre to Green Bay in 1992 and molded the former option quarterback at Southern Mississippi into a champion and a legend, before the coach left for Seattle prior to the 1999 season. Because Holmgren knows firsthand all that Favre has accomplished, he braced for what he might do to the 3-11 Seahawks entering Sunday.

"The fact that we were playing the Jets, he was on the Jets, and it was snowing — it was like it was too much. It was just unbelievable," Holmgren said. "He is one of the greatest competitors I have ever seen and been around. Of course I was nervous about it, but like I said, our defense I think stepped up and did a great job."

The upset dropped the supposed king of cold-weather passing to 1-6 on the road in his career in games played with temperatures of 34 degrees or below. He was 43-6 in such conditions in Green Bay.

Holmgren said that disparity is primarily a factor of simply playing home games all those winters in frigid Wisconsin, against teams from more temperate climates that were literally stunned by the cold.

But Holmgren also said Favre has "monster" hands that allow him to throw a brick-like ball on cold days, while many others can't grip it well.

It's forecast to be 52 degrees with rain showers at the Meadowlands in East Rutherford, N.J., on Sunday, when the Jets fights for their playoff lives against the Dolphins.

Favre had better get a grip on his almost-lost season by then.

[Harlan Huckleby]

But Holmgren also said Favre has "monster" hands that allow him to throw a brick-like ball on cold days, while many others can't grip it well.

monster hands, but what's the story on his shoulder? I see messaging scrolling on the bottom of ESPN that Favre's should is falling off.

[b bulldog]

He is old and he should have retired. The guy can't be coun ted on any longer to be a good QB for 17 weeks.

[Fosco33]

A bit of ego coming out here...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/football/nfl/12/24/bc.fbn.jets.favre.sfare.ap/index.html

Why not get an MRI if your shoulder is jacked? - to protect the streak and then stay retired if it's really messed up.

Mangini is saying the right things but I bet there are some other discussions going on (like, sure - come back for 8-10 games next year and then be the back-up the 2nd half the season).

[RashanGary]

The Patriots very well could lose to the Bills on the road. If that happens, the Jets would have to win and we'd get a 2nd round pick. The hope is still alive although Brett is doing his best Gus Frerotte impression to screw us on his way out the door.

[Fosco33]

The Patriots very well could lose to the Bills on the road. If that happens, the Jets would have to win and we'd get a 2nd round pick. The hope is still alive although Brett is doing his best Gus Frerotte impression to screw us on his way out the door.

Beating the Bills has been a constant for the Pats. They've won 10 straight and 15 of their last 16 against Buffalo, outscoring the Bills 150-40 in their last four visits to the Bills and holding them to 168 total yards in a 20-10 win at home earlier this year.

I also could easily see the Jets lose to the Fins. Especially with Chad being motivated and Favre possibly hurt...

Could be the Dolphins winning the division and Jets/Pats sitting on outside looking in (unless Jags win and Pats get the wild card). What a year.

[RashanGary]

You're probably right, Fosco. The Pats will probably beat the Bills and the Jets have gotten bottom of the barrel QB play the last 4 weeks. It's tough to beat decent teams with a 6 to 1 INT/TD ratio even if you have the AFC's leading rusher and a good defense. I'm still hoping though. We seem to do pretty well with picks between 24 and 60.

Rodgers
Collins
Jennings
Nelson
Colledge

[GBRulz]

Honest, I'm not trying to rationalize this.......but geeez, I've watched every Jet game this season......when the protection was there, Favre was too. He doesn't lead the league with the 30 sacs, but that's alot.
This probably would be a good time to call it quits.

I agree, it's time for him to hang up the cleats. I saw him in a presser yesterday and you can tell that he's ready to be done. Yet he says he doesn't regret coming to play for the Jets. Well, like he'd say so publicly anyhow.

[Partial]

Anyone else think its hysterical that Favre's injury doesn't get any play, when judging by the way it is making him play, is probably far worse, when Rodgers "gutted" it out?

ROFL. I attribute Favre's poor performances these past few weeks to the injury. He is clearly pretty hurt or the shoulder wouldn't even be brought up.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Anyone else think its hysterical that Favre's injury doesn't get any play, when judging by the way it is making him play, is probably far worse, when Rodgers "gutted" it out?

ROFL. I attribute Favre's poor performances these past few weeks to the injury. He is clearly pretty hurt or the shoulder wouldn't even be brought up.

unless the shoulder was brought up as an excuse for his poor performance.

I'm not saying this is true, but it is just as likely as your theory.

Some people thought Favre would start slow this year because he was working on a new team. Others thought he would have a strong season and fade towards the end because he is old.

[MJZiggy]

We've always heard about Favre's injuries. And the more he's played through, the more of a fuss is made about it which is fine. But if it's too hurt to play with and he plays anyway, that's just stupid. If he can't perform, he's only hurting the team.

[Fosco33]

We've always heard about Favre's injuries. And the more he's played through, the more of a fuss is made about it which is fine. But if it's too hurt to play with and he plays anyway, that's just stupid. If he can't perform, he's only hurting the team.

totally agree

I find it odd that he'd wait 'til after the season to get it checked out and acknowledges that 'they'll probably find something.'

It might be the best thing for him - to have an excuse to leave the game on something other than his ego.

[sheepshead]

Does anyone think he'll play next year? I don't.

[Patler]

Holmgren brought Favre to Green Bay in 1992 and molded the former option quarterback at Southern Mississippi into a champion and a legend, before the coach left for Seattle prior to the 1999 season. .

..and all this time I thought it was Wolf who brought Favre to GB! :lol:

[sheepshead]

Holmgren brought Favre to Green Bay in 1992 and molded the former option quarterback at Southern Mississippi into a champion and a legend, before the coach left for Seattle prior to the 1999 season. .

..and all this time I thought it was Wolf who brought Favre to GB! :lol:


'xactly, I'll bet dollars to donuts Holmy went "A first round pick for who??"
But that's the AP for you. They can pretty much write whatever they want and sleep well.

[Noodle]

I agree, it's time for him to hang up the cleats. I saw him in a presser yesterday and you can tell that he's ready to be done. Yet he says he doesn't regret coming to play for the Jets. Well, like he'd say so publicly anyhow.

GB, you know #4 better than anybody on this board -- don't you think he's kind of proud of what he accomplished in NY? I gotta think it's been a kick for him out there, kind of like dating a hot chick after you just got dumped.

[digitaldean]

Holmgren brought Favre to Green Bay in 1992 and molded the former option quarterback at Southern Mississippi into a champion and a legend, before the coach left for Seattle prior to the 1999 season. .

..and all this time I thought it was Wolf who brought Favre to GB! :lol:


'xactly, I'll bet dollars to donuts Holmy went "A first round pick for who??"
But that's the AP for you. They can pretty much write whatever they want and sleep well.

Fact checking from the AP?? For shame...

AP has shown over the past several years to have more opinion inserted into their stories and kind of gloss over facts.

[cpk1994]

Holmgren brought Favre to Green Bay in 1992 and molded the former option quarterback at Southern Mississippi into a champion and a legend, before the coach left for Seattle prior to the 1999 season. .

..and all this time I thought it was Wolf who brought Favre to GB! :lol:


'xactly, I'll bet dollars to donuts Holmy went "A first round pick for who??"
But that's the AP for you. They can pretty much write whatever they want and sleep well.And you would lose that bet. Holmgren knew exactrly who Favre was. Holmgren was one of only 3 that personally worked Favre out prior to Favre being drafted. One of the others? Ron Wolf.

[sheepshead]

Holmgren brought Favre to Green Bay in 1992 and molded the former option quarterback at Southern Mississippi into a champion and a legend, before the coach left for Seattle prior to the 1999 season. .

..and all this time I thought it was Wolf who brought Favre to GB! :lol:


'xactly, I'll bet dollars to donuts Holmy went "A first round pick for who??"
But that's the AP for you. They can pretty much write whatever they want and sleep well.And you would lose that bet. Holmgren knew exactrly who Favre was. Holmgren was one of only 3 that personally worked Favre out prior to Favre being drafted. One of the others? Ron Wolf.

Mike Holmgren as Offensive Coordinator worked out Brett Favre? I'd like to see some doc on that.
Besides, it's moot. Ron Wolf was the general manager and made the deal.

[cpk1994]

Holmgren brought Favre to Green Bay in 1992 and molded the former option quarterback at Southern Mississippi into a champion and a legend, before the coach left for Seattle prior to the 1999 season. .

..and all this time I thought it was Wolf who brought Favre to GB! :lol:


'xactly, I'll bet dollars to donuts Holmy went "A first round pick for who??"
But that's the AP for you. They can pretty much write whatever they want and sleep well.And you would lose that bet. Holmgren knew exactrly who Favre was. Holmgren was one of only 3 that personally worked Favre out prior to Favre being drafted. One of the others? Ron Wolf.

Mike Holmgren as Offensive Coordinator worked out Brett Favre? I'd like to see some doc on that.
Besides, it's moot. Ron Wolf was the general manager and made the deal.Yes, its in Favres book "For the Record":


"Several NFL teams considered me a fairly high draft pick, but they wanted to see me up close, so I held a pre-dreaft workout in Hattiesburg. Abnout twenty scouts showed up. Ron Wolf. Lindy Infante. Ken Meyer. June Jones. Mike White. I thought it was real impressive that all these guys were coming down to work me out.
It was the first time I met Mike Holmgren."

Brett goes on to point out that Mike was one of the only ones to sit and talk with him in the stands after the workout. Holmgren's quote from the book:

"We're pretty set there. But ffor future reference, if I ever need it, I wanted to work you out and see for myself."

Its pretty clear that Holmgren knew exactly who Favre was.

[Patler]

I don't doubt that Holmgren knew Favre, but since Holmgren himself had been hired less than a month before the Favre trade, was likely busy hiring a staff and moving at the time, and wasn't the GM or even a trusted confidant of the GM at the time (just the unproven, newly hired coach), I doubt Holmgren had much to do with the trade for Favre.

Besides, Wolf had wanted to draft Favre the year before anyway.

[packerbacker1234]

We've always heard about Favre's injuries. And the more he's played through, the more of a fuss is made about it which is fine. But if it's too hurt to play with and he plays anyway, that's just stupid. If he can't perform, he's only hurting the team.

Most of his more serious injuries, if you sat back, you would say "he's too hurt to play", but then he plays anyways, and more often then not, plays well.

It may be hurting his team, or maybe it's not? On 4th and 2 with the game still winable, favre threw a beautiful pass to coles, who once again in a big moment, dropped the ball. It's not all on favre: At the crucial moments, even hurt, he is still making plays. The other guys gotta step up.

I mean, it's no coincidence that in this losing 3 of 4, or 4 of 5 as it were, that suddenlt yhe jets OL can't pass block, are not opening running lanes, and WR/TE's are dropping balls. Sure, favre hasn't had a great game in over a month, but the people around him sure as hell are not helping.

