OFFICIAL BRETT THE LIVING LEGEND THREAD

[packerbacker1234]

I find more and more that while I am definitely a packers fan througha nd through, I want us to win the SB every season, win the division every year, etc...

I am adopting the college football mentality. I fucking "hate" Ohio State, hate Michigan, and now Iowa gets on my nerves simply because they keep ruining the badgers dreams every year.

However, when it gets to the post season play, I cheer for our division. I cheer for the NFC North.

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

I want the vikings to be good this year, simply because I don't want the division to just be handed to us. If we don't even have to earn it, how good are we really then? We wont even know until the playoffs.

I want Chicago to bounce back, and for the love of god, it would be great folr detroit to at least get to .500 at some point.

I want our division to be good - I just want us to come out on top of that pile.

Same with the big 10 - once we hit bowl season I want every single Big 10 Team to win, and if we are playing eachother, of course i have personal picks.

Bottom line is, I cheer for our division, and of course, I have a few other choice teams I like - namely the ravens. I also appreciate entertaining football - and there are lots of teams out there that highly entertain me. Favre is possibly the most entertaining player to ever play the game, and while bottom line as a fan I want to win a Super Bowl every year.... I really just want to be entertained. I watch NFL football games because it entertains me, not because I have any personal stake in any team, even the packers.

If they packers win the super bowl, it doesn't actually have any affect on my life. I do not work for the organization, I do not make any kick back for that happening. I simply get to brag to other knuckleheads that hey, were the best this year. When you break it down, as long as I am entertained, I can't complain too much.

[Tarlam!]

when it gets to the post season play, I cheer for our division. I cheer for the NFC North.

I want us to be considered the best division in football,

I agree and loudly supported chicago, and got heat for it.

Yet, I wish Bert personally failure.

[falco]

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

Nothing personal, but this is the biggest line of crap I've ever heard. Nobody says 'so and so' won the Super Bowl, but they came from a crappy division so it doesn't count.

Also, the better our teams are in our own division, the less likely we are to get home field advantage, which means less post season success. Additionally, this has nothing to with rooting for division rivals in the playoffs.

[imscott72]

I want the division to be solid yes, but I will never cheer for Chicago or Minnesota. I just can't do it. Just like in baseball you'll never see me cheer for the Cardinals or Cubs. I'm way too loyal.

[packerbacker1234]

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

Nothing personal, but this is the biggest line of crap I've ever heard. Nobody says 'so and so' won the Super Bowl, but they came from a crappy division so it doesn't count.

Also, the better our teams are in our own division, the less likely we are to get home field advantage, which means less post season success. Additionally, this has nothing to with rooting for division rivals in the playoffs.

I didn't say that either. Playing better compitition during the regular season can help prepare your team for the sort of teams and games they are going to face in the post season. Hence, playing in a division full of elite teams - if your the team that coems out on top, should help prepare you for what your going to face in the playoffs.

I am not saying that is the only reason for anything, or that a SB counts less because your division sucked when you won it. I personally think if the division provides better competition, it gives you a much stronger chance of post season success. I could also care less about home field advantage anymore.

Were a pass first team. You ask me, we would do better on the road in warmer climate or a dome. All these plays with WR's open all over, rodgers scrambling for TD's - that stuff more than likely isn't happening in cold and snow. Teams that can run and play stellar defense will knock us off at home int hat enviroment, and were not a run first offense. Honestly, I would love to have home field, but realistically, we may actually have a better chance of advancing on the road.

[Merlin]

I was actually thinking along the lines of Packerbacker1234's first post - gee, isn't that everyone's strategy for every QB? - when I read Patler's and Lurker's assessments. And they both explain it well.

So I agree with them - this is, in some respects, a new strategy.

As for Packerbacker's claim that Favre has finally learned to play smartly, may I be the first to politely suggest that you go back and take a look at the last pass Favre threw last season?

SUre it was a poor decision, but of any time in his career to make a bad choice, that was one time I just can't blame him per say. THere was a penalty the play before that even put the ball in his hands, he already HAD THEM in position to win with what is a easily makeable FG for Longwell, and the coaches screwed that one up.

The pass was a bad decision, but the man was beaten. All day long. He played very well, especially given the damaging, and illegal, hits he was taking. He should of ran, should of thrown it away, should of never one back across his body - but man, I was surprised he was still standing at that point. They already had the game won and the coaches fuck up was far more inexcusable than favre's. You do NOT get a 12 man in the huddle penalty when your in game winning FG range. Ever. There is no excuse. At least favre can say he was "trying to make a play".


Seriously, if I am a vikings fan, I would of been calling for the OC's head for that 12 man penalty, or whoever the fuck was in control of it, be it childress, or whatever> just like against philly for us the one year on 4th and 27 - I blame the defensive coordinator for that loss, not favre. Favre should not be required to win you every game, especially after he already did what he needed to do TO win.

I finally got to this thread. A thread that showcases the worst in some people that just don't and never will get it. That being that it's surely a Packer forum and was once an awesome Packer Forum that's in a decline based on it's history. Why? Maybe because of attacks against those of us that still love the Packers and equally love the game of football, and the brand or style of football played in the NFL. Are we supposed to ignore those with insults

I love sports generally. I've followed the teams that Vladimir Guerrero plays on in MLB, since he was a Montreal Expo. The Angels and now Texans. I have been too busy of late to check his progress this season but know the the Texans are a near lock to win their division. I always followed the teams that the Big 'M' ( Frank Mahovlich) played on. The Toronto Maple Leafs, Detroit Red Wings and Montreal Canadians in the NHL. I play golf as a lefty so I follow Phil Michelson and Mike Weir and staynloyal to these men no matter how they are playing.

I have followed the Green Bay packers ups and long periods of downs likely longer than any member of Packer Rats. That began way back in 1958 or just before the Vince Lombardi Era. I'm pleased that the Green Bay Packers are picked as a team to contend this season as we're in somewhat of a drought. I love the drama in sports and the Brett Favre story certainly fills my appetite there.

Brett Favre has given me more awesome thrills than any other Pro athlete. I remain loyal to Brett Favre as an NFL fan but:

If Aaron Rodgers and the Packers can get tit together and jump over the Favre led Vikings.? That won't disappoint me.

Wherer I get to shaking my head is when posters here are attacked or called out to choose 'all Packers' over football and the excitement and drama as part and partial of the NFL.

I was once the leading poster on this forum in terms of number of posts. I have received incredible criticism from many no longer here now. Amongst that group I deem there was a consistency. They were moderately toincorrigibly insulting and / or abusive to anyone that didn't hate Brett Favre.

I'm in some sadness to see the likes of Rastak gone from PackerRats. He was golden here and that as a Vikings fan. Who in their right ming could post in a manner that would cause Rastak to retire from PackerRats? To read that Bretsky isn"t as active or gone fr. Packerrats, is just plain ugly. B. was one of my favourite posters here. He's gone!!? WTF. Grnbay007 gone. Give me a break! She was a real Lady and an awesome Packer fan and support for our forum. These three posters all wonderful contributors and if thet stay away ? Anyone of those three or any poster with proper style and manners. WE all must share that fact as BLAME.

On the topic of Brett Favre and his mobility:

That man is still playing in the 40/41st year of his life! He was incredible overall last season setting big personal numbers. Some of you point to the obvious. He has to slow down or not run outside of the pocket. The issues that appear to me as obvious in terms of Favre and scrabling or not. How good is his OL in any given game?

The Vikings had an ugly game plan at half time in terms wih it's OL. Favre was getting killed. Vikings HC Brad Childress was livid with hiS OL'S UGLY Performance. Some of you Packer fans can point out just another end of game pick against Brett Favre.

As an NFL fan and keen in my support of a great game between two opponets Favre and the Vikings didn't disappoint. I'd love to see the Vikings play us in the NFC Championship game. I realize that's a longshot.

Also I cheer this way: I want Favre to play well and the same goes for Aaron Rodgers.

Let the BEST team win !

On the matter of losing members:

I'll lay it out there again: I'm shamed that Bretzky, GrnBay007 and Rastak are gone. I might have helped them hang in there but sooner than later anyone abused let's go except for men as I am. I'm certainly not implying that I'm better/ stronger than those three fine and overall active and contributing posters. It was up to the Administrator of PackerRats to take whatever step was necessary before we lost such quality posters/people. That step had to be something other than the illimination of this thread as that would have been scapegoating or ... to the abusers.

My name is Ed. woodbuck27 :D


Nice post. I watch Favre for what he brings to the game, I don't cheer for any team unless the Packers are out of the playoffs. Last year it ended up being Minnesota, then New Orleans. I want our division to be the best in the league, I want Chicago, Detroit, and Minnesota to be highly competitive. I as many have said, don't want the division handed to us and let's face it, the NFC North has had some pretty bad years. Right now the NFC West looks like it is coming our of it's slump. The better the teams in the NFC North do, the better it makes the Packers when we beat them. I don't know how Favre and the Vikings will do and I hope the Packers extract some revenge this year, however that revenge runs both way and the rivalry between these 2 teams is always a good game and the winner is never predetermined.

I don't post much at all anymore although I do read a lot of posts. The bottom line for me is that if anyone disagrees with anything, it instantly becomes a personal attack instead of a friendly exchange of views. Life is too short for me to waste my time and yours, so I don't post much.

[ThunderDan]

I find more and more that while I am definitely a packers fan througha nd through, I want us to win the SB every season, win the division every year, etc...

I am adopting the college football mentality. I fucking "hate" Ohio State, hate Michigan, and now Iowa gets on my nerves simply because they keep ruining the badgers dreams every year.

However, when it gets to the post season play, I cheer for our division. I cheer for the NFC North.

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

I want the vikings to be good this year, simply because I don't want the division to just be handed to us. If we don't even have to earn it, how good are we really then? We wont even know until the playoffs.

I want Chicago to bounce back, and for the love of god, it would be great folr detroit to at least get to .500 at some point.

I want our division to be good - I just want us to come out on top of that pile.

Same with the big 10 - once we hit bowl season I want every single Big 10 Team to win, and if we are playing eachother, of course i have personal picks.

Bottom line is, I cheer for our division, and of course, I have a few other choice teams I like - namely the ravens. I also appreciate entertaining football - and there are lots of teams out there that highly entertain me. Favre is possibly the most entertaining player to ever play the game, and while bottom line as a fan I want to win a Super Bowl every year.... I really just want to be entertained. I watch NFL football games because it entertains me, not because I have any personal stake in any team, even the packers.

If they packers win the super bowl, it doesn't actually have any affect on my life. I do not work for the organization, I do not make any kick back for that happening. I simply get to brag to other knuckleheads that hey, were the best this year. When you break it down, as long as I am entertained, I can't complain too much.

I also root for the Big Ten in bowl games but the college game has no playoffs so the Badgers will never have to play another Big Ten team in a bowl game.

If the Packers win the North it sure the hell wont because the lucked into it. Even if we go 6-0 in the North we need to win 4 or so other games.

We would have to beat some combination of:
NYG, WASH, DAL, PHI
NE, NYJ, MIA, BUF
ATL, SF

I see 1 cupcake game in there and it would be BUF.

[Fritz]

I spend so much emotional energy hating on certain teams that there's no way I can ever root for them. I frickin' hate the Bears. the Vikes, and the Lions (yes I do), so I can't root for any of them in the playoffs. Fuggem and the horse they rode in on.

Nor can I, under any circumstances, root for the Cowboys. If for example the Cowgirls play the Queens in a playoff game, I hope they both lose. I'll watch the game and hope every pass is dropped, every player misses tackles, and they generally suck the kind of goat testicles best described by Mr. Skin Basket.

[Pugger]

I spend so much emotional energy hating on certain teams that there's no way I can ever root for them. I frickin' hate the Bears. the Vikes, and the Lions (yes I do), so I can't root for any of them in the playoffs. Fuggem and the horse they rode in on.

Nor can I, under any circumstances, root for the Cowboys. If for example the Cowgirls play the Queens in a playoff game, I hope they both lose. I'll watch the game and hope every pass is dropped, every player misses tackles, and they generally suck the kind of goat testicles best described by Mr. Skin Basket.

+1

[Bossman641]

Here is a Rodgers story I had never heard before

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100902


4. Aaron Rodgers, Packers
2010's most savvy bet: Rodgers to win the MVP as a semi-long shot at 12-to-1 odds. Last season, he threw for 4,434 yards, 30 touchdowns and just seven picks, then nearly pulled off a historic comeback in that unforgettable Packers-Cards wild-card game (finishing with 423 passing yards, four TDs). And Green Bay's offense has "The Look" in the preseason: Everything is pointing toward a 2009 Saints-type breakout year. On a personal note, my affection for Rodgers increased exponentially at ESPN's Sundance party during the conference championships, when Rodgers and his buddies unabashedly rooted against former nemesis Favre and the Vikings down the stretch and celebrated raucously when New Orleans pulled it out. Rodgers couldn't have been more delighted; he did everything but climb on the bar and start a "F--- YOU, FAVRE!" chant. I will always root for him after that. And yes, that story is 100 percent true.

:D :D :D :D :D

Love Rodgers

[Joemailman]

However, when it gets to the post season play, I cheer for our division. I cheer for the NFC North.

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

I want the vikings to be good this year, simply because I don't want the division to just be handed to us. If we don't even have to earn it, how good are we really then? We wont even know until the playoffs.

I want Chicago to bounce back, and for the love of god, it would be great folr detroit to at least get to .500 at some point.

I want our division to be good - I just want us to come out on top of that pile.

Same with the big 10 - once we hit bowl season I want every single Big 10 Team to win, and if we are playing eachother, of course i have personal picks.

Bottom line is, I cheer for our division, and of course, I have a few other choice teams I like - namely the ravens. I also appreciate entertaining football - and there are lots of teams out there that highly entertain me. Favre is possibly the most entertaining player to ever play the game, and while bottom line as a fan I want to win a Super Bowl every year.... I really just want to be entertained. I watch NFL football games because it entertains me, not because I have any personal stake in any team, even the packers.

If they packers win the super bowl, it doesn't actually have any affect on my life. I do not work for the organization, I do not make any kick back for that happening. I simply get to brag to other knuckleheads that hey, were the best this year. When you break it down, as long as I am entertained, I can't complain too much.

B.S. Being in a tough division means nothing once the playoffs start. Saints had no competition in the division last year, and it didn't matter. Look, we get it. You'll cheer for whatever team Favre is playing for. You don't need to come up with rationalizations for it.

[falco]

However, when it gets to the post season play, I cheer for our division. I cheer for the NFC North.

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

I want the vikings to be good this year, simply because I don't want the division to just be handed to us. If we don't even have to earn it, how good are we really then? We wont even know until the playoffs.

I want Chicago to bounce back, and for the love of god, it would be great folr detroit to at least get to .500 at some point.

I want our division to be good - I just want us to come out on top of that pile.

Same with the big 10 - once we hit bowl season I want every single Big 10 Team to win, and if we are playing eachother, of course i have personal picks.

Bottom line is, I cheer for our division, and of course, I have a few other choice teams I like - namely the ravens. I also appreciate entertaining football - and there are lots of teams out there that highly entertain me. Favre is possibly the most entertaining player to ever play the game, and while bottom line as a fan I want to win a Super Bowl every year.... I really just want to be entertained. I watch NFL football games because it entertains me, not because I have any personal stake in any team, even the packers.

If they packers win the super bowl, it doesn't actually have any affect on my life. I do not work for the organization, I do not make any kick back for that happening. I simply get to brag to other knuckleheads that hey, were the best this year. When you break it down, as long as I am entertained, I can't complain too much.

B.S. Being in a tough division means nothing once the playoffs start. Saints had no competition in the division last year, and it didn't matter. Look, we get it. You'll cheer for whatever team Favre is playing for. You don't need to come up with rationalizations for it.

If I recall, Cardinals coasted in the playoffs in 2008 too.

[packerbacker1234]

However, when it gets to the post season play, I cheer for our division. I cheer for the NFC North.

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

I want the vikings to be good this year, simply because I don't want the division to just be handed to us. If we don't even have to earn it, how good are we really then? We wont even know until the playoffs.

I want Chicago to bounce back, and for the love of god, it would be great folr detroit to at least get to .500 at some point.

I want our division to be good - I just want us to come out on top of that pile.

Same with the big 10 - once we hit bowl season I want every single Big 10 Team to win, and if we are playing eachother, of course i have personal picks.

Bottom line is, I cheer for our division, and of course, I have a few other choice teams I like - namely the ravens. I also appreciate entertaining football - and there are lots of teams out there that highly entertain me. Favre is possibly the most entertaining player to ever play the game, and while bottom line as a fan I want to win a Super Bowl every year.... I really just want to be entertained. I watch NFL football games because it entertains me, not because I have any personal stake in any team, even the packers.

If they packers win the super bowl, it doesn't actually have any affect on my life. I do not work for the organization, I do not make any kick back for that happening. I simply get to brag to other knuckleheads that hey, were the best this year. When you break it down, as long as I am entertained, I can't complain too much.

B.S. Being in a tough division means nothing once the playoffs start. Saints had no competition in the division last year, and it didn't matter. Look, we get it. You'll cheer for whatever team Favre is playing for. You don't need to come up with rationalizations for it.

I rooted for the bears to beat the colts in the SB. The only time I have not wanted an NFC North team to advance was when the vikings knocked us out, which is understandable, since you often want just rewards whena division rival eliminates you.

Outside of that, I almost always want the division teams to do well in the playoffs, so long as it doesn't end my teams run. It's not about rooting for whatever team Favre is on - until the playoffs, I certainly was not rooting for the vikings. I was not rooting for them at all when we watched them go up an ddown the field on us. I was not rooting for them to take the division.

However, once we got out, what more can I do? Saints were a good story, vikings have some players I can't help but respect. Put the QB aside...

I do really like AP. I like jared allen, and despite leaving us, I like longwell too. I think their coach is tool, but I have no real anomisity against anyone on that team. It was a real torn feeling for me int he saints game. On one hand, I like brees and sharper, and I really wante dthe saints to win for their city. On the other, Favre had a chance to cap his career, and the vikings winning it all gives us even more reaosn to stomp them this year.

Yes, I support favre on the field because he is entertaining to watch. Doesn't mean I am suddenly a vikings fan because he is on the team. I really never even started rooting for them until the saints did an illegal hit on #4. When that happened, and there was not even a flag for it, I started pulling for vikings because it felt like the saints defense was playing dirty - and they were. They admitted as much.