At least favre when he is out there is still trying to win. Everyone else keeps getting this look in there eyes that they are teh "same ol' jets". Come on guys, get over it.

[gex]

Holmgren had a very big say in getting Favre into Green Bay, it has been stated many times.


Cmon Rats- lets get this official Favre thread over the 100 page mark!!!!----just another record for "The Man, The Myth, The Living Legend"
:worship: :worship: :worship:

[cpk1994]

I don't doubt that Holmgren knew Favre, but since Holmgren himself had been hired less than a month before the Favre trade, was likely busy hiring a staff and moving at the time, and wasn't the GM or even a trusted confidant of the GM at the time (just the unproven, newly hired coach), I doubt Holmgren had much to do with the trade for Favre.

Besides, Wolf had wanted to draft Favre the year before anyway.Holmgren may have had nothing to do with it, but he sure as hell was aware it was going to go down. And he definitely wasn't going "A first rounder for who" as per your fantasy bet.

[The Shadow]

Holmgren had a very big say in getting Favre into Green Bay, it has been stated many times.


Cmon Rats- lets get this official Favre thread over the 100 page mark!!!!----just another record for "The Man, The Myth, The Living Legend"
:worship: :worship: :worship:


That will leave you only 10,000 short of the times you've sniffed his jock.

[Patler]

I don't doubt that Holmgren knew Favre, but since Holmgren himself had been hired less than a month before the Favre trade, was likely busy hiring a staff and moving at the time, and wasn't the GM or even a trusted confidant of the GM at the time (just the unproven, newly hired coach), I doubt Holmgren had much to do with the trade for Favre.

Besides, Wolf had wanted to draft Favre the year before anyway.Holmgren may have had nothing to do with it, but he sure as hell was aware it was going to go down. And he definitely wasn't going "A first rounder for who" as per your fantasy bet.

My fantasy bet? What are you talking about? Must have me confused with someone else. I offered no bets about anything.

[cpk1994]

I don't doubt that Holmgren knew Favre, but since Holmgren himself had been hired less than a month before the Favre trade, was likely busy hiring a staff and moving at the time, and wasn't the GM or even a trusted confidant of the GM at the time (just the unproven, newly hired coach), I doubt Holmgren had much to do with the trade for Favre.

Besides, Wolf had wanted to draft Favre the year before anyway.Holmgren may have had nothing to do with it, but he sure as hell was aware it was going to go down. And he definitely wasn't going "A first rounder for who" as per your fantasy bet.

My fantasy bet? What are you talking about? Must have me confused with someone else. I offered no bets about anything.Sorry, thought I was still talking to sheepshead. :oops:

[Harlan Huckleby]

I can't imagine a game with more drama than Favre vrs. Pennington with the playoffs on the line. The whole country will be watching this game. I think Favre's season will be remembered largely by this performance.

I heard an analysis of the game on ESPN radio. The Jets have far more talent all the way around, but the Fins are clicking, Pennington is playing mistake-free football.

I won't be surprised at anything, the Jets may rise up and blow them out. Or Miami could win a close game.

[Partial]

SI is talking about how the poor the Jets play has been lately and largely attributed it to Kris Jenkins completely running out of steam. What was a force early in the season has been more of a beached whale as of late.

[digitaldean]

I can't imagine a game with more drama than Favre vrs. Pennington with the playoffs on the line. The whole country will be watching this game. I think Favre's season will be remembered largely by this performance.

I heard an analysis of the game on ESPN radio. The Jets have far more talent all the way around, but the Fins are clicking, Pennington is playing mistake-free football.

I won't be surprised at anything, the Jets may rise up and blow them out. Or Miami could win a close game.

Definitely has all the drama the TV folks want. I do want Favre to succeed here.

But the way that D is playing in NY, that could pose some issues. Jenkins has been tapering off the last couple of games. If he doesn't get back to mid-season form (like the Patriots game on NFLN) then the Miami ground game will run roughshot over them.

If it's a close game, a turnover could decide it. The Fins have only 12 TOs this season as a team. That type of play wins you the close games.

Fins 20
Jets 17 in OT

No, I don't have the prognostication talent B has, but thought I'd throw it out there.

[Bretsky]

I can't imagine a game with more drama than Favre vrs. Pennington with the playoffs on the line. The whole country will be watching this game. I think Favre's season will be remembered largely by this performance.

I heard an analysis of the game on ESPN radio. The Jets have far more talent all the way around, but the Fins are clicking, Pennington is playing mistake-free football.

I won't be surprised at anything, the Jets may rise up and blow them out. Or Miami could win a close game.

Definitely has all the drama the TV folks want. I do want Favre to succeed here.

But the way that D is playing in NY, that could pose some issues. Jenkins has been tapering off the last couple of games. If he doesn't get back to mid-season form (like the Patriots game on NFLN) then the Miami ground game will run roughshot over them.

If it's a close game, a turnover could decide it. The Fins have only 12 TOs this season as a team. That type of play wins you the close games.

Fins 20
Jets 17 in OT

No, I don't have the prognostication talent B has, but thought I'd throw it out there.


I'm a natural; Pack in a landslide :!:

Tex will come out touting Vanilla Bob as the greatest DC since Bob Slovik

and the Favre hating cult will glorify A Rodgers for months while taking jabs at the old timer while they do it

[digitaldean]

Well, hopefully I'm not lumped in the Favre-hating crowd..... :?:

If the Jets control the ball, they have the talent to win. They have underachieved vs. Denver, vs. Seattle and got a sheer unadulterated gift from Buffalo to give them a win.

I'm just saying Miami has not beaten itself since starting out 0-2.

And, no, I'm not taking jabs at Favre and glorifying ARod.

All my posts have stated ARod has room for improvement, but having nearly 4K yards with a bum shoulder is enough for me to at least applaud.

Favre led the Jets to their 8-3 mark when they beat the Patriots. But in the last 4 games, he has 1 TD and 6 INTs. Maybe it's due to the shoulder problems noted in the press. I'm not knocking him for it.

[Bretsky]

Well, hopefully I'm not lumped in the Favre-hating crowd..... :?:

If the Jets control the ball, they have the talent to win. They have underachieved vs. Denver, vs. Seattle and got a sheer unadulterated gift from Buffalo to give them a win.

I'm just saying Miami has not beaten itself since starting out 0-2.

And, no, I'm not taking jabs at Favre and glorifying ARod.

All my posts have stated ARod has room for improvement, but having nearly 4K yards with a bum shoulder is enough for me to at least applaud.

Favre led the Jets to their 8-3 mark when they beat the Patriots. But in the last 4 games, he has 1 TD and 6 INTs. Maybe it's due to the shoulder problems noted in the press. I'm not knocking him for it.


FWIW you are definitely not in the Favre hating cult IMO

[Harlan Huckleby]

and the Favre hating cult will glorify A Rodgers for months while taking jabs at the old timer while they do it

If Favre does well, then people will crow about how stupid Thompson was to trade him, claim that the Packers would be in the playoffs if they had kept the Legend, etc. You already hear that dopey talk now.

As things have played-out so far, Thompson's move looks pretty good. I wish I could root for Favre without having to think about the unpleasant blow back.

[digitaldean]

FWIW you are definitely not in the Favre hating cult IMO

That's good, because I was planning on changing my screen name to Justin Harrell II tomorrow. :wink:

[Zool]

FWIW you are definitely not in the Favre hating cult IMO

That's good, because I was planning on changing my screen name to Justin Harrell II tomorrow. :wink:

Sorry, I already called dibs.

[GrnBay007]

Wind gust surpassing 50 mph....tough conditions.

NE 3
Buffalo 0

Wow, the goalpost was crooked due to the winds.

FG no good

[Fosco33]

Another pick for Favre... maybe his last game...

[Harlan Huckleby]

Another pick for Favre... maybe his last game...

damn you, I'm recording the game, now you've taken some of the excitement out of it for me.

[MJZiggy]

I didn't see the Jets, I was recording the Pack. What happened?

[Fosco33]

I didn't see the Jets, I was recording the Pack. What happened?

Just a long overthrow by Favre

[Fosco33]

Another pick for Favre... maybe his last game...

damn you, I'm recording the game, now you've taken some of the excitement out of it for me.

Haha - well, you can always count on Favre for almost one/game.

(Don't read this)
----> Tie game with 5:25 left in the 1st Q and Fins have the ball

:twisted:

[The Shadow]

Vintage Favre.

[denverYooper]

Another pick for Favre... maybe his last game...
numero dos.

[channtheman]

Vintage Favre.

You know why I don't credit Favre's INT' to injury? He did the same things in Green Bay against Chicago many times with Urlacher returning picks for TD's.

[Rastak]

I think he's really hurt.....why the coaching staff keeps trotting him out injured is beyond me. Must be that record.

[Partial]

He is really playing poorly.

[Fosco33]

Good drive for Brett

[denverYooper]

Good drive for Brett

Yeah, he looked good there.

[Fosco33]

Bad snap on the Fins punt - Jets have the ball inside the 30 with a chance to get the lead.

[Fosco33]

Favre hasn't played well - lots of throws behind the receiver. But he's converted multiple 3rd and 10+ yards.

now in the red zone

[Fosco33]

Great quick handoff call - Jets have the lead.

Too bad the Ravens are smoking the Jags...

[denverYooper]

Nice pass to Cotchery. Favre's looking better since a shaky start.

[Fosco33]

Pennington > Favre

today

[digitaldean]

It is so great watching the Cowgirls getting punked today by the Eagles.

I'd be VERY concerned if I were the Vikings. They barely beat the Giants backups and the Eagles are red hot right now.

My pick: Arizona and Minnesota will both lose next weekend.

[Rastak]

It is so great watching the Cowgirls getting punked today by the Eagles.

I'd be VERY concerned if I were the Vikings. They barely beat the Giants backups and the Eagles are red hot right now.

My pick: Arizona and Minnesota will both lose next weekend.


THis is the Favre thread actually, but I would agree the Eagles look really tough.

[digitaldean]

It is so great watching the Cowgirls getting punked today by the Eagles.

I'd be VERY concerned if I were the Vikings. They barely beat the Giants backups and the Eagles are red hot right now.

My pick: Arizona and Minnesota will both lose next weekend.


THis is the Favre thread actually, but I would agree the Eagles look really tough.

Sorry, my bad.... :oops:

[digitaldean]

Nice first down to Coles.

[digitaldean]

This has to be killing Jets fans. Since BAL is going to win, they're done.

If they win, they help they're arch-nemesis of NE get in. OH, the irony.

[Fosco33]

All but official - a 3rd rd pick.

Wonder what Favre says in his postgame. I'd love to see him say goodbye, I'm done, no waffling, thanks for the memories and adios - today.

With the Jets missing the playoffs after starting 8-3, does Brett wonder if he should've just stayed retired? Was another season really worth anything?

[Rastak]

All but official - a 3rd rd pick.

Wonder what Favre says in his postgame. I'd love to see him say goodbye, I'm done, no waffling, thanks for the memories and adios - today.