[MJZiggy]

However, when it gets to the post season play, I cheer for our division. I cheer for the NFC North.

I want us to be considered the best division in football, because that means when the packers win it, it makes us appear that much better. Also the better the other teams are in our own division, the better we must become, which will lead to better post season success.

I want the vikings to be good this year, simply because I don't want the division to just be handed to us. If we don't even have to earn it, how good are we really then? We wont even know until the playoffs.

I want Chicago to bounce back, and for the love of god, it would be great folr detroit to at least get to .500 at some point.

I want our division to be good - I just want us to come out on top of that pile.

Same with the big 10 - once we hit bowl season I want every single Big 10 Team to win, and if we are playing eachother, of course i have personal picks.

Bottom line is, I cheer for our division, and of course, I have a few other choice teams I like - namely the ravens. I also appreciate entertaining football - and there are lots of teams out there that highly entertain me. Favre is possibly the most entertaining player to ever play the game, and while bottom line as a fan I want to win a Super Bowl every year.... I really just want to be entertained. I watch NFL football games because it entertains me, not because I have any personal stake in any team, even the packers.

If they packers win the super bowl, it doesn't actually have any affect on my life. I do not work for the organization, I do not make any kick back for that happening. I simply get to brag to other knuckleheads that hey, were the best this year. When you break it down, as long as I am entertained, I can't complain too much.

B.S. Being in a tough division means nothing once the playoffs start. Saints had no competition in the division last year, and it didn't matter. Look, we get it. You'll cheer for whatever team Favre is playing for. You don't need to come up with rationalizations for it.

I rooted for the bears to beat the colts in the SB. The only time I have not wanted an NFC North team to advance was when the vikings knocked us out, which is understandable, since you often want just rewards whena division rival eliminates you.

Outside of that, I almost always want the division teams to do well in the playoffs, so long as it doesn't end my teams run. It's not about rooting for whatever team Favre is on - until the playoffs, I certainly was not rooting for the vikings. I was not rooting for them at all when we watched them go up an ddown the field on us. I was not rooting for them to take the division.

However, once we got out, what more can I do? Saints were a good story, vikings have some players I can't help but respect. Put the QB aside...

I do really like AP. I like jared allen, and despite leaving us, I like longwell too. I think their coach is tool, but I have no real anomisity against anyone on that team. It was a real torn feeling for me int he saints game. On one hand, I like brees and sharper, and I really wante dthe saints to win for their city. On the other, Favre had a chance to cap his career, and the vikings winning it all gives us even more reaosn to stomp them this year.

Yes, I support favre on the field because he is entertaining to watch. Doesn't mean I am suddenly a vikings fan because he is on the team. I really never even started rooting for them until the saints did an illegal hit on #4. When that happened, and there was not even a flag for it, I started pulling for vikings because it felt like the saints defense was playing dirty - and they were. They admitted as much.

I was rooting for the Colts. Much as I didn't want Manning to get it. Dungy's class overrode that sentiment and I thought he absolutely deserved the Lombardi Trophy. Everything I've ever read about the guy (and I was in Tampa at the same time he was) screamed winner.

[Freak Out]

I rooted for the bears to beat the colts in the SB.

:wow:

[woodbuck27]

Just saw on sportscenter is looking like he is going to have a tough time with his ankle...

I don't wish injury upon anybody. But I hope he completely ruins his legacy by playing so poorly, that he gets put in the "didn't know when to quit" basket.

After all the drama with this guy, I doubt his legend will be in the same class as Lombardi (who left), Reggie White (who left) even Holmgren.

I hope they change Brett Favre Pass as a street name, too.

I want Favre to go on playing at least as long as Blanda did. Win two more SB's and another MVP but ' Father Time ' isn't his best friend. He may try too hard and sustain serious injury. Many of the wolves in here will relish that as they descend into the pits they fashion for themseves. hahaa. When we should realize we do have choices I constantly am amazed that some choose hatred and for a sports star.

Come on Packer fans. Smarten up. The man loves to play football-compete still. I won't dust his balls for that, but I won't stop following the Legend either.

It has to be frustrating to be a Favre hater. I'm so happy being the man I am ' an NFL fan 'with now two teams I can pull for. Geee what will I do if the Bears ever get on track?

All of this stuff we debate Re: this or that condition concerning Favre did this or didn't do that. Is entirely out of our control. We can control our emotions and keep them positive - healthy. What will some Packer fans do if he leads the Vikings to the Super Bowl while defeating the Pack 2X again this season? If in the process he pass's for more than 4000 yards and 30 TD's? Are you going to go on hating him?

He's one of the most iconic Pro athlete STARS ALL TIME. Favre's ' the most exciting ' football player on the planet all time IMO. Hate 'that' man? :lol:

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.

[Gunakor]

What will some Packer fans do if he leads the Vikings to the Super Bowl while defeating the Pack 2X again this season?

Hate him even more. But that goes for Jay Cutler if the Bears win the division beating the Packers twice also. Same for Matthew Stafford and the Lions. If you lead your team to defeat mine TWICE, you have earned my hatred.

That said, I hope he gets humiliated by the Packers twice, misses the playoffs entirely, and runs back to his estate in Mississippi in early January with his tail between his legs and a Green Bay Packer helmet lodged so far up his ass even Dr. Andrews can't get it out. After which the Vikings organization implodes, moves to LA, and finds itself forever engulfed in the specter of mediocrity and shame. Oh, and I hope Brad Childress is their coach forever.

[Bossman641]

Just saw on sportscenter is looking like he is going to have a tough time with his ankle...

I don't wish injury upon anybody. But I hope he completely ruins his legacy by playing so poorly, that he gets put in the "didn't know when to quit" basket.

After all the drama with this guy, I doubt his legend will be in the same class as Lombardi (who left), Reggie White (who left) even Holmgren.

I hope they change Brett Favre Pass as a street name, too.

I want Favre to go on playing at least as long as Blanda did. Win two more SB's and another MVP but ' Father Time ' isn't his best friend. He may try too hard and sustain serious injury. Many of the wolves in here will relish that as they descend into the pits they fashion for themseves. hahaa. When we should realize we do have choices I constantly am amazed that some choose hatred and for a sports star.

Come on Packer fans. Smarten up. The man loves to play football-compete still. I won't dust his balls for that, but I won't stop following the Legend either.

It has to be frustrating to be a Favre hater. I'm so happy being the man I am ' an NFL fan 'with now two teams I can pull for. Geee what will I do if the Bears ever get on track?

All of this stuff we debate Re: this or that condition concerning Favre did this or didn't do that. Is entirely out of our control. We can control our emotions and keep them positive - healthy. What will some Packer fans do if he leads the Vikings to the Super Bowl while defeating the Pack 2X again this season? If in the process he pass's for more than 4000 yards and 30 TD's? Are you going to go on hating him?

He's one of the most iconic Pro athlete STARS ALL TIME. Favre's ' the most exciting ' football player on the planet all time IMO. Hate 'that' man? :lol:

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.

Seriously, step off your fuckin soap box.

Those of us who hate the Vikings and want them to fail have always wanted them to fail. It's not like we used to wish them the best but then started to dislike them as soon as Favre went there.

I'd say that's a lot more normal and consistent then only starting to like the Vikings once Favre went there. It must be frustrating to be so easily swayed by one man.

[RashanGary]

Everyone has a right to their opinion, even if they think Favre is narcissist. Everyone has a right to their opinion even if they think he's a unique, special person who is really a notch above the rest as far as how our admiration should be doled out.

I'm no guru of spirituality, but it seems to me we cannot change other people's opinions and for all we know, they may be the ones who are right!

[Scott Campbell]

It has to be frustrating to be a Favre hater.


He made it surprisingly fulfilling. :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoJ_K4Mlt4w

[Scott Campbell]

Here is a Rodgers story I had never heard before

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100902


4. Aaron Rodgers, Packers
2010's most savvy bet: Rodgers to win the MVP as a semi-long shot at 12-to-1 odds. Last season, he threw for 4,434 yards, 30 touchdowns and just seven picks, then nearly pulled off a historic comeback in that unforgettable Packers-Cards wild-card game (finishing with 423 passing yards, four TDs). And Green Bay's offense has "The Look" in the preseason: Everything is pointing toward a 2009 Saints-type breakout year. On a personal note, my affection for Rodgers increased exponentially at ESPN's Sundance party during the conference championships, when Rodgers and his buddies unabashedly rooted against former nemesis Favre and the Vikings down the stretch and celebrated raucously when New Orleans pulled it out. Rodgers couldn't have been more delighted; he did everything but climb on the bar and start a "F--- YOU, FAVRE!" chant. I will always root for him after that. And yes, that story is 100 percent true.

:D :D :D :D :D

Love Rodgers



Awesome story. Just awesome. It sounds like Aaron hates him every bit as much as many of us do. Awesome.

[Joemailman]

I don't think he hates Favre. They'll likely never be friends, but I think there's some respect there. Rodgers cheering for the Saints might have had a lot to do with the fact that Rodgers and Brees are good friends. Besides, maybe like a lot of Packer fans, he just doesn't want to see the Vikings win. But that's not as good a story as saying he hates Favre.

[mraynrand]

It has to be frustrating to be a Favre hater.


He made it surprisingly fulfilling. :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoJ_K4Mlt4w

LOL at the Foreman guy at the end. The woman in the front looks frightened. What is he smacking against the fireplace?

[mraynrand]

Food for thought?

http://redsoxfanhandbook.net/index.php?title=Roger_Clemens


"Boston fans’ love/hate relationship with Roger Clemens peaked during his years with the Yankees, but has diminished somewhat now that he’s with the Astros. Wildly popular in his first eight years in Boston, and still popular in his last years in the city, when Clemens left for Toronto blame was split between Clemens and Duquette, the GM who failed to re-sign him. When Clemens orchestrated a trade to the archrival Yankees, he became a player many fans loved to hate. Clemens was booed when he pitched badly against the Red Sox in the 1999 American League Championship Series. Perhaps the greatest highlight of the disappointing 2000 season was an epic pitching duel between Clemens and Sox ace Pedro Martinez. Clemens remains a contentious figure in Boston, sometimes booed, sometimes cheered, but always drawing attention."

[Tarlam!]

A contentious figure? Great description of Bert.

[MichiganPackerFan]

...

I liked your thoughts Mr. Woodbuck.

What the hell ever happened to Harlan? Scott, did you two have a rough break up?

[MichiganPackerFan]

I dont care if you love him or hate him, what got out of control was the Pack on Pack crime. People are entitled to their opinions without being shat on.

[Scott Campbell]

...

I liked your thoughts Mr. Woodbuck.

What the hell ever happened to Harlan? Scott, did you two have a rough break up?


My love for Harlan knows no bounds. He was active in FYI, and rarely seen anywhere else. Not sure where he is.

[Tony Oday]

...

I liked your thoughts Mr. Woodbuck.

What the hell ever happened to Harlan? Scott, did you two have a rough break up?


My love for Harlan knows no bounds. He was active in FYI, and rarely seen anywhere else. Not sure where he is.

He is sad that Obama's approval rating fell below 50%...I am sure he is on a Jack bender right now

[channtheman]

I rooted for the bears to beat the colts in the SB.

:wow:

My hate for Manning almost rivals that of the Bears. I was okay with either team who won that game. The media hype for Manning (he won MVP of that Super Bowl and played terribly) disgusts me so much that I hate to see him win anything.

[ThunderDan]

I rooted for the bears to beat the colts in the SB.

:wow:

My hate for Manning almost rivals that of the Bears. I was okay with either team who won that game. The media hype for Manning (he won MVP of that Super Bowl and played terribly) disgusts me so much that I hate to see him win anything.

That was the Super Bowl that I could not root for either team.

[Pugger]

What will some Packer fans do if he leads the Vikings to the Super Bowl while defeating the Pack 2X again this season?

Hate him even more. But that goes for Jay Cutler if the Bears win the division beating the Packers twice also. Same for Matthew Stafford and the Lions. If you lead your team to defeat mine TWICE, you have earned my hatred.

That said, I hope he gets humiliated by the Packers twice, misses the playoffs entirely, and runs back to his estate in Mississippi in early January with his tail between his legs and a Green Bay Packer helmet lodged so far up his ass even Dr. Andrews can't get it out. After which the Vikings organization implodes, moves to LA, and finds itself forever engulfed in the specter of mediocrity and shame. Oh, and I hope Brad Childress is their coach forever.

+1 :lol:

[Pugger]

Just saw on sportscenter is looking like he is going to have a tough time with his ankle...

I don't wish injury upon anybody. But I hope he completely ruins his legacy by playing so poorly, that he gets put in the "didn't know when to quit" basket.

After all the drama with this guy, I doubt his legend will be in the same class as Lombardi (who left), Reggie White (who left) even Holmgren.

I hope they change Brett Favre Pass as a street name, too.

I want Favre to go on playing at least as long as Blanda did. Win two more SB's and another MVP but ' Father Time ' isn't his best friend. He may try too hard and sustain serious injury. Many of the wolves in here will relish that as they descend into the pits they fashion for themseves. hahaa. When we should realize we do have choices I constantly am amazed that some choose hatred and for a sports star.

Come on Packer fans. Smarten up. The man loves to play football-compete still. I won't dust his balls for that, but I won't stop following the Legend either.

It has to be frustrating to be a Favre hater. I'm so happy being the man I am ' an NFL fan 'with now two teams I can pull for. Geee what will I do if the Bears ever get on track?

All of this stuff we debate Re: this or that condition concerning Favre did this or didn't do that. Is entirely out of our control. We can control our emotions and keep them positive - healthy. What will some Packer fans do if he leads the Vikings to the Super Bowl while defeating the Pack 2X again this season? If in the process he pass's for more than 4000 yards and 30 TD's? Are you going to go on hating him?

He's one of the most iconic Pro athlete STARS ALL TIME. Favre's ' the most exciting ' football player on the planet all time IMO. Hate 'that' man? :lol:

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.

Seriously, step off your fuckin soap box.

Those of us who hate the Vikings and want them to fail have always wanted them to fail. It's not like we used to wish them the best but then started to dislike them as soon as Favre went there.

I'd say that's a lot more normal and consistent then only starting to like the Vikings once Favre went there. It must be frustrating to be so easily swayed by one man.

My goodness, two in a row. :D I too have always hated the queens, pandas and loins. As long as Farp wears purple I have no use for him cuz his team stands in the way of MY team's road to the Super Bowl.

[Pugger]

I don't think he hates Favre. They'll likely never be friends, but I think there's some respect there. Rodgers cheering for the Saints might have had a lot to do with the fact that Rodgers and Brees are good friends. Besides, maybe like a lot of Packer fans, he just doesn't want to see the Vikings win. But that's not as good a story as saying he hates Favre.

I doubt Rodgers hates Favre either. Now, if we turn the question around...!!!

[woodbuck27]

Here is a Rodgers story I had never heard before

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100902


4. Aaron Rodgers, Packers
2010's most savvy bet: Rodgers to win the MVP as a semi-long shot at 12-to-1 odds. Last season, he threw for 4,434 yards, 30 touchdowns and just seven picks, then nearly pulled off a historic comeback in that unforgettable Packers-Cards wild-card game (finishing with 423 passing yards, four TDs). And Green Bay's offense has "The Look" in the preseason: Everything is pointing toward a 2009 Saints-type breakout year. On a personal note, my affection for Rodgers increased exponentially at ESPN's Sundance party during the conference championships, when Rodgers and his buddies unabashedly rooted against former nemesis Favre and the Vikings down the stretch and celebrated raucously when New Orleans pulled it out. Rodgers couldn't have been more delighted; he did everything but climb on the bar and start a "F--- YOU, FAVRE!" chant. I will always root for him after that. And yes, that story is 100 percent true.

:D :D :D :D :D

Love Rodgers

Come on Man. :shock:

Is that really a good thing? I think not. That's questionable behaviour in terms of it's one of those in your face things that often backfire in sports rivalrys.

Or this:

Isn't that a little more oil on the fire Favre and the Vikings need? That's the sort of thing that generally fires up any rival in the world of sports and adds incentive to beat that opponent. Not smart ...bad karma for us on behalf of Aaron Rodgers. A waste of energy. Over negative.

It's better to wait. Be patient and put it all out there on the field. Win games on the field by demonstrating superiority and keep the emotions out of it.

GO PACK GO!

[woodbuck27]

Also I cheer this way: I want Favre to play well and the same goes for Aaron Rodgers.

Let the BEST team win !



I want Favre to play poorly and for the Vikings to lose horribly, just as I have always wanted for those miserable Vikings. I have never wanted, nor will I ever want a Viking QB to play well. As to the 'Let the Best team win' - if the 'Best team' happens to be the Vikings, I still hope they find a way to lose, because I like the Packers and hate the Vikings ('Hate' for you pansies means in an athletic competition sense, not REAL hate).

If this POV causes you to flee Packerrats, don't let the browser hit you in the ass on the way out! :D

LOL. It's just this sort of post from a man I consider otherwise of intelligence, mraynrand, that keeps me a proud member of this forum. I simply stand by my beliefs and do so consistently.

By the way mraynrand. I'm far and away removed, from any real sense, of a pansy label. Anyone who really knows me 'in the real world' would ever suggest such nonsense. I have too much strength man. :D

The same goes for the likes of Rastak, Bretzky and GrnBay007. All decent people. I want all three to return to this forum. They are solid people as I came to know and understand them. Big loss's to PackerRats.

GO PACKERS ! Get it done this season.

[Scott Campbell]

Here is a Rodgers story I had never heard before

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100902


4. Aaron Rodgers, Packers
2010's most savvy bet: Rodgers to win the MVP as a semi-long shot at 12-to-1 odds. Last season, he threw for 4,434 yards, 30 touchdowns and just seven picks, then nearly pulled off a historic comeback in that unforgettable Packers-Cards wild-card game (finishing with 423 passing yards, four TDs). And Green Bay's offense has "The Look" in the preseason: Everything is pointing toward a 2009 Saints-type breakout year. On a personal note, my affection for Rodgers increased exponentially at ESPN's Sundance party during the conference championships, when Rodgers and his buddies unabashedly rooted against former nemesis Favre and the Vikings down the stretch and celebrated raucously when New Orleans pulled it out. Rodgers couldn't have been more delighted; he did everything but climb on the bar and start a "F--- YOU, FAVRE!" chant. I will always root for him after that. And yes, that story is 100 percent true.