With the Jets missing the playoffs after starting 8-3, does Brett wonder if he should've just stayed retired? Was another season really worth anything?



About 4 million dollars or whatever he got. That ain't nothing to sneeze at.

[Bretsky]

What in the heck was Favre doing there ?

Well, if the Jets lose our 3rd round pick should be a couple picks earlier

[Rastak]

What in the heck was Favre doing there ?

Well, if the Jets lose our 3rd round pick should be a couple picks earlier


He thought his receiver could read his mind I think.

[The Shadow]

During the offseason, I expressed the thought that Chad Pennington would be a great pickup to back up Rodgers. I remembered how he completely took the Packers to school a few years ago in a late-season game. Smart qb.
All I heard was 'rag arm', 'washed up', 'broken down', etc.
Oh, well.
Hmmmm..I wonder if the Jets are now greatly regreting their quarterback choice. And I wonder how the Jet fans are feeling right about now to see Pennington returning to beat them.

[Bretsky]

During the offseason, I expressed the thought that Chad Pennington would be a great pickup to back up Rodgers. I remembered how he completely took the Packers to school a few years ago in a late-season game. Smart qb.
All I heard was 'rag arm', 'washed up', 'broken down', etc.
Oh, well.
Hmmmm..I wonder if the Jets are now greatly regreting their quarterback choice. And I wonder how the Jet fans are feeling right about now to see Pennington returning to beat them.


I remember that; you get kudos as you were clearly on the nose on that one

Washington just lost

Looks like we have the #9 pick in the draft

[Fosco33]

bad game

[Lurker64]

Well, maybe Favre won't have to end the season throwing the ball to someone on the other team.

He's going to get the ball back with 99 yards to go and 17 seconds. He could throw the ball to somebody on his own team. Unless they put Clemens in.

[Rastak]

Favre is on the bench....he sits out the last play I guess.



oops, scratch that!

[Rastak]

Ha!


Pass to Washington and he laterals to Favre....

Yea, like he's gonna run it 80 yards for a TD.

[cpk1994]

Ha!


Pass to Washington and he laterals to Favre....

Yea, like he's gonna run it 80 yards for a TD.Thats why he threw an illegal forward pass. :lol:

[Rastak]

Ha!


Pass to Washington and he laterals to Favre....

Yea, like he's gonna run it 80 yards for a TD.Thats why he threw an illegal forward pass. :lol:


I'm sure he was like "What the fuck am I supposed to do with it!"

[cpk1994]

Ha!


Pass to Washington and he laterals to Favre....

Yea, like he's gonna run it 80 yards for a TD.Thats why he threw an illegal forward pass. :lol:


I'm sure he was like "What the fuck am I supposed to do with it!"Probably should have thought of that before he wnet to catch the lateral. :)

[Rastak]

Ha!


Pass to Washington and he laterals to Favre....

Yea, like he's gonna run it 80 yards for a TD.Thats why he threw an illegal forward pass. :lol:


I'm sure he was like "What the fuck am I supposed to do with it!"Probably should have thought of that before he wnet to catch the lateral. :)



Being a lateral and all you sorta have too. :shock:

[GrnBay007]

Well, regardless of how Bret Favre's season with the Jets ended, you have to give him props for the fact he still wanted to play football...and with his team not wanting him back, heading to the AFC and a completely new system and getting as far as they did. He's a warrior. I just wish whatever team he was playing for could have gone out a winner. I would be surprised if he returns, but you never know.

[Brando19]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.

[Rastak]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


WOW, he outright said that!

[Bretsky]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


I'd be surprised at this; coaches call out players all the time. If Mangini criticized Favre in front of teammates..........well.........tough shit. If he made those comments they are in poor taste IMO

[chain_gang]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


I'd be surprised at this; coaches call out players all the time. If Mangini criticized Favre in front of teammates..........well.........tough shit. If he made those comments they are in poor taste IMO


Would anyone be surprised to see Favre released this offseason, if he decides to come back? I believe he would have to take a major pay cut to remain with the Jets. He may be able to pick a team of his choice to finish out his career, if he decides to come back.

[Rastak]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


I'd be surprised at this; coaches call out players all the time. If Mangini criticized Favre in front of teammates..........well.........tough shit. If he made those comments they are in poor taste IMO


Would anyone be surprised to see Favre released this offseason, if he decides to come back? I believe he would have to take a major pay cut to remain with the Jets. He may be able to pick a team of his choice to finish out his career, if he decides to come back.

A very likely scenario.

[Fosco33]

Well, he's not retiring today... said maybe a week or so after he gets home.

Looks like he's done.

[Rastak]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


I just watched his press conference on the NFL postgame show on NFL Network and he said nothing of the sort.

[Fosco33]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


I just watched his press conference on the NFL postgame show on NFL Network and he said nothing of the sort.

Watching NFLNetwork now, said that he respects the coaches work ethic and has nothing but good things to say. Doesn't regret coming back - looks downtrodden overall.

[Brando19]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


I just watched his press conference on the NFL postgame show on NFL Network and he said nothing of the sort.
Never said he talked about it at the PC...I said I saw it on ESPN. It was scrolling on the bottom of the screen. Perhaps he talked about it before the game? If i can find something online, I'll post the link.

[Fosco33]

I bet that's ESPN being ESPN.

[Bretsky]

Favre looks mentally defeated; kind of like me as a Packers fan right now

The draft will rejuvenate me as will the correct coaching moves........... maybe free agency but I'm usually disappointed there so my hopes are not high

Kind of sad; he's having the class to say all of the right things but he look incredibly demoralized

[channtheman]

Whether or not Favre said those things about Mangini, didn't Bart Starr ask Vince Lombardi if he couldn't call him out in front of his teamates? Starr told Lombardi he could rip on him in private all he wanted but he needed to be a leader for his teamates and have them have confidence in him. So, I disagree with Mangini if he was calling out Favre in front of his teamates, and I also disagree with Favre for coming out with it too, but not for him not wanting Mangini to do so.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.
Holmgren called out Favre plenty of times on the sidelines. Amazing what happens when a coach won't stand for any player's poor performance.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think he's really hurt.....why the coaching staff keeps trotting him out injured is beyond me. Must be that record.

Huh? He was making long throws fine right through the end of the game.

[Brando19]

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/12/28/report-favre-doesnt-like-playing-for-mangini/

Apart from a nagging shoulder injury that has gotten worse over the past few weeks, a major factor that will influence whether quarterback Brett Favre will return to the Jets in 2009 is whether and to what extent he’s happy.

Per FOX’s Jay Glazer, Favre isn’t happy playing for coach Eric Mangini.

The problem? In Green Bay, Favre had his own set of rules. In New York, Favre is treated like everyone else.

He regularly is called to the “principal’s office” to answer questions about the basis for Favre’s in-game decisions. Also, Mangini has called Favre out in front of the team.

So if Favre plays next year, it apparently won’t be for the Jets.

[Harlan Huckleby]

During the offseason, I expressed the thought that Chad Pennington would be a great pickup to back up Rodgers. I remembered how he completely took the Packers to school a few years ago in a late-season game. Smart qb.
All I heard was 'rag arm', 'washed up', 'broken down', etc.


OK, you get points for predicting Pennington's return to health and effectiveness. But Pennington didn't come available until the Favre trade, and he wasn't a fit for the Packers. He's a starter, no motivation for him ot come to GB as a backup.


I wonder if the Jets are now greatly regreting their quarterback choice. And I wonder how the Jet fans are feeling right about now to see Pennington returning to beat them.

I suppose they would have better off with Pennington. But that picture looked different just 5 weeks ago. I think the Jets made a good decision, it revived fan interest in their team.

[packinpatland]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.


I just watched his press conference on the NFL postgame show on NFL Network and he said nothing of the sort.

Yeah, I doubted it too, thought it sounded pretty weird.

If there was 'bad blood'......why would Mangini name his son after Brett?

[packinpatland]

I think this will ultimately be the deciding factor.



Favre says MRI will affect decision to play next season
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3796825

[esoxx]

Time to call it a career Brett.

Go relax and enjoy life.

All sides need some healing and time will do just that.

[Patler]

Just saw on ESPN that Favre told Foxsports that he has NOT enjoyed playing for Mangini this season...said that mangini called him out and embarassed him alot in front of his teammates for bad throws. Looks like Favre's done in NY unless Mangini is done in NY first.

I just watched his press conference on the NFL postgame show on NFL Network and he said nothing of the sort.

Yeah, I doubted it too, thought it sounded pretty weird.

If there was 'bad blood'......why would Mangini name his son after Brett?

I have no idea if Favre said that or not, but as to Mangini naming his son after Brett, that came early in the season, when things were going well for Favre and the team. I suspect things have been a bit more contentious the last month or so.

[packinpatland]

Time to call it a career Brett.

Go relax and enjoy life.

All sides need some healing and time will do just that.

Couldn't agree more. A bright note.......Romo had a more horrible game. :lol:

[MJZiggy]

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/12/28/report-favre-doesnt-like-playing-for-mangini/

Apart from a nagging shoulder injury that has gotten worse over the past few weeks, a major factor that will influence whether quarterback Brett Favre will return to the Jets in 2009 is whether and to what extent he’s happy.

Per FOX’s Jay Glazer, Favre isn’t happy playing for coach Eric Mangini.

The problem? In Green Bay, Favre had his own set of rules. In New York, Favre is treated like everyone else.

He regularly is called to the “principal’s office” to answer questions about the basis for Favre’s in-game decisions. Also, Mangini has called Favre out in front of the team.

So if Favre plays next year, it apparently won’t be for the Jets.

I don't buy this story. McCarthy did not just let Favre do whatever he felt like, and from what I've heard/read/seen, The two had a good working relationship. He was not treated as a deity (at least not by M3) and I can't imagine that he was mortified any more under Mangini than he was by Holmgren. M3 has said Favre is a very coachable quarterback, so this story just doesn't seem to make sense. The nice part is that it's not our problem.

[imscott72]

I bet that's ESPN being ESPN.

Fucking ESPN. This is how shit got started last summer. When will this network ever learn?

[Harlan Huckleby]

agreed about ESPN.

I'm not believing anything until I see it on Gretta Van Sustern.

[Brando19]

If Favre retires...the Jets get our 7th rounder.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I never heard the story about Mangeni naming a baby after Brett. Who names a child after somebody they've known for 2 months? Does Mangeni have any kids named "Chad"?

[Brando19]

I never heard the story about Mangeni naming a baby after Brett. Who names a child after somebody they've known for 2 months? Does Mangeni have any kids named "Chad"?

He named his other kid after someone he knew while with the Patriots. And I'm not joking. It may have been Bellichick, but I'm not sure...may have been a player as well.

[Bretsky]

If Favre retires...the Jets get our 7th rounder.

so we'll only have two then after the trade downs ? :lol:

[Deputy Nutz]

It was sad to see Favre's season spiral out of control in a heap of flames. The Jets and Favre were playing so well with 6 games left in the season. Favre is either injured. or more truthfully he is showed his age in the second half of the season.