:D :D :D :D :D

Love Rodgers

Come on Man. :shock:

Is that really a good thing?



Yes. Yes it is a good thing. He's one of us now.

[Merlin]

I rooted for the bears to beat the colts in the SB.

:wow:

My hate for Manning almost rivals that of the Bears. I was okay with either team who won that game. The media hype for Manning (he won MVP of that Super Bowl and played terribly) disgusts me so much that I hate to see him win anything.

I couldn't agree more. That was a painful Super Bowl to watch and the media hype of Manning makes me want to puke. When we put up 58 on them a week ago it couldn't have been but a day later that analysts were saying that the re-position of the Umpire cost the Colts the game and is a stupid idea - all leading with Peyton giving the ref an ear full. If ANY player in the NFL put the Umpire in jeopardy, it's Manning. The Colts run more plays that use the Umpire as a pick than any other team. If Manning is such a GREAT QB, it doesn't matter where the Umpire lines up, you adjust, instead he wines like a baby. Also, the bullshit "rules" that come out because Manning doesn't like something and makes a stink. Nothing is EVER that guys fault and the media is very quick to sweep every time he threw his team under the bus, under the rug.

I'll give him this, the commercials he does are usually pretty funny, the sad part is even then you can see this guys ego. Out of all of the QB's in the league, his jersey is one that I seldom ever see anyone wear anywhere but at a Colts game, I wonder why?

[pbmax]

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.
I believe its still the same two year deal framework (09 through 10), but he was given additional money for this year. Some of the amount and much of the incentives would be paid out in 2011, after this season. But I believe the contract runs only through 2010.

[pbmax]

I dont care if you love him or hate him, what got out of control was the Pack on Pack crime. People are entitled to their opinions without being shat on.
Quoted for truth. Dayum.

[Patler]

Here is a Rodgers story I had never heard before

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100902


4. Aaron Rodgers, Packers
2010's most savvy bet: Rodgers to win the MVP as a semi-long shot at 12-to-1 odds. Last season, he threw for 4,434 yards, 30 touchdowns and just seven picks, then nearly pulled off a historic comeback in that unforgettable Packers-Cards wild-card game (finishing with 423 passing yards, four TDs). And Green Bay's offense has "The Look" in the preseason: Everything is pointing toward a 2009 Saints-type breakout year. On a personal note, my affection for Rodgers increased exponentially at ESPN's Sundance party during the conference championships, when Rodgers and his buddies unabashedly rooted against former nemesis Favre and the Vikings down the stretch and celebrated raucously when New Orleans pulled it out. Rodgers couldn't have been more delighted; he did everything but climb on the bar and start a "F--- YOU, FAVRE!" chant. I will always root for him after that. And yes, that story is 100 percent true.

:D :D :D :D :D

Love Rodgers

Come on Man. :shock:

Is that really a good thing? I think not. That's questionable behaviour in terms of it's one of those in your face things that often backfire in sports rivalrys.

Or this:

Isn't that a little more oil on the fire Favre and the Vikings need? That's the sort of thing that generally fires up any rival in the world of sports and adds incentive to beat that opponent. Not smart ...bad karma for us on behalf of Aaron Rodgers. A waste of energy. Over negative.

It's better to wait. Be patient and put it all out there on the field. Win games on the field by demonstrating superiority and keep the emotions out of it.

GO PACK GO!

Its not as significant as a telephone consultation with your former teams upcoming opponent.

[gex]

I dont care if you love him or hate him, what got out of control was the Pack on Pack crime. People are entitled to their opinions without being shat on.
Quoted for truth. Dayum.

2nd

[NewsBruin]

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.
I believe its still the same two year deal framework (09 through 10), but he was given additional money for this year. Some of the amount and much of the incentives would be paid out in 2011, after this season. But I believe the contract runs only through 2010.

I heard a lot about a few extra million in Brett's contract, but I've yet to read any attribution to that. From a league-wide picture --and I am nowhere near a league sympathizer-- I hate that a small-market team has to pay a player even more money on top of a salary that exceeds in one year what most people will make in their lifetimes (and it's not like the guy wasn't paid heftily during his first 19 seasons). It seems so stupidly crass that I hope it's just speculation. But if it's been whispered so much, it likely isn't.

Since we're no longer running on a salary cap, there's far less need to report salaries. Is there any place that can verify what a player's current payroll value is?

[pbmax]

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.
I believe its still the same two year deal framework (09 through 10), but he was given additional money for this year. Some of the amount and much of the incentives would be paid out in 2011, after this season. But I believe the contract runs only through 2010.

I heard a lot about a few extra million in Brett's contract, but I've yet to read any attribution to that. From a league-wide picture --and I am nowhere near a league sympathizer-- I hate that a small-market team has to pay a player even more money on top of a salary that exceeds in one year what most people will make in their lifetimes (and it's not like the guy wasn't paid heftily during his first 19 seasons). It seems so stupidly crass that I hope it's just speculation. But if it's been whispered so much, it likely isn't.

Since we're no longer running on a salary cap, there's far less need to report salaries. Is there any place that can verify what a player's current payroll value is?
I don't think you can qualify the Vikings as small market. Low revenue, perhaps.

Here is PFT on the new payment schedule (the reference to 2011's W-2 income is for the deferred income, not another contract year): http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/08/28/favres-2010-deal-defers-only-3-million-to-2011/

And here are the details of the new deal: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/08/28/favres-2010-deal-defers-only-3-million-to-2011/

[Cheesehead Craig]

I don't think he hates Favre. They'll likely never be friends, but I think there's some respect there. Rodgers cheering for the Saints might have had a lot to do with the fact that Rodgers and Brees are good friends. Besides, maybe like a lot of Packer fans, he just doesn't want to see the Vikings win. But that's not as good a story as saying he hates Favre.

Spot on. Rodgers has said that Brees is one of his best friends and that they work and hang out in the offseason. I take this story as he was happy for a real good friend.

[Fritz]

A Michael Hunt article in the JSO this morning got me thinking: how tight will the officials call the Minny/NO game, vis a vis quarterback hits?

I'm thinking the defensive players on both sides will probably need to be careful. I think it's getting tougher and tougher for defenders to figure what kind of hit is "okay." I know it's all about "safety first" but at the same time, the officials sure have narrowed how and where you can hit a quarterback.

Not in the helmet. Not at the knees or below. Not with your helmet. Not if he's released the ball, not even if you're speeding at him full bore and can't stop.

So a defender can more or less hit between the chest and thighs with his shoulder, but only when the QB has the ball in his hands. That sounds okay, but in practice, that'd be tough to limit yourself to.

I have mixed feelings on this. I don't like the way the old NFLers, many of them, are walking around with their brains in a fog from the nearly unrestricted violence of the old game.. Greg Lloyd, for one example. (Matt Millen's brain sure seemed in a fog when he was Lions' GM, too....).

But it's difficult, almost a contradiction, to to preach "safety first" in a game in which players are applauded for not being safe - for throwing themselves around, sacrificing their bodies, for the good of the cause. Receivers going over the middle. Special teams guys who have no regard for their bodies. We worship this trait. We think of it as "masculine." Yet we live in a culture that recognizes the damage this does, so the NFL preaches safety first.

[woodbuck27]

...

I liked your thoughts Mr. Woodbuck.

What the hell ever happened to Harlan? Scott, did you two have a rough break up?


My love for Harlan knows no bounds. He was active in FYI, and rarely seen anywhere else. Not sure where he is.

He is sad that Obama's approval rating fell below 50%...I am sure he is on a Jack bender right now

There was an announcement on Good Morning America today that ' The President of the USA ' will be interviewed by George Strombonopolis (sp) in the very near future. Thge greatest decline in his approval rating in American Presidential Gallup polls seems to ensure that Obama will be a one term President. That's disappointing to so many and I include Canadians, that hoped her would be an outstanding leader in terms of creating jobs and significantly endorsing an American economic policy that would reflect the intelligence we believed we saw from this man. Instead it appears he sold out to the establishment and thatbis a strange direction for a Democrat ( a Liberal in our country as opposed to the Conservative (Republican) party) that usually looks after the little guy in terms of solid social programs and job creation.

Barack Obama's idea that he could install a Health Care program along the lines we have in our country, and given the fact your population and demographics is vastly removed from ours, made his dream somewhat difficult if not unrealistic.

The second mistake or questionable move was to bail out the establishment as opposed to spending that huge amount of money fr. your treasury to lower the taxes of the little guy and create a healthier overall job creation program.

Generally it was my impression reading the press and watching the media that Canadians were excited that your President would step up to the plate and in his second term knock one out of the park after a feeling out process. That Obama would take the USA back to the forefront in terms of an overall economic policy that we could tag into, in spite of the fact our banking system is one of the worlds finest and has kept Canada strong despite an economic downturn in the world overall. Instead we see the potential for a second economic disaster in the USA according to many economic and market experts opinion.

Obama has sold out ' to Mr. BIG ' and what is the alternative? Back to the Republican way? It's not interesting, rather scary to observe your political machine, in a time when we need America to be strong; an economic leader leading by example to serve the mass's not moreso the establishment. The accent should be on lowering taxes for the normal family and as a result stimulate spending and American manufacture.

[HowardRoark]

The second mistake or questionable move was to bail out the establishment as opposed to spending that huge amount of money fr. your treasury to lower the taxes of the little guy and create a healthier overall job creation program.



http://packerrats.com/ratchat/viewtopic.php?t=15393&start=0

[woodbuck27]

Woody, I've been posting with you for a lot of years, but your ..... oh just forget it.

Woody, I've been posting with you for a lot of years, but your ** Tarlam!

I'll tell you what I am Tarlam!

I'm fair, confident , intelligent, supportive or a team player. I'm responsible, a leader, honest and extremely loyal or dedicated to a foundation that supports the best results. I'm fortunate to be well liked by anyone that really does get to know me. That respects the consistent values that I adopted a long time ago to use as a guide to living and enjoying my life Tarlam!.

A long time ago I adopted a consistent approach to living and leading others. It's all that allows me to claim with honesty my most valued quality. My integrity. I stand up always, for what I believe. That long term will bless me with value Tarlam!

I like the team I'm on man. It's always ' the winning team ', and that team has little to do with sports. That team ensures I'm a winner or close to that in terms of any competition Tarlam! I've always known how to compete and win or contribute to that. I also know how to play the game and to prosper at having fun and enjoyment. Noone has ever turned me away from sacrificing my values and principles. Even when that has amounted to unecessary punishment or personal pain.

People either really like me or oppose me. I'm not affected by what ' the wrong side ' thinks of me or how I'm judged. I choose the right side. That's always based in ' the right way '. :D

You've played Pro Pickem' with me Tarlam!, for four seasons now. How well do I fare? Ever analyze me or learn from my ways or advice that I offer so willingly or generously Tarlam! ? When I enter any contest here. How have I done Tarlam!? Am I consistent in terms of results Tarlam! ?Am I competitive and generally a winner or close to that? For me that has always been ' the way ' Tarlam!. Prepare, and then proceed and expect decent results, if not win outright. You cannot make a positive out of a negative. I use the brains and skills God granted me man. I don't insult Him with nonsense or with less then what He desires of me. Goodness.

TO WIN! There is only one way to ever get there Tarlam! THe slow and even approach trumps agressiveness and stupidity. Preperation trumps risk and foolhardiness. :D

I say what I mean and back myself up always with common sense and decency Tarlam!. I'm stubborn to ' the right ', because that's best. I'm convinced that those that choose my way and side will win. That way, has demonstrated too much that's positve for me in my past Tarlam!.

I'll stick with 'that way' man. Goodness ' the result ' that generally comes from ' the right way or approach '. That has nothing to do with this:

Hate. Hate loses !! :idea:

GO PACK GO!

[get louder at lambeau]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

[woodbuck27]

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.
I believe its still the same two year deal framework (09 through 10), but he was given additional money for this year. Some of the amount and much of the incentives would be paid out in 2011, after this season. But I believe the contract runs only through 2010.

I heard a lot about a few extra million in Brett's contract, but I've yet to read any attribution to that. From a league-wide picture --and I am nowhere near a league sympathizer-- I hate that a small-market team has to pay a player even more money on top of a salary that exceeds in one year what most people will make in their lifetimes (and it's not like the guy wasn't paid heftily during his first 19 seasons). It seems so stupidly crass that I hope it's just speculation. But if it's been whispered so much, it likely isn't.

Since we're no longer running on a salary cap, there's far less need to report salaries. Is there any place that can verify what a player's current payroll value is?

I followed that post up and discovered that Brett Favre and his agent negotiated a new deal and may be paid in the order of $20 Million dollars and that larger amount than last season may be as a result of an incentive clause. If that's so and given that toiday I discovered again that this will be his final season in the NFL (see Yahoo Sports - NFL news), he will be giving his all this season. I choose ' as a Packer fan ' to respect what that could mean in terms of our hopes and given ' the competitor ' I've seen from him. If the Vikings organization and his teammates are on the same page as Brett Favre, and protect themselves in terms of his new contract by getting him the quality receivers he needs. Brett Favre will have a giant season Packer fans.

That's the ' big if factor ' I'm watching out for at this stage in the season. The Vikings need help somewhere to protect the investment they've made in Favre. Anything less than that is insufficiant to meet his purpose or goal with the Vikings. To get that team to a Super Bowl.

Let's hope that TT has the parts and our coaching staff has done the preperation to date and in the immediate future to seize the moment from the Vikings. No matter what they do to strengthen.

I read last night that Randy Moss is disgruntled in New England. How much would Favre desire him back in a Vikings uniform? Y'all know the answer to that question and the possible repurcussions that could mean to our teams results this season.

Some of you may poo poo that prospect as insignificant and I would disagree with you. :D Randy Moss and Brett Favre on the same team. Imagine that prospect given their skills and will to win at this last stage in their steller HOF careers. We know today that there are quality WR's available at a valued price. Quality WR's that might put ' a Super Bowl appearance and win ' ahead of personal issues, such as a huge contract.

It's interesting to me. Because of the prospects that possibility will present to us as Packer fans. The Vikings must make a significant move now or early in this season. A move that will shore them up, and will be counter to the hopes we have for our team this season.

GO PACKERS GO !!

[woodbuck27]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

[get louder at lambeau]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I really, really hope not. I find arrogant people nauseating.

[retailguy]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I really, really hope not. I find arrogant people nauseating.

"They" say that the most arrogant people in the world are the ones that do not know they are arrogant.

Let me remove all doubt. You "get louder at lambeau" are extremely arrogant.

[Zool]

I usually skip Woody's posts but I read the one about Moss and his will to win? You might want to check out some Randy Moss playoff games and reword that statement.

[woodbuck27]

Here is a Rodgers story I had never heard before

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100902


4. Aaron Rodgers, Packers
2010's most savvy bet: Rodgers to win the MVP as a semi-long shot at 12-to-1 odds. Last season, he threw for 4,434 yards, 30 touchdowns and just seven picks, then nearly pulled off a historic comeback in that unforgettable Packers-Cards wild-card game (finishing with 423 passing yards, four TDs). And Green Bay's offense has "The Look" in the preseason: Everything is pointing toward a 2009 Saints-type breakout year. On a personal note, my affection for Rodgers increased exponentially at ESPN's Sundance party during the conference championships, when Rodgers and his buddies unabashedly rooted against former nemesis Favre and the Vikings down the stretch and celebrated raucously when New Orleans pulled it out. Rodgers couldn't have been more delighted; he did everything but climb on the bar and start a "F--- YOU, FAVRE!" chant. I will always root for him after that. And yes, that story is 100 percent true.

:D :D :D :D :D

Love Rodgers

Come on Man. :shock:

Is that really a good thing? I think not. That's questionable behaviour in terms of it's one of those in your face things that often backfire in sports rivalrys.

Or this:

Isn't that a little more oil on the fire Favre and the Vikings need? That's the sort of thing that generally fires up any rival in the world of sports and adds incentive to beat that opponent. Not smart ...bad karma for us on behalf of Aaron Rodgers. A waste of energy. Over negative.

It's better to wait. Be patient and put it all out there on the field. Win games on the field by demonstrating superiority and keep the emotions out of it.

GO PACK GO!

Its not as significant as a telephone consultation with your former teams upcoming opponent.

Given that 'in fact' that's true. What bearing does that have in terms of today? Brett Favre was in effect put out to pature by the Pacxker organizationb and even bribed by the Packers organization to retire from the game he loves.

Favre has integrity. He turned his nose up to that bribe Patler. How many men do you know that would turn down some $20 Millions $'s to retire from whatever? Just take that money and disappar. The fact he refused that offer stands Favre up even bigger in my estimation of that man as someone very special.

I as a Canadian love the NHL and always have followed my favourite team and player (s) ' with this ' as a fact of life in terms of any players career:

When any team trades a star player to another team, or otherwise waives that player or releases him. That player tries his best to shove that decision in his former teams face. To make the former team pay for not believing in him. Often he gets his revenge as he's justly motivated to do so. That's part of being a professional,, and all that which is related to a star or very talented players ego.

It was time for TT to get Favre out of sight and move forward with Aaron Rodgers. We saw that coming the day Aaron Rodgers was drafted. I certainly saw that coming and was concerned that Brett Favre wouldn't set significant personal records in a Packer uniform. Well he did all of that but his main incentive was not records. Rather win another Super Bowl. He came so close again in a Packer uniform and failure never dulled his appetite. The man wants to win very badly.

Try ... try ... try, until you succeed. :D

Once that was done ( culminating in that heart wrenching loss to the NY Giants ). I wanted Favre out of Green Bay. It was obvious to me and some others that we are not seeing around here these days. That there were certain frustrations that seperated the philosophies and intents of Brett Favre and TT. They were on different pages and worlds apart in terms of winning, now and 'YES' despite that ' Brett Favre and the Packers ' came close.

That's an old argument as well, and 'the fact is', and that we enjoy today. Is we're considered contenders to go to a Super Bowl. That's moot considering ' the fact of life ', that it'll be left on the field of play. Our success Vs any teams. We have alot of teams to play and defeat besides the Vikings.

In terms of Brett Favre and his present incentives and direction.