It was a good run but it is time he rides off into the sunset.

[Fosco33]

If Favre retires...the Jets get our 7th rounder.

so we'll only have two then after the trade downs ? :lol:

2010

[Fosco33]

Serious question:

Since the Jets inherited Favre's contract (it wasn't renegotiated), can Favre retire as a Packer someday?

I mean - let's say he retires this offseason. If he's officially retired, would the Jets have to trade or release him back to the Pack for a one day contract to then retire as a Packer... OR - since he's got 2 years left on this contract, how would it work?

[Bretsky]

Serious question:

Since the Jets inherited Favre's contract (it wasn't renegotiated), can Favre retire as a Packer someday?

I mean - let's say he retires this offseason. If he's officially retired, would the Jets have to trade or release him back to the Pack for a one day contract to then retire as a Packer... OR - since he's got 2 years left on this contract, how would it work?


seriously, do you think he'd want to retire as a Packer at this point ? It's an interesting question to ponder

[Noodle]

It's his call to make whether he wants to retire as a Packer. No doubt the team would agree. But, like Bretsky, I'm thinking he wouldn't jump at the opportunity if it were offered given the way things went down.

[packinpatland]

It was sad to see Favre's season spiral out of control in a heap of flames. The Jets and Favre were playing so well with 6 games left in the season. Favre is either injured. or more truthfully he is showed his age in the second half of the season.

It was a good run but it is time he rides off into the sunset.

I'm no so sure it was age. Warner isn't that much younger......he lookes pretty good. I'm thinking he's hurting.
Altho........and I'm sorry B............he helped keep the Pats out of the playoffs................. :wink:

[Bretsky]

It was sad to see Favre's season spiral out of control in a heap of flames. The Jets and Favre were playing so well with 6 games left in the season. Favre is either injured. or more truthfully he is showed his age in the second half of the season.

It was a good run but it is time he rides off into the sunset.

I'm no so sure it was age. Warner isn't that much younger......he lookes pretty good. I'm thinking he's hurting.
Altho........and I'm sorry B............he helped keep the Pats out of the playoffs................. :wink:


no biggie on the Pats

BB showed all his detractors what an incredible coach he was this year......11-5...........nuts

[packinpatland]

11-5 and not make the playoffs.......that is pretty weird.
I do have to say, with the amount of injuries they've had...they did pretty darn good. BB has quite the bench to pull from.
What do you think he'll do about his QB situation next season?

[digitaldean]

11-5 and not make the playoffs.......that is pretty weird.
I do have to say, with the amount of injuries they've had...they did pretty darn good. BB has quite the bench to pull from.
What do you think he'll do about his QB situation next season?

Well with the story that came out today that Brady may miss the 2009 season, I'd lean toward re-signing Cassel. If that doesn't happen, franchise him. They didn't miss a beat for the most part.

[Fosco33]

Serious question:

Since the Jets inherited Favre's contract (it wasn't renegotiated), can Favre retire as a Packer someday?

I mean - let's say he retires this offseason. If he's officially retired, would the Jets have to trade or release him back to the Pack for a one day contract to then retire as a Packer... OR - since he's got 2 years left on this contract, how would it work?


seriously, do you think he'd want to retire as a Packer at this point ? It's an interesting question to ponder

I'd have to guess that Favre would retire as a Packer - someday (maybe not in the next year or two). I also think that the marketing offer is still on the table - so why wouldn't he want to make another 20M over 10 years for a few autographs, hunting trips and appearances?

[Fosco33]

11-5 and not make the playoffs.......that is pretty weird.
I do have to say, with the amount of injuries they've had...they did pretty darn good. BB has quite the bench to pull from.
What do you think he'll do about his QB situation next season?

Well with the story that came out today that Brady may miss the 2009 season, I'd lean toward re-signing Cassel. If that doesn't happen, franchise him. They didn't miss a beat for the most part.

If they re-sign Cassel do they release Brady or wait for him to come back in 2010??? I'd have to guess release him because you wouldn't want the QB controversy in '10 if Cassel has a repeat performance next year.

[Bretsky]

11-5 and not make the playoffs.......that is pretty weird.
I do have to say, with the amount of injuries they've had...they did pretty darn good. BB has quite the bench to pull from.
What do you think he'll do about his QB situation next season?


They will put a tag on Cassell so a team will have to give up serious draft picks to sign him. Smart thing to do it tag him and keep him......if Brady returns they can always trade him

[packinpatland]

11-5 and not make the playoffs.......that is pretty weird.
I do have to say, with the amount of injuries they've had...they did pretty darn good. BB has quite the bench to pull from.
What do you think he'll do about his QB situation next season?


They will put a tag on Cassell so a team will have to give up serious draft picks to sign him. Smart thing to do it tag him and keep him......if Brady returns they can always trade him

BB is such a 'business first' kinda guy......I wonder if he'd take a chance getting rid of Cassell if they do well next year.....one good hit on that knee of Brady's.........
But hey........I never thought he'd ever get rid of 'Mr.Clutch' either.

[Patler]

I never heard the story about Mangeni naming a baby after Brett. Who names a child after somebody they've known for 2 months? Does Mangeni have any kids named "Chad"?

He named his other kid after someone he knew while with the Patriots. And I'm not joking. It may have been Bellichick, but I'm not sure...may have been a player as well.



Mangini's two older sons are named after Rodney Harrison and Bill Belichik:



Mangini's two other sons have middle names in honor of people who meant something to the coach's career. Jake Harrison is named after Patriots safety Rodney Harrison, who developed a bond with Mangini. Luke William is named after Patriots coach Bill Belichick, who mentored Mangini before the Spygate fallout.

[digitaldean]

NY Daily News reported Jets owner Woody Johnson was livid after the game. He usually doesn't say much of anything.

Today he said his team underachieved. Mangini's and Favre's (possibly Tannenbaum's) future hanging in the balance. Most NY papers reporting the usual "unnamed" sources that Mangini is gone and that Favre will hang it up. Haven't found anything on Tannenbaum yet. Though PFT.com said it was 50-50 for Mangini to get canned.

Was sad watching some of the throws. That shoulder could be really messed up.

[KYPack]

If Favre retires...the Jets get our 7th rounder.

You are correct, sir.

The Jets built that sliding compensation into the trade.

Wish they'd made the play-offs, but we got what we deserved.

Jets wisely protected themselves against a Favre retirement after only one year with the team.

If the Jets ultimately owe the Packers a first-rounder, the pick in 2010 will be a fifth-rounder.

If the Jets owe a second-rounder, the pick in 2010 will bea sixth-rounder.

If the Jets owe a third-rounder, the pick in 2010 will be a seventh-rounder.

[cpk1994]

All NY papers reporting that Mangini is likely out as coach. 10 am EST presser without him.

[KYPack]

Brett finished the year with a certain symmetry.

22TD's 22 picks.

The whole year went in a circle.

They reached the top of the mountain and fell into the canyon together.

[Brohm]

Ouch, things were going so well at the beginning of the season for Brett. I figured a 2nd was a shoo-in. And to think 6 of those TD's were in one game :shock:

[Harlan Huckleby]

seriously, do you think he'd want to retire as a Packer at this point ?

why not? he has no substantial beef with the Packers, the Packers just made good business decisions that resulted in some hurt feelings. In some of Favre's press conferences with the JEts, it sounded like he was getting over it.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Mangini's two older sons are named after Rodney Harrison and Bill Belichik

oh my god. Rodney Harrison is the dirtiest player in the modern football era. And Bellichek? Mangini must be raising a little mafia family.

[Patler]

Favre continued a trend that we had seen in GB for a few years. He starts seasons strong, looking like the Favre of old. He has often lead the league or has been near the lead in TDs for the first half of the season. The same happened this season. But, he has finished very poorly, and did again this season. If you look at the last 5 games each season from '05, '06, '07 and '08, in 20 games Favre has thrown just 13 TDs and an astounding 34 interceptions. While 2005 and 2008 were particularly bad for him, 2006 was only somewhat better, and even in 2007 he had more interceptions than TDs the last 5 games. It is clear that age prevents him from finishing a season in the same manner he starts one. He wears down physically, mentally or both.

Last 5 games of the season:
Year - TDs/Ints
2005 - 1/10
2006 - 4/8
2007 - 6/7
2008 - 2/9

[LL2]

Favre continued a trend that we had seen in GB for a few years. He starts seasons strong, looking like the Favre of old. He has often lead the league or has been near the lead in TDs for the first half of the season. The same happened this season. But, he has finished very poorly, and did again this season. If you look at the last 5 games each season from '05, '06, '07 and '08, in 20 games Favre has thrown just 13 TDs and an astounding 34 interceptions. While 2005 and 2008 were particularly bad for him, 2006 was only somewhat better, and even in 2007 he had more interceptions than TDs the last 5 games. It is clear that age prevents him from finishing a season in the same manner he starts one. He wears down physically, mentally or both.

Last 5 games of the season:
Year - TDs/Ints
2005 - 1/10
2006 - 4/8
2007 - 6/7
2008 - 2/9

That is a horrible trend! I'm sure MM and TT knew this, and the loyal Favre fans were blind to it.

[packinpatland]

There's no denying that Favre spiraled downward. But last I checked, he didn't play both sides of the ball. In GB or NY.

[Iron Mike]

Last I checked, he didn't play both sides of the ball.

Oh, but I beg to differ. Just not in the football sense.

[packinpatland]

And another thing.......how come Jay Glazer waited until yesterday to 'break' his story about the discord between Favre and Mangini? I haven't read everything, but have players or coaches backed this up?
Glazer is a naysayer. He sure was silent when the Jets were winning and others were reporting on the comradery between Favre and his teammates.

[Harlan Huckleby]

As I recall, Favre had a sore shoulder to start the season. I believe there is something wrong with is arm, but I think the main thing the MRI will turn-up today is that he has the body of a 39-year-old man. I can't think of too many QBs who were able to play a whole season at that age, just the wear and tear of making so many throws. Most old guys are backups.

I was going to say you never see pitchers in baseball over 38 (other than knuckle-ballers), but I guess Randy Johnson is still hurling.

[packerbacker1234]

Favre continued a trend that we had seen in GB for a few years. He starts seasons strong, looking like the Favre of old. He has often lead the league or has been near the lead in TDs for the first half of the season. The same happened this season. But, he has finished very poorly, and did again this season. If you look at the last 5 games each season from '05, '06, '07 and '08, in 20 games Favre has thrown just 13 TDs and an astounding 34 interceptions. While 2005 and 2008 were particularly bad for him, 2006 was only somewhat better, and even in 2007 he had more interceptions than TDs the last 5 games. It is clear that age prevents him from finishing a season in the same manner he starts one. He wears down physically, mentally or both.

Last 5 games of the season:
Year - TDs/Ints
2005 - 1/10
2006 - 4/8
2007 - 6/7
2008 - 2/9

Yeah, but those numbers get skewed. Favre wasn't playing bad at the end of last season, but he did have a horrible game against dallas and chicago, and bam... there are 85% of the ints. He played AMAZING against seattle, then average (not horrible) against the Giants.