TT's personality and ' the will to win ' is now moot. Favre is free of TT. He certainly wants to demonstrate again this season that he had plenty in the tank when TT went in another direction. See above and National Hockey League players.

By the way the record will clearly demonstrate that personally I've supported that move of Rodgers over Favre by TT and the Packer organization. It was time. Given that was done. What Brett Favre has ever done to support his needs is moot. He's no longer a Packer and free as a professional to make his best deal and with a team he considers a serious contender.

He's not a traitor. Favre is a man on a mission as a Pro atlhlete, and 'of course' that's possibly counter productive to our hopes, and only as he proves himself worthy of playing at a high level and winning the big games. He's fallen down many times but despite all that many NFL fans love him in the game. He's arguably, the most exciting player to ever play the QB position in the NFL.

Aaron Rodgers is our QB now and it's too simple. Suport Aaron Rodgers and certainly use some wisdom in terms of hating Brett Favre. That's just wrong to sick IMO.

Disagreeing with me won't change my position. :D

GO PACKERS!

[Scott Campbell]

I'll tell you what I am Tarlam!

I'm fair, confident , intelligent, supportive or a team player. I'm responsible, a leader, honest and extremely loyal or dedicated to a foundation that supports the best results. I'm fortunate to be well liked by anyone that really does get to know me. That respects the consistent values that I adopted a long time ago to use as a guide to living and enjoying my life Tarlam!.

.................................................. .........................yadda, yadda, yadda.


http://images.thecarconnection.com/med/joe-isuzu_100177622_m.jpg

[Scott Campbell]

Brett Favre was ................ bribed by the Packers organization to retire from the game he loves.


:lol:


Favre has integrity.

:lol:



He's not a traitor.

:lol:

[swede]

In retrospect it would have been nice if Canada had gone French only instead of bilingual--let the posters at Les_Ratons_Paquerres.comme deal with it.

[Patler]

Geeze Woody, get off the Favre love train and try to comprehend my point:

YOU criticized Rodgers for having cheered against Favre.
YOU called it "questionable behaviour" by Rodgers.
YOU characterized it as the type of action that often "backfire in sports rivalrys".
YOU called it "not smart".
YOU called it "bad karma".
YOU called it "a waste of energy".
YOU called it "overly negative"
YOU said "It's better to wait. Be patient and put it all out there on the field. Win games on the field by demonstrating superiority and keep the emotions out of it."

All because Rodgers cheered for his good friend (Brees) and against the guy who reportedly wouldn't even return his call two years ago. The guy who treated him very coldly as a teammate.

All I said was that whatever Rodgers did, it was not nearly as significant as what Favre did in consulting with a third team. How can you condemn Rodgers for cheering for a friend and against someone who refused to be his friend; and excuse Favre for his actions against the team that payed him about $100 million and their fans who adored him?

My god Woody, rebalance your scale a little. Condem both or excuse both, or maybe realize that what Rodgers did HAD NO EFFECT ON ANYONE OR ANY OUTCOME. On the other hand, Favre attempted to influence the outcome of a game in which he was not playing, just to take out his anger on his former team and in the process directly impact his former teammates and his fans. If anything was an over reaction, bad karma, overly negative or anything that you accused Rodgers of, it was Favre consulting with the Lions (and maybe others as well.)

[mraynrand]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I doubt you'll still be alive when I get to be your age.

[woodbuck27]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I doubt you'll still be alive when I get to be your age.

What's your age? About 43 years old?

That's only 20 years younger than I am mraynrand. So in 20 years I'll only be 83 years of age and v. alive ! :lol:

Still defending my positions Re: my ' All Time Pro Sports Hero ', Brett Favre, on some football forum. Hopefully, this one.

GO PACK GO!

[Bossman641]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I really, really hope not. I find arrogant people nauseating.

"They" say that the most arrogant people in the world are the ones that do not know they are arrogant.

Let me remove all doubt. You "get louder at lambeau" are extremely arrogant.

Funny, but I haven't seen any posts from louder at lambeau telling the rest of the forum how much better he is than they are.

[Bossman641]

Given that 'in fact' that's true. What bearing does that have in terms of today? Brett Favre was in effect put out to pature by the Pacxker organizationb and even bribed by the Packers organization to retire from the game he loves.
Favre has integrity. He turned his nose up to that bribe Patler. How many men do you know that would turn down some $20 Millions $'s to retire from whatever? Just take that money and disappar. The fact he refused that offer stands Favre up even bigger in my estimation of that man as someone very special.

I as a Canadian love the NHL and always have followed my favourite team and player (s) ' with this ' as a fact of life in terms of any players career:

When any team trades a star player to another team, or otherwise waives that player or releases him. That player tries his best to shove that decision in his former teams face. To make the former team pay for not believing in him. Often he gets his revenge as he's justly motivated to do so. That's part of being a professional,, and all that which is related to a star or very talented players ego.

It was time for TT to get Favre out of sight and move forward with Aaron Rodgers. We saw that coming the day Aaron Rodgers was drafted. I certainly saw that coming and was concerned that Brett Favre wouldn't set significant personal records in a Packer uniform. Well he did all of that but his main incentive was not records. Rather win another Super Bowl. He came so close again in a Packer uniform and failure never dulled his appetite. The man wants to win very badly.

Try ... try ... try, until you succeed. :D

Once that was done ( culminating in that heart wrenching loss to the NY Giants ). I wanted Favre out of Green Bay. It was obvious to me and some others that we are not seeing around here these days. That there were certain frustrations that seperated the philosophies and intents of Brett Favre and TT. They were on different pages and worlds apart in terms of winning, now and 'YES' despite that ' Brett Favre and the Packers ' came close.

That's an old argument as well, and 'the fact is', and that we enjoy today. Is we're considered contenders to go to a Super Bowl. That's moot considering ' the fact of life ', that it'll be left on the field of play. Our success Vs any teams. We have alot of teams to play and defeat besides the Vikings.

In terms of Brett Favre and his present incentives and direction.

TT's personality and ' the will to win ' is now moot. Favre is free of TT. He certainly wants to demonstrate again this season that he had plenty in the tank when TT went in another direction. See above and National Hockey League players.

By the way the record will clearly demonstrate that personally I've supported that move of Rodgers over Favre by TT and the Packer organization. It was time. Given that was done. What Brett Favre has ever done to support his needs is moot. He's no longer a Packer and free as a professional to make his best deal and with a team he considers a serious contender.

He's not a traitor. Favre is a man on a mission as a Pro atlhlete, and 'of course' that's possibly counter productive to our hopes, and only as he proves himself worthy of playing at a high level and winning the big games. He's fallen down many times but despite all that many NFL fans love him in the game. He's arguably, the most exciting player to ever play the QB position in the NFL.

Aaron Rodgers is our QB now and it's too simple. Suport Aaron Rodgers and certainly use some wisdom in terms of hating Brett Favre. That's just wrong to sick IMO.

Disagreeing with me won't change my position. :D

GO PACKERS!

Seriously Woodbuck, we have seen the timelines. We have discussed the terms of Favre's "retirement" several times. Your inability to even acknowledge the possibility that Favre retired and wanted out as opposed to being pushed out by TT is mind-boggling.

[retailguy]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I really, really hope not. I find arrogant people nauseating.

"They" say that the most arrogant people in the world are the ones that do not know they are arrogant.

Let me remove all doubt. You "get louder at lambeau" are extremely arrogant.

Funny, but I haven't seen any posts from louder at lambeau telling the rest of the forum how much better he is than they are.

I think you should spend some time looking at his past posts. Very little but snide sarcastic remarks. Kind of like Tyrone in a way, but at least Tyrone had an occasional good football comment/discussion. This guy is really just a one trick pony, and not a very good one at that.

I'm shocked you haven't seen this. He's one of the most judgmental guys around here by any standard you'd care to use.

[woodbuck27]

Did Favre sign ** a new contract recently?

I thought I saw this week that Brett Favre signed a standard four year contract with the Vikings. Saw that on their site. Since, I tried to do a follow-up and cannot find the article RE: ** such.
I believe its still the same two year deal framework (09 through 10), but he was given additional money for this year. Some of the amount and much of the incentives would be paid out in 2011, after this season. But I believe the contract runs only through 2010.

I heard a lot about a few extra million in Brett's contract, but I've yet to read any attribution to that. From a league-wide picture --and I am nowhere near a league sympathizer-- I hate that a small-market team has to pay a player even more money on top of a salary that exceeds in one year what most people will make in their lifetimes (and it's not like the guy wasn't paid heftily during his first 19 seasons). It seems so stupidly crass that I hope it's just speculation. But if it's been whispered so much, it likely isn't.

Since we're no longer running on a salary cap, there's far less need to report salaries. Is there any place that can verify what a player's current payroll value is?
I don't think you can qualify the Vikings as small market. Low revenue, perhaps.

Here is PFT on the new payment schedule (the reference to 2011's W-2 income is for the deferred income, not another contract year): http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/08/28/favres-2010-deal-defers-only-3-million-to-2011/

And here are the details of the new deal: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/08/28/favres-2010-deal-defers-only-3-million-to-2011/

Thank You pbmax.

So... if Brett Favre gets his full incentive package done this season.