2005 - he had a bad year all around. Didn't even start hot. Was pressing all year - lots of injuries etc. 2006 was an entire new staff, and it wasn't a horrible ending. I think 2 games atribute dmost the ints.

It's not a trend per say: The trend is that when the weather gets below 20 degrees: Favre just can't play well in it anymore. He can still play average (like against the giants), but that menas other areas of the team have to win the game.

[Zool]

Those 2007 stats would not include the playoffs.

[Fritz]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

[Rastak]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.


I agree, they clearly made the right move now that it's played itself out. Favre is on his last leg and getting started on the next era (in hindsight) does make perfect sense.

[RashanGary]

There's no denying that Favre spiraled downward. But last I checked, he didn't play both sides of the ball. In GB or NY.

Haha. Someone criticizes Favre's bad QB play in the end of the last 4 or 5 seasons and you bring up the defense. That's priceless. What the hell are you talking about and what does the defense have to do with his interceptions?

[packinpatland]

There's no denying that Favre spiraled downward. But last I checked, he didn't play both sides of the ball. In GB or NY.

Haha. Someone criticizes Favre's bad QB play in the end of the last 4 or 5 seasons and you bring up the defense. That's priceless. What the hell are you talking about and what does the defense have to do with his interceptions?

You're right JH.........he owns the interceptions. But in the case of the Jets, it really was a team effort in their loses.......from the poor coaching to special teams.

[RashanGary]

Brett's play was bad. Nobody is talking about wins and losses here. We're talking about one player that did a bad job. The Jets defense playing bad has nothing to do with Brett's picks. He throws them when he's up. He throws them when he's down. He throws them when the game is just starting. He throws them when it's ending. He's just bad from start to finish. No excuse.

[Bretsky]

As depressing as it is to say, I'll say it. Favre was terrible the last four games.

He was tremendous in the Tennessee game. They were 8-3. After that he melted down. I'm not sure when he hurt his shoulder but my guess is that was a major factor.

He has some terrible games against bad teams; if he is even average the Jets make the playoffs.

I still think he was hurt; only Favre knows. If he was healthy he should turn in his cleats and apologize to the Jets coaches who are unemployed.

[RashanGary]

Favre is definitly a coach/GM killer. There is a strange tendency to blame all of Bretts shortcomings on everyone else. Even in his departure, the GB staff got drug through the "brett can do no wrong" mud.


He's not very good right now, hasn't been consistently at the end of seasons for some time. Won't ever be.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Favre continued a trend that we had seen in GB for a few years. He starts seasons strong, looking like the Favre of old. He has often lead the league or has been near the lead in TDs for the first half of the season. The same happened this season. But, he has finished very poorly, and did again this season. If you look at the last 5 games each season from '05, '06, '07 and '08, in 20 games Favre has thrown just 13 TDs and an astounding 34 interceptions. While 2005 and 2008 were particularly bad for him, 2006 was only somewhat better, and even in 2007 he had more interceptions than TDs the last 5 games. It is clear that age prevents him from finishing a season in the same manner he starts one. He wears down physically, mentally or both.

Last 5 games of the season:
Year - TDs/Ints
2005 - 1/10
2006 - 4/8
2007 - 6/7
2008 - 2/9

I (and probably you and others) had mentioned this during the offseason. I think it's a big reason why the Packers got rid of Favre. They no longer felt confident in his ability to win big games late in the year (especially in cold weather). I think everything else is window dressing. That's the primary reason Brett Favre played for the Jets this year.

[HarveyWallbangers]

As depressing as it is to say, I'll say it. Favre was terrible the last four games.

He was terrible the last 5 games. Would be ironic if he hurt his throwing shoulder late in the year--just like Aaron Rodgers did early in the year.

[Patler]

Favre continued a trend that we had seen in GB for a few years. He starts seasons strong, looking like the Favre of old. He has often lead the league or has been near the lead in TDs for the first half of the season. The same happened this season. But, he has finished very poorly, and did again this season. If you look at the last 5 games each season from '05, '06, '07 and '08, in 20 games Favre has thrown just 13 TDs and an astounding 34 interceptions. While 2005 and 2008 were particularly bad for him, 2006 was only somewhat better, and even in 2007 he had more interceptions than TDs the last 5 games. It is clear that age prevents him from finishing a season in the same manner he starts one. He wears down physically, mentally or both.

Last 5 games of the season:
Year - TDs/Ints
2005 - 1/10
2006 - 4/8
2007 - 6/7
2008 - 2/9

Yeah, but those numbers get skewed. Favre wasn't playing bad at the end of last season, but he did have a horrible game against dallas and chicago, and bam... there are 85% of the ints. He played AMAZING against seattle, then average (not horrible) against the Giants.

2005 - he had a bad year all around. Didn't even start hot. Was pressing all year - lots of injuries etc. 2006 was an entire new staff, and it wasn't a horrible ending. I think 2 games atribute dmost the ints.

It's not a trend per say: The trend is that when the weather gets below 20 degrees: Favre just can't play well in it anymore. He can still play average (like against the giants), but that menas other areas of the team have to win the game.

No the numbers are not skewed. They are what they are. By taking the last five games of every year for four years you dilute the significance of any one particularly good or particularly bad game, and you get an indication of his performance over the last third of the season. Quite simply he has not performed well at the end of any season in the last 4. Even his best year, 2007 was not very good for a 5 game stretch. Has every game been awful? of course not, but over all he has not performed well in the final 5 games for 4 consecutive seasons. Looking at 5 games is not a small sample for a 16 game season, and the trend is steady over a 4 year period, each having more interceptions than TDs, and the TDs being less than one would expect over nearly 1/3 of the season. Just as important is the fact that his performance tails off when you may need it the most.

I think you are wrong about 2005. He did play well at the start. He had 14 TDs and 8 interceptions through the first 6 games, and if I remember corrrectly was tied for the lead in TD passes. He had 6 TDs and 21 interceptions over the last 10 games.

I could dismiss one season as just one of those things, but it has been every season for four seasons, some not as bad as others, but none good. Over 20 games covering 4 seasons he has 13 TDs and 34 interceptions.

[Bretsky]

As depressing as it is to say, I'll say it. Favre was terrible the last four games.

He was terrible the last 5 games. Would be ironic if he hurt his throwing shoulder late in the year--just like Aaron Rodgers did early in the year.


oh pfooey; that's all I'm giving cause I've blacked out the last five weeks

On a side note, we got a Wiii for Xmas and I must let you know I am not doing well at bowling sober; I think you could take me the way I've bowled lately

[Patler]

I (and probably you and others) had mentioned this during the offseason. I think it's a big reason why the Packers got rid of Favre. They no longer felt confident in his ability to win big games late in the year (especially in cold weather). I think everything else is window dressing. That's the primary reason Brett Favre played for the Jets this year.

Yup, I remember us agreeing on this last summer, and I was waiting to see if the trend continued in 2008. Again, he started hot, lead the league in TDs, was close to the lead for the first half season and tailed off after that. It is hard to argue that his performance in 20 games over a 4 year period, with just 13 TDs and 34 interceptions is not indicative of something. Even if you throw out the worst game of the 5 games each season, his numbers still are not good.

[Partial]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

More talented? Our team was extremely talented. I don't buy that for a second.

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.

2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

[Patler]

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.
2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

A trend is established by the combination of many games over a long period. A single particularly good game or particularly bad game does not refute or prove the trend.

Maybe he is hurt this year. Maybe there were reasons for 2005, '06 and '07 too, but that is all part of it. His "old" body doesn't perform as well at the end of the seasons as at the beginnings. You can make all the justifications you want, in the end he threw the TD passes and he threw the interceptions.

20 games equally selected as the last 5 of each season for 4 seasons is certainly enough to demonstrate a trend, and 13/34 is pretty decisive. As I said before, even if you throw out his worst game of the 5 every season, his numbers still are not good. Sure within the end of a season he has some good games, but they don't match the bad and his overall results at the ends of seasons are not good.

[sheepshead]

Some great quotes in this article:




The New York Jets' other big decision: Favre
by Dave Hutchinson/The Star-Ledger
Monday December 29, 2008, 8:32 PM

Tim Farrell/The Star-Ledger
Jets quarterback Brett Favre yanks off his chin strap in disgust after throwing an interception late in the second half Sunday. Two months ago Eric Mangini named his son Zach Brett. Do you think he might want to change it now?
While the Jets decided to fire Mangini Monday after three seasons, team owner Woody Johnson made a plea to have 39-year-old quarterback Brett Favre return next season despite an error-laden, uneven performance down the stretch that was as indicative of the Jets' collapse as anything else.

"I hope so," Johnson said Monday when asked if he expected Favre back for a second season with the Jets.

When it was pointed out how Favre struggled down the stretch -- the future Hall of Famer threw just two touchdowns and was intercepted nine times during the Jets' 1-4 finish -- Johnson quickly dismissed it.

"I think Brett Favre was a huge positive net for this franchise," he said.

Perhaps it's all the attention and glamour that Favre has brought to the organization, not to mention the number of jerseys he has sold.

Some of Favre's teammates, however, were less enthused about the idea of the quarterback coming back, and several players privately pointed to Favre -- and his league-high 22 interceptions -- as the reason for the team's demise and Mangini's firing.

"All the money they spent on bringing in players, the new stadium and the quarterback," said one player when asked why he thinks Mangini was fired.

Said another player: "It's the quarterback throwing the ball all over the place. And he didn't suffer any repercussions. He kept doing it. People said Eric called him out in meetings; I didn't see it. Eric treated him like he was Brett Favre. A lot of guys didn't like it."

Favre, who has two years left on his contract at $13 million and $14 million respectively, was not seen at the Jets' training facility in Florham Park Monday, and there was no word about an MRI on his right shoulder that he had said was scheduled for Monday.

General manager Mike Tannenbaum said he talked with Favre Monday and told him to go home and think about what he wants to do. He didn't give Favre a timetable for when he needs to make a decision about whether or not to play in 2009.

Tannenbaum was also noncommittal on whether he needed a decision from Favre before hiring a coach.

"To me, the natural course of events is to get the head coach in place, fill the staff," he said. "And we've got to address all the roster issues. Obviously Brett is prominent, but there's other important roster decisions we need to make."

And after saying last week that he wanted to make a quick decision, Favre backpedaled after Sunday's season-ending loss to the Dolphins.

"The obvious choice would be a quick decision based on what happened" in the Miami game, he said. "It's a hasty, irrational decision based on what's happened. I'll go home and get away for a week or so ... and make the right decision."

If Favre needs surgery, the decision could impact whether he returns for a 19th NFL season. A long rehabilitation period could be a deterrent.

"I would love to see him back next year," said wide receiver Jerricho Cotchery. "Whatever he decides, I feel like he still has some great football left in him. He wasn't able to spend the offseason program with the team, so I definitely think that plays a role into it."

That, however, is part of the complexity in dealing with Favre these days. An extended decision-making period might result in Favre missing offseason workouts.

"I support him," wide receiver Laveranues Coles said. "We exchanged numbers. I know a lot of people always had a lot to say about our relationship. It has been great. We've never had any problem.

"We'll stay in touch during the offseason. I may even shoot over to the crib and we'll go hunting if we get a chance."

[KYPack]

As depressing as it is to say, I'll say it. Favre was terrible the last four games.

He was tremendous in the Tennessee game. They were 8-3. After that he melted down. I'm not sure when he hurt his shoulder but my guess is that was a major factor.

He has some terrible games against bad teams; if he is even average the Jets make the playoffs.

I still think he was hurt; only Favre knows. If he was healthy he should turn in his cleats and apologize to the Jets coaches who are unemployed.

The Jets collapse was remarkable. They were 8-3 and had just gone into Tenn and kicked the hell out of 'em. The Jets got a lot better in the off-season, but they also got a lot older. Several of their FA acquisitions wore down in the late going.

Kris Jenkins and some of the other older guys were shadows of their former selves after that mid season win.

Wearing down and getting hurt are a part of getting older. By the end of the season, the Jets were one of the league's weaker teams. The NY's were on top of the mountain in Nashville, but crashed to earth by season's end.

I think Mangini was basically a dick, but he won 5 more games than last season and got 'em over .500. Should the play-offs have been a given? That team only won 4 games last year.

The mangenius more than doubled their win total and got 'em over .500. That got him fired, but it couldn't have happened to a "nicer" guy

[Fosco33]

It's understandable that the Jets want to get the coach in place and then think more about personnel.

But I'm shocked the Jets management made the same mistakes the Packers did the last 2 years - no timetable, etc.

If Favre doesn't make a quick call (let's say the MRI is inconclusive or surgery isn't needed), the Jets fans, media, etc will be tearing this decision to pieces.

Favre in TC may help some with general knowledge of the system. But as I mentioned a few times here in the offseason, I think you let Brett play the first half the season and if he starts down the same path as the last 3-4 years (tailing off), then you have a backup ready. If this was true (training camp), wouldn't his performance have sucked the first half and gotten better the second half?

He'll be 40 next year... I hope that's the shocker that makes him think about coming back.

[KYPack]

Lot's of similar quotes in the Daily News article which reveals Brett had a MRI this season.

Essentially, last year Brett got himself out of going to camp.

And, it hurt his team.

Some of the guys want to see him put in the work they have to do.

(Quote on)

Brett Favre had MRI earlier

BY OHM YOUNGMISUK
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Brett Favre doesn't make an appearance in the locker room on Monday.

Woody Johnson didn't want Eric Mangini anymore. But the Jets owner wants to keep his future Hall of Fame quarterback around for another year.

Brett Favre, who was at team headquarters but did not talk to reporters Monday, said on Sunday that he was going to have an MRI on his right shoulder Monday that could impact his decision whether to retire.

But the Daily News has learned that Favre had an MRI earlier in the season and did not have one Monday. The earlier MRI didn't reveal any major damage, although it seems likely something is wrong since Favre said his right arm has been bothering him. He aggravated the problem during Sunday's 24-17 loss to the Dolphins.

The Jets refused to confirm if Favre was going to have a second MRI and Johnson said he didn't know if he was getting one.

The owner did say with conviction that he welcomes the 39-year-old back for another season. Initially, moments after the quarterback had thrown three of his league-high 22 interceptions on Sunday, Johnson said the Jets would have to look into the Favre issue.

Monday, both Johnson and GM Mike Tannenbaum said they want Favre back. Clearly, the Jets are not going to be like the Packers and go through an offseason of drama such as the one that unfolded last summer between Packers GM Ted Thompson and Favre.

"I just think he adds a lot to the team that's positive," Johnson said Monday after announcing Mangini's firing. "I think Brett was a huge positive net-net for this franchise. We don't like to lose any game. But Brett has added a lot. It's 53 players on the varsity that are responsible. It's not just Brett."

While players said they want Favre back, many made it clear they want him to go through an entire offseason program with the team to avoid another maddeningly inconsistent season.

"If he is dedicated and he wants to come back and do this thing, do it the right way and come here, training camp and minicamp, working out with us, I'm fine with it," said safety Kerry Rhodes. "But don't come back if it is going to be half-hearted or if he doesn't want to put in the time with us. You have to build a team through the offseason, not just coming in later in the season. I know he didn't have any control over it this year.

"There is no resentment," Rhodes added. "But if he wants to come back next year and put in the time to help this team win, he needs to be here with the team."
After Favre's messy divorce with the Packers, the quarterback was traded on Aug. 6. He struggled to learn a new system and adapt to his receivers. Favre also didn't have a full offseason of training since he was retired, and that may have contributed to the Jets' demise.

"When he got here, we had to change everything," said offensive lineman Damien Woody. "We were doing things on the fly for a long time. In the end, it caught up with us. Thirty-nine years old, playing in the NFL ... I'm sure he wore down. I'd like to see what he would be like going through an entire offseason."

Jerricho Cotchery and Laveranues Coles, Favre's top receivers, both said they would like to have an entire offseason with the QB. "You gain chemistry in the offseason program," Cotchery said.
Favre said on Sunday his decision whether to play a 19th season would be impacted by the health of his arm and his desire to go through another long campaign.

As for his former coach, Favre shot down a report on Sunday that said he didn't enjoy playing for Mangini, who newborn son's middle name is Brett in tribute. Johnson and Tannenbaum said no players had been consulted in their decision to fire Mangini. And it sounded as if they want to hire a coach before dealing with Favre's future.

(Quote off)


This could be a wild one, kids.

[arcilite]

I miss him.


But Im sure as hell happy we don't have to deal with the 'will he or wont he retire'

'Hes retired..but will he unretire?' Talk.

[Harlan Huckleby]

But the Daily News has learned that Favre had an MRI earlier in the season and did not have one Monday. The earlier MRI didn't reveal any major damage, although it seems likely something is wrong since Favre said his right arm has been bothering him.

Favre has had some problem with his shoulder all season, he was sore coming out of training camp. What would you expect from a 39-year-old who is not in top shape?

Yet we didn't hear about the shoulder when his team was flying high.

I think Favre has reverted to drama queen mode. His quote to the media:
"It hurts in the back [of the shoulder], hurts down in the biceps and, occasionally, in my neck," Favre said. "Other than that, it's fine."

Then he says that his retirement will hinge completely on the results of this latest MRI, thus highlighting the importance of his condition. Give me a break. So now his poor performance can be blamed completely on a bad shoulder.

I am so glad the Packers don't have to be at the center of this continuing drama anymore. I think the team that came out the best from last fall's saga was the Vikings. Talk about dodging a bullet.

If you want a valid explanation of why he threw so many interceptions at the end of the season, do a brain scan, not a shoulder MRI. You watched the last game, despite his shoulder problem, Favre was still able to throw the ball a lot farther and harder than Chad Pennington. The interceptions were mental errors.

[KYPack]

I miss him.


But Im sure as hell happy we don't have to deal with the 'will he or wont he retire'

'Hes retired..but will he unretire?' Talk.

This year we all relax and watch the show from the bleachers.

It will be easier this way.

[sheepshead]

:drma:

[LL2]

If Favre thought he was under pressure last offseason from MM and TT and whether or not to retire he will be under a lot more pressure in the next couple months to make a decision on whether or not to play. It's Favre's crappy performance that cost Mangini his job. Favre should appreciate the amount of time he was given by TT in past years to make his annual "to play or not to play" decision.

[packinpatland]

I miss him.


But Im sure as hell happy we don't have to deal with the 'will he or wont he retire'

'Hes retired..but will he unretire?' Talk.


Yeah........I think that's a statement we could get a concensus on.

[BallHawk]

I miss him.


But Im sure as hell happy we don't have to deal with the 'will he or wont he retire'

'Hes retired..but will he unretire?' Talk.

This year we all relax and watch the show from the bleachers.

It will be easier this way.

You sure you wanna relax? I could start a "Will Aaron come back for one more year?" thread.

[Gunakor]

I miss him.


But Im sure as hell happy we don't have to deal with the 'will he or wont he retire'

'Hes retired..but will he unretire?' Talk.

This year we all relax and watch the show from the bleachers.

It will be easier this way.

You sure you wanna relax? I could start a "Will Aaron come back for one more year?" thread.

This just in... Aaron Rodgers has decided he WILL report to MC as the starting QB next season. No need to start a thread about it. We'll just post it in the Brett Favre thread. Seems fitting.

[digitaldean]

though I consider some of the sourcing to ESPN fairly dubious, they are reporting Favre had a torn biceps tendon and some calcification in the area.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3800421

[Lurker64]

though I consider some of the sourcing to ESPN fairly dubious, they are reporting Favre had a torn biceps tendon and some calcification in the area.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3800421

According to the article "Favre is expected to deliberate for several weeks". How long is several? Think we'll hear from him before March?

[digitaldean]

Hey, now the New Yorkers will know what it's like to go through that soap opera!

[Partial]

If he has a torn bicep, his bad performance the past several weeks should be forgiven. What a man.

[Bossman641]

If he has a torn bicep, his bad performance the past several weeks should be forgiven. What a man.

If he had a torn biceps and realized how much he was struggling and hurting the team, he shouldn't have tried to tough it out. What an idiot.

[Partial]

If he has a torn bicep, his bad performance the past several weeks should be forgiven. What a man.

If he had a torn biceps and realized how much he was struggling and hurting the team, he shouldn't have tried to tough it out. What an idiot.

A. He probably didn't know
B. What is the other option? Go with some inexperienced chump and have your team lose games anyway?!? I don't think so..

[Fosco33]

Days of our Favre continues...

I really wish Jets would've given a timetable (say, within 2 weeks of the new coach being hired we need an answer).

[b bulldog]

he should have benched himself and put the team in front of his consecutive games played streak.

[b bulldog]

One more thing, I always love how when he chokes in big games as normal, he quickly runs off the field into the lockerrom, never congratulating the opposing teams players or coaches.

[packinpatland]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/

How come when you look at the NFL Team Pages the Green Bay news is about Favre?????

[packinpatland]

One more thing, I always love how when he chokes in big games as normal, he quickly runs off the field into the lockerrom, never congratulating the opposing teams players or coaches.

Be fair here, Bulldog, I watched all the Jets games this season, the last game was the only one that he ran off the field before talking to the other QB or coaches. Having said that.......it was still a pretty crappy thing to do.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't buy it. His arm strength looked diminished all year. There were complaints about his arm strength going back to early in the year. Maybe it's because he didn't put the offseason work in. I don't know. He probably hurt his arm on his attempted tackle on the interception return for a TD in this last game, but now has a convenient excuse to come back. BTW, I've never used Rodgers shoulder injury in the Tampa Bay game as an excuse for any of his poor performances--except maybe in that particular game. If a guy suits it up on Sunday, it's hard to use injuries as an excuse. (I will say that the year Brett played with a split on his hand was a legit excuse. That had to be tough.)

[Bossman641]

I don't buy it. His arm strength looked diminished all year. There were complaints about his arm strength going back to early in the year. Maybe it's because he didn't put the offseason work in. I don't know. He probably hurt his arm on his attempted tackle on the interception return for a TD in this last game, but now has a convenient excuse to come back. BTW, I've never used Rodgers shoulder injury in the Tampa Bay game as an excuse for any of his poor performances--except maybe in that particular game. If a guy suits it up on Sunday, it's hard to use injuries as an excuse. (I will say that the year Brett played with a split on his hand was a legit excuse. That had to be tough.)

Hmmm, you might be on to something here. Do you think Partial will back off of his "Rodgers can't get it done in crunch time" position if I blame it all on his shoulder injury?

[packinpatland]

Doesn't matter if there was a shoulder injury. As mentioned before........use your damn head.........sit when you're hurt!

[Sparkey]

If he has a torn bicep, his bad performance the past several weeks should be forgiven. What a man.

If he had a torn biceps and realized how much he was struggling and hurting the team, he shouldn't have tried to tough it out. What an idiot.

A. He probably didn't know
B. What is the other option? Go with some inexperienced chump and have your team lose games anyway?!? I don't think so..

TOOL :roll:

[Fritz]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

More talented? Our team was extremely talented. I don't buy that for a second.

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.

2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

Faneca, Jenkins, Woody. The Jets did what so many posters here bitch about TT not doing - bring in the free agents! Spend! Ted won't do what it takes!

So the Jets spent, spent, spent. They got the big names.

And they got the QB so many people wanted to have here in GB again.

And they collapsed. They now have an old, cap-heavy team with a fired coach. I think the Packers' future is brighter now than the Jets'. The Jets went for it all in one year. They mortgaged the future for a shot, and they didn't even make the playoffs.

[Rastak]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

More talented? Our team was extremely talented. I don't buy that for a second.

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.

2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

Faneca, Jenkins, Woody. The Jets did what so many posters here bitch about TT not doing - bring in the free agents! Spend! Ted won't do what it takes!

So the Jets spent, spent, spent. They got the big names.

And they got the QB so many people wanted to have here in GB again.

And they collapsed. They now have an old, cap-heavy team with a fired coach. I think the Packers' future is brighter now than the Jets'. The Jets went for it all in one year. They mortgaged the future for a shot, and they didn't even make the playoffs.

How were all those deals structured? Favre cost a #3, not really a mortgage. What is their cap space? Will there even be a cap in two years? They improved by 5 wins. You guys likely could have predicted the late slide after watching Favre wane as the season went on before. I don't see a problem with signing guys to bolster both lines when you suck and sit at 4 wins like they did.

[retailguy]

Ted will turn that #3 into 6 7th rounders!

Just wait and see! :wink:

I thought the Jets did OK this year. Really, I'm not sure that I'd have gotten rid of Mangini, next year they might have had a better shot. If he could've got Favre into camp and they can develop a better running attack with both Jones and Washington.

They could really use a good slot receiver, and let their TE develop a little more...

I just don't think they did that poorly this year.

[gex]

I don't think the Jets mortgaged the future for a one year shot, they will be better next year and with a good capologist should have no problem keeping competitive. There are many ways to the top of the mountain.

[Bretsky]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

More talented? Our team was extremely talented. I don't buy that for a second.

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.

2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

Faneca, Jenkins, Woody. The Jets did what so many posters here bitch about TT not doing - bring in the free agents! Spend! Ted won't do what it takes!

So the Jets spent, spent, spent. They got the big names.

And they got the QB so many people wanted to have here in GB again.

And they collapsed. They now have an old, cap-heavy team with a fired coach. I think the Packers' future is brighter now than the Jets'. The Jets went for it all in one year. They mortgaged the future for a shot, and they didn't even make the playoffs.


Favre aside, the Jets improved at several positions and improved by five wins. Faneca..........love to have him in GB........Woody........I'd take him.......Jenkins........I'd take him.

How much better do you think the Packers would have done with those three players ?

Their best FA is young enough to have several more solid years. They gave up a late 3rd round pick for Favre. I don't agree they mortgaged their future.

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

None of those guys are busts and I doubt they regret any of the signings.

They may regret the Favre deal........but it cost them a late 3rd round pick so I don't think they lost much.

[packinpatland]

They don't sound like they regret him being there.....

"People look for excuses right now," Leon Washington said. "And I'm sure Brett would be the one who wouldn't make excuses for himself. He's not that type of player. Even though Brett was hurt late, I feel like we still had opportunities to go out and win football games. That's the bottom line. We didn't take advantage of our opportunities."

"Did he make us better? Definitely," said guard Alan Faneca. "He came in and changed our offense and made us do some things that we weren't able to do. I think he did a lot of positive things."

That was a sentiment echoed by Mangini during his disappointed postgame remarks.

"Brett's a Hall of Fame player," the coach said. "He's got great energy. He's a great professional. He brought all of those things to the team. I think a lot of people learned things from him. I think we're a better team for him being here. I appreciate the relationship we had and the one he had with the team."
http://www.newyorkjets.com/blog/posts/897-calling-it-a-career-favre-not-ready-to-say

[gex]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

More talented? Our team was extremely talented. I don't buy that for a second.

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.

2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

Faneca, Jenkins, Woody. The Jets did what so many posters here bitch about TT not doing - bring in the free agents! Spend! Ted won't do what it takes!

So the Jets spent, spent, spent. They got the big names.

And they got the QB so many people wanted to have here in GB again.

And they collapsed. They now have an old, cap-heavy team with a fired coach. I think the Packers' future is brighter now than the Jets'. The Jets went for it all in one year. They mortgaged the future for a shot, and they didn't even make the playoffs.


Favre aside, the Jets improved at several positions and improved by five wins. Faneca..........love to have him in GB........Woody........I'd take him.......Jenkins........I'd take him.

How much better do you think the Packers would have done with those three players ?

Their best FA is young enough to have several more solid years. They gave up a late 3rd round pick for Favre. I don't agree they mortgaged their future.

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

None of those guys are busts and I doubt they regret any of the signings.

They may regret the Favre deal........but it cost them a late 3rd round pick so I don't think they lost much.




oops

[gex]

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

More talented? Our team was extremely talented. I don't buy that for a second.

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.

2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

Faneca, Jenkins, Woody. The Jets did what so many posters here bitch about TT not doing - bring in the free agents! Spend! Ted won't do what it takes!

So the Jets spent, spent, spent. They got the big names.

And they got the QB so many people wanted to have here in GB again.

And they collapsed. They now have an old, cap-heavy team with a fired coach. I think the Packers' future is brighter now than the Jets'. The Jets went for it all in one year. They mortgaged the future for a shot, and they didn't even make the playoffs.


Favre aside, the Jets improved at several positions and improved by five wins. Faneca..........love to have him in GB........Woody........I'd take him.......Jenkins........I'd take him.

How much better do you think the Packers would have done with those three players ?

Their best FA is young enough to have several more solid years. They gave up a late 3rd round pick for Favre. I don't agree they mortgaged their future.

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

None of those guys are busts and I doubt they regret any of the signings.

They may regret the Favre deal........but it cost them a late 3rd round pick so I don't think they lost much.




100

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!

[HarveyWallbangers]

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

I don't disagree with much that you posted, but was it obvious? For the last several seasons, the Jets have been a 10-6 team when Pennington was healthy and the opposite when he wasn't. Did they really improve that much or was it just that they didn't have to start the likes of Kellen Clemens at QB?

[Bretsky]

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

I don't disagree with much that you posted, but was it obvious? For the last several seasons, the Jets have been a 10-6 team when Pennington was healthy and the opposite when he wasn't. Did they really improve that much or was it just that they didn't have to start the likes of Kellen Clemens at QB?


The running game appeared to be greatly improved with the addition of the two free agents. Thomas Jones was junk with the Cardinals, was alright with the Bears, and my NY fantasy squad thanks him this year for being one of the top backs in the NFL this year.

If this team had top games from the QB on a somewhat consistent basis I think they'd be a threat

[Harlan Huckleby]

I give Favre a lot of credit for playing this season with the JEts. There were no guarantees, the team was 4-12 last year, big media pressure. It was a real risk and challenge, Favre went for it just for the love of the game. Winning 9 games ain't bad.

I simply won't buy that Favre played with a "bicep tear" like we've seen with packer defensive linemen. Those injuries are killers, you lose all strength and use of your arm, they are unbelievably painful. Favre had an injury all season, and he was still winging the ball hard. When you get a "pulled muscle" or "sprain", that is actually a tearing of the muscle tissue. (And that's why a strained back, say, often starts hurting a day or two after you strain it, the nerves get inflamed when the torn fibers try to reconnect.)

enough dubious medical information.

Well, one more theory. Favre was throwing the ball this season just as hard as he did as a young man. That must put a hell of a lot of strain on his arm.

[packinpatland]

If there is/was a tear, I think it happened in the last game, after one of those INT's, when Brett tried to reach out and make the tackle, that looked brutal..........before that.......who knows.

[cpk1994]

Hey, now the New Yorkers will know what it's like to go through that soap opera!THe big difference being that the NY papers won't kiss Favre's ass like the Milwaukee Urinal-Garbage and the GB snot rags did.

[sheepshead]

Yeah , Like this. Turns out not everyone is a Favre Fan!




By BRIAN COSTELLO
NEVER MIND: Forget all the Bill Cowher-to-the-Jets talk: The jut-jawed former Steeler coach last night removed his name from contention to succeed Eric Mangini, leaving Gang Green with no clear favorite.
Last updated: 7:17 am
December 31, 2008
Posted: 7:10 am
December 31, 2008

There will be no Cowher Power for the Jets.

Bill Cowher informed the team last night he is not interested in their head-coaching job, and it could be because he doesn't want to coach Brett Favre.

The former Steeler coach was the clear-cut favorite to replace Eric Mangini among Jets fans, and the team's ownership. Now, Woody Johnson must move on to Plan B.

Talks between the Jets and Cowher never advanced past the preliminary stage. The Jets hoped to interview him for the job sometime later this week, but late last night the team released a statement that Cowher had rebuffed their overtures.

"After reaching out to Coach Cowher's representatives, we were informed tonight that he is not a candidate for the position," Jet spokesman Bruce Speight said in an e-mail.

While the Jets hoped to woo Cowher with a boatload of money, the marriage appeared to be unlikely from the outset. Sources close to Cowher said he did not want to have Favre as his quarterback, and that he also wanted to bring in people he was familiar with to handle personnel.

A source familiar with Cowher's thinking said before last night's decision came down that the former Steeler boss would have to receive assurances from the Jets that the 39-year-old Favre no longer was in the picture before agreeing to take control.

"There's no way he's taking Brett Favre as his quarterback," said one person close to Cowher.

Favre was not the only hurdle in the Jets' way. A team source said discussions never got to the point of the team's front-office structure, but indications are that Cowher would have wanted more control over personnel decisions than Mangini had, or at least someone he was familiar with in charge of the personnel.

Johnson decided to keep general manager Mike Tannenbaum when he fired Mangini on Monday. The owner also emphasized he does not want one person doing both the coach and GM jobs.

An ESPN report early yesterday said Cowher was not interested in the Jet job because he wanted full personnel control, but a team source said he never told the team that.

There was talk of Tannenbaum scaling back his duties in order to appease Cowher, but discussions never got that far.

Cowher has not commented publicly on his plans for 2009, but the Jets are the second team he turned down before even getting an offer. He also told the Browns that he was not interested in their head-coaching position.

The 51-year-old Cowher told friends he does not plan on returning to coaching until 2010. He recently extended his contract as a studio analyst with CBS.

With Cowher out of the picture, the coaching search has no favorite. The team is scheduled to interview Giant defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo on Saturday. The Jets also have reached out to veteran coach Marty Schottenheimer, but no interview has been scheduled.

An interesting wild card that was added to the mix yesterday is Mike Shanahan. The Broncos fired the two-time Super Bowl winner, and he may now jump onto the Jets' short list.

Spagnuolo is the darling assistant coach of the NFL right now. Jet fans might revolt at the thought of another unproven assistant taking over their team after the failure of Mangini. But Spagnuolo is known to area fans, and his attacking style on defense probably would excite them.

Schottenheimer is an intriguing candidate. The 65-year-old is a big name with a proven track record who would not come to the Jets with a list of demands. His son, Brian, is the team's offensive coordinator, which would provide continuity and give Marty familiarity with the team.

Marty Schottenheimer would be the second person in his family to interview for the job. In-house candidates Brian and offensive line coach Bill Callahan have both interviewed for the job, but neither is seen as having a strong chance.

brian.costello@nypost.com

[highlander]

Yeah , Like this. Turns out not everyone is a Favre Fan!




By BRIAN COSTELLO
NEVER MIND: Forget all the Bill Cowher-to-the-Jets talk: The jut-jawed former Steeler coach last night removed his name from contention to succeed Eric Mangini, leaving Gang Green with no clear favorite.
Last updated: 7:17 am
December 31, 2008
Posted: 7:10 am
December 31, 2008

There will be no Cowher Power for the Jets.

Bill Cowher informed the team last night he is not interested in their head-coaching job, and it could be because he doesn't want to coach Brett Favre.

The former Steeler coach was the clear-cut favorite to replace Eric Mangini among Jets fans, and the team's ownership. Now, Woody Johnson must move on to Plan B.

Talks between the Jets and Cowher never advanced past the preliminary stage. The Jets hoped to interview him for the job sometime later this week, but late last night the team released a statement that Cowher had rebuffed their overtures.

"After reaching out to Coach Cowher's representatives, we were informed tonight that he is not a candidate for the position," Jet spokesman Bruce Speight said in an e-mail.

While the Jets hoped to woo Cowher with a boatload of money, the marriage appeared to be unlikely from the outset. Sources close to Cowher said he did not want to have Favre as his quarterback, and that he also wanted to bring in people he was familiar with to handle personnel.

A source familiar with Cowher's thinking said before last night's decision came down that the former Steeler boss would have to receive assurances from the Jets that the 39-year-old Favre no longer was in the picture before agreeing to take control.

"There's no way he's taking Brett Favre as his quarterback," said one person close to Cowher.

Favre was not the only hurdle in the Jets' way. A team source said discussions never got to the point of the team's front-office structure, but indications are that Cowher would have wanted more control over personnel decisions than Mangini had, or at least someone he was familiar with in charge of the personnel.

Johnson decided to keep general manager Mike Tannenbaum when he fired Mangini on Monday. The owner also emphasized he does not want one person doing both the coach and GM jobs.

An ESPN report early yesterday said Cowher was not interested in the Jet job because he wanted full personnel control, but a team source said he never told the team that.

There was talk of Tannenbaum scaling back his duties in order to appease Cowher, but discussions never got that far.

Cowher has not commented publicly on his plans for 2009, but the Jets are the second team he turned down before even getting an offer. He also told the Browns that he was not interested in their head-coaching position.

The 51-year-old Cowher told friends he does not plan on returning to coaching until 2010. He recently extended his contract as a studio analyst with CBS.

With Cowher out of the picture, the coaching search has no favorite. The team is scheduled to interview Giant defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo on Saturday. The Jets also have reached out to veteran coach Marty Schottenheimer, but no interview has been scheduled.

An interesting wild card that was added to the mix yesterday is Mike Shanahan. The Broncos fired the two-time Super Bowl winner, and he may now jump onto the Jets' short list.

Spagnuolo is the darling assistant coach of the NFL right now. Jet fans might revolt at the thought of another unproven assistant taking over their team after the failure of Mangini. But Spagnuolo is known to area fans, and his attacking style on defense probably would excite them.

Schottenheimer is an intriguing candidate. The 65-year-old is a big name with a proven track record who would not come to the Jets with a list of demands. His son, Brian, is the team's offensive coordinator, which would provide continuity and give Marty familiarity with the team.

Marty Schottenheimer would be the second person in his family to interview for the job. In-house candidates Brian and offensive line coach Bill Callahan have both interviewed for the job, but neither is seen as having a strong chance.

brian.costello@nypost.com

WOW!!!
THe reputation of a once great QB takes another hit. Why , why why didnt he just stay retired!!!

[pbmax]

If there is/was a tear, I think it happened in the last game, after one of those INT's, when Brett tried to reach out and make the tackle, that looked brutal..........before that.......who knows.
I don't know about that PIP. There is a poster somewhere on this board (not me, this isn't an arm breaking pat on the back) who mentioned earlier this year that in a couple games it seemed like Favre did not have his usual arm strength and his motion had changed. It doesn't mean a ton, as everyone speculates about a QBs arm whenever they struggle, but it was an observation made before the Jets and Favre fell off the wagon. And there were earlier reports that he had done something to his arm or shoulder.

The only odd thing is why wait until after the season to diagnose with an MRI? Even if you bury the injury info and tell the public he is probable - ear lobe, at least you know how to treat the player. Its weird timing unless they are now confirming what was already known to them.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I noticed Favre's diminished arm strength early in the year. I chalked up to age or the fact he wasn't committed in the offseason.

[Pugger]

I don't know about Cowher not wanting to coach Brett. On the NFL Network yesterday it was reported that Cowher only talked to the Jets out of respect for the organization and that Cowher is not interested in any HC job openings right now.

[Fritz]

No, Bretsky, et al, I do think the Jets have mortgaged their future.

The following link reveals that as of around Dec. 20th, the Jets have just under 2 million in cap space: http://www.nyjetscap.com/salary.html.

Favre of course has a monster contract should he come back - 13 million next year. Faneca (one of those FA's you all like) will be at 8 mill, Woody at 6.5, and Jenkins at 6.4.

Of course, the sal cap will go up, but how much is unclear. Certainly the Jets will be constrained. In addition, all the above FA's are long in the tooth, so young players are not able to develop as these oldsters played their way to a 9-7 season. On top of that, the coach is fired. Sure, a new coach could conceivably come in and turn it around just like that, but the Baltimores of the world are still rarer than the San Frans.

Finally, the Jets now are in the process of hiring that new coach while not knowing who the QB will be. If it's Favre, then the pattern of the past five years indicates you can count on a great first half and a terrible second half. Okay. And if Favre doesn't come back, or he's not your QB, you're looking at Kellen Clements or some rookie or some hack who gets cut from some other team. Or maybe you trade some more draft picks for a young guy.

So, in sum: you face a full cap on a roster peppered with aging, expensive vets. This is headed by a 39 year old QB who is about to put you through his annual offseason retirement or not retirement extravaganza. You don't have a head coach. You aren't developing many young players. You're missing a third round pick.

I'd say they mortgaged their future. Yep.

[imscott72]

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

[packinpatland]

I don't know about Cowher not wanting to coach Brett. On the NFL Network yesterday it was reported that Cowher only talked to the Jets out of respect for the organization and that Cowher is not interested in any HC job openings right now.


This seems more in keeping with the way Cowher is....pretty classy guy. I can't imagine any coach saying they don't want the job because of a certain player.......that's media crap.

[HarveyWallbangers]

This seems more in keeping with the way Cowher is....pretty classy guy. I can't imagine any coach saying they don't want the job because of a certain player.......that's media crap.

I have no idea if he feels this way, but would it be that shocking? He wouldn't say it publicly, but I'm sure this happens. There are coaches that have stayed away from a team because of the QB situation. It's possible that a coach doesn't want one year of Favre (and his late season struggles) and then the prospect of having to go find a good QB to replace him a year down the line.

[Lurker64]

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

Are we sure Shenanigans will be coaching anywhere next year? Unless I'm misunderstanding his contract situation, Shanahan will get paid $20 million to sit at home and do nothing for the next three years (or work in TV, etc.).

It would be the rare coaching job that would convince me to give up on that, assuming I'm in his boots.

[imscott72]

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

Are we sure Shenanigans will be coaching anywhere next year? Unless I'm misunderstanding his contract situation, Shanahan will get paid $20 million to sit at home and do nothing for the next three years (or work in TV, etc.).

It would be the rare coaching job that would convince me to give up on that, assuming I'm in his boots.

I hate the Broncos for obvious reasons, but I think Shanny is a great coach and will be in high demand, especially if Cowher doesn't want to coach anywhere next year. I'm surprised Jerry Jones doesn't give him a call and boot Philips.

[denverYooper]

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

Are we sure Shenanigans will be coaching anywhere next year? Unless I'm misunderstanding his contract situation, Shanahan will get paid $20 million to sit at home and do nothing for the next three years (or work in TV, etc.).

It would be the rare coaching job that would convince me to give up on that, assuming I'm in his boots.

Just saw his last Broncos PC today on the local news. It sounded like he was planning on looking for another gig.

[Lurker64]

Apparently Favre was not popular in the Jets locker room (http://www.newsday.com/sports/ny-spfavre0101,0,6438337.story). Several (anonymous) veterans apparently don't want him back.

If the sentiment in the article is at all accurate, the Jets would probably be better off starting the Kellen Clemens era in 2009.

[GrnBay007]

I find something disturbing....as well as funny. Two months ago the people that were posting about Favre were criticized and ridiculed. Even when the Favre thread was created, there were those that were critical of that. Just wondering why, after Favre under performed at the end of the season it's all OK for everyone to post Favre info and to an extent ridicule him? 6-7 pages since the last game. You all wonder why people referred to you as "Favre haters"? Well, seems you never wanted to discuss him during this season until he was not doing well. SAD!

I wish Favre had stayed retired. But when he proclaimed he still wanted to play there was NO WAY I was not going to support him. I supported him as a Jet.

I guess I'm just sad that people are so eager to dog on him, hate him after everything he did for the Packer organization. Least you can do is show some respect. I have a feeling some of you have no idea what that means.