He'll make $ 11.6 Milllion dollars of base salary + $ 1.4 Million of his ' $ 4.4 million dollars ' signing bonus ' and the remainder deferred to Dec. 31, 2011 + a potential of 4 Million ' of incentive money ' + $ 4 Million (deferred fr. 2009 salary)

or

Potentially, 21 Million dollars in 2011 ( based on earning incentives ).

[Scott Campbell]

43 years old?

That's only 20 years younger than I am mraynrand. So in 20 years I'll only be 83 years of age and v. alive ! :lol:


Just how many 63rd birthdays have you had Woody?

[get louder at lambeau]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I really, really hope not. I find arrogant people nauseating.

"They" say that the most arrogant people in the world are the ones that do not know they are arrogant.

Let me remove all doubt. You "get louder at lambeau" are extremely arrogant.

Funny, but I haven't seen any posts from louder at lambeau telling the rest of the forum how much better he is than they are.

I think you should spend some time looking at his past posts. Very little but snide sarcastic remarks. Kind of like Tyrone in a way, but at least Tyrone had an occasional good football comment/discussion. This guy is really just a one trick pony, and not a very good one at that.

I'm shocked you haven't seen this. He's one of the most judgmental guys around here by any standard you'd care to use.

Retail is right. I can be very sarcastic and judgmental. Arrogant though? Not so much. I don't think I'm better than anyone here (except maybe retailguy). :satan:

[Scott Campbell]

Thank You pbmax.

So... if Brett Favre gets his full incentive package done this season.

He'll make $ 11.6 Milllion dollars of base salary + $ 1.4 Million of his ' $ 4.4 million dollars ' signing bonus ' and the remainder deferred to Dec. 31, 2011 + a potential of 4 Million ' of incentive money ' + $ 4 Million (deferred fr. 2009 salary)

or

Potentially, 21 Million dollars in 2011 ( based on earning incentives ).


Extortion pays when your backup is T-Jack.

[woodbuck27]

Holy shit is this guy full of himself! :lol:

No man. I know who I am. When you get to be my age you may as well. 8-)

I really, really hope not. I find arrogant people nauseating.

"They" say that the most arrogant people in the world are the ones that do not know they are arrogant.

Let me remove all doubt. You "get louder at lambeau" are extremely arrogant.

Funny, but I haven't seen any posts from louder at lambeau telling the rest of the forum how much better he is than they are.

Hey Bossman641 ! I'm not the fella that proclaims such weakness as to hate anything. Doesn't hatred imply arrogance? Anger with anything that doesn't serve your needs, ideas, wish's, plans or agenda's etc. I'm as fair and mild a man as you'll come across here. I'm far removed from any BS.

I back myself up. I don't make ridiculous statements concerning HATE or act with undo emotion or lose my cool. I'll certainly not entertain such low life garbage from a man who means little to nothing to me, except to expect you to generally or always oppose my goodness. I'm too cool ... pour vour ... compondre? 8-)

Please mister. Re: me and being arrogant. Don't be confused between confidence and arrogance. There's a decided difference between arrogance and confidence. Find a dictionary and see for yourself. I'm certainly different from you but far from arrogant. If you feel the need to meet me in any challenge. I welcome your challenge, and ... good luck. :D

So let's leap ahead Bossman641. Just maybe, you'd like the challenge of attempting to railroad me? Please. If that's your agenda? I suggest that you put it to rest Bossman641. I don't railroad easily and to go there with me, is like you 'pissing in the wind'. Noone at anytime on this forum has ever managed to push me around, or seperate me from my views or beliefs. I'm as strong in what I believe in as you are in your positions. Let's just mutually accept that. OK? That's a healthy stance Bossman641. It's the democratic process in action. :D

Let's just go to the TRUTH of it. You and I are, in my observation, two very different people. I'm a decent man and I don't ever have to defend that fact. :)

I've seen the BS intimidation the likes of you put out at Packerrats and what it does to decent people that oppose in view the likes of you Bossman641. I choose to simply disagree with your views as I see necessary and in terms of my integrity. Is that difficult for you to come to terms with? If so? I suggest you eat it. K?

GO PACK GO!

[woodbuck27]

From PFT.Com

Brett Favre: "It's a media frenzy world"

Posted by Michael David Smith on September 8, 2010 3:43 PM ET

Vikings quarterback Brett Favre knows he was the subject of constant media attention this offseason as everyone speculated about whether or not he'd retire. (Again.) But Favre believes that says more about the state of the media than it does about him.

"It's a media frenzy world," Favre said in an interview today with Adam Schein, Rich Gannon and John Madden on Sirius NFL Radio. "Nothing goes untouched or un-talked about. I quietly -- I thought quietly -- tried to make my decision. I had surgery about a month before camp and the media started camping out at the gate. I never asked them to come. I never asked them to talk about it."

Favre also discussed watching tape of the Vikings' loss to the Saints in the NFC Championship Game, saying he thinks his team blew a golden opportunity to get to the Super Bowl.

"The obvious thing that jumps out at you is, boy, we had every chance to win that football game," Favre said of watching the Saints game again.

Although Favre talked mostly about Thursday night's regular-season opener against the Saints, he sounded like he still has some regrets about that January loss in New Orleans.

"Super Bowls don't come around too often for a player or a team," Favre said. "Nor do championship games."

Favre also touched on his surgically repaired ankle, saying, "I still feel it every day." And he downplayed talk that there's a rift in his relationship with Vikings coach Brad Childress.

"I think it's fine," Favre said of the coach-quarterback relationship. "And I think he would say the same thing. . . . This is Brad Childress's team."

[ThunderDan]

WTF, again why is this going on and on here? This should be in the Romper Room or Garbage Can. :(

[woodbuck27]

From PFT.Com

T.O. takes aim at Brett Favre

Posted by Mike Florio on September 8, 2010 12:38 PM ET

As you may have heard, Bengals receivers Chad Ochocinco and Terrell Owens will launch a new weekly show on Versus in October. For now, they'll making weekly appearances on The Daily Line, and presumably talking about all sorts of issues.

In their debut, T.O. took a shot at one of the quarterbacks that Owens used as a prop in one of his past in-house quarterback feuds: Brett Favre.

Specifically, Owens believes that not enough has been made of Favre's failure and/or refusal to participate in training camp in 2009 and 2010.

"Had it been one of us doing some of the same things, pulling these stunts that Brett Favre has done the last two or three years, then we would be labeled 'not a team player,' 'selfish,' and these are times where you want your guys to be in camp, bonding with your teammates, learning the plays, going through the whole team concept just like everybody else," Owens said in video that was forwarded to PFT by our friends at CSNPhilly.com. "And now it's like, yeah, he's set himself above team standards."

T.O. is right. Favre has largely gotten a pass for not attending offseason workouts or training camp the last three years. Though the Vikings bear some of the blame for allowing him to do it, the media isn't facing the same Favre-or-Tarvaris conundrum at quarterback, and yet many in the media have adopted the same "see no evil" posture when it comes to Brett.

If it were Owens or Ochocinco who were behaving this way, the army of folks calling them out would be much louder, and much larger.

[Pugger]

Given that 'in fact' that's true. What bearing does that have in terms of today? Brett Favre was in effect put out to pature by the Pacxker organizationb and even bribed by the Packers organization to retire from the game he loves.
Favre has integrity. He turned his nose up to that bribe Patler. How many men do you know that would turn down some $20 Millions $'s to retire from whatever? Just take that money and disappar. The fact he refused that offer stands Favre up even bigger in my estimation of that man as someone very special.

I as a Canadian love the NHL and always have followed my favourite team and player (s) ' with this ' as a fact of life in terms of any players career:

When any team trades a star player to another team, or otherwise waives that player or releases him. That player tries his best to shove that decision in his former teams face. To make the former team pay for not believing in him. Often he gets his revenge as he's justly motivated to do so. That's part of being a professional,, and all that which is related to a star or very talented players ego.

It was time for TT to get Favre out of sight and move forward with Aaron Rodgers. We saw that coming the day Aaron Rodgers was drafted. I certainly saw that coming and was concerned that Brett Favre wouldn't set significant personal records in a Packer uniform. Well he did all of that but his main incentive was not records. Rather win another Super Bowl. He came so close again in a Packer uniform and failure never dulled his appetite. The man wants to win very badly.

Try ... try ... try, until you succeed. :D

Once that was done ( culminating in that heart wrenching loss to the NY Giants ). I wanted Favre out of Green Bay. It was obvious to me and some others that we are not seeing around here these days. That there were certain frustrations that seperated the philosophies and intents of Brett Favre and TT. They were on different pages and worlds apart in terms of winning, now and 'YES' despite that ' Brett Favre and the Packers ' came close.

That's an old argument as well, and 'the fact is', and that we enjoy today. Is we're considered contenders to go to a Super Bowl. That's moot considering ' the fact of life ', that it'll be left on the field of play. Our success Vs any teams. We have alot of teams to play and defeat besides the Vikings.

In terms of Brett Favre and his present incentives and direction.

TT's personality and ' the will to win ' is now moot. Favre is free of TT. He certainly wants to demonstrate again this season that he had plenty in the tank when TT went in another direction. See above and National Hockey League players.

By the way the record will clearly demonstrate that personally I've supported that move of Rodgers over Favre by TT and the Packer organization. It was time. Given that was done. What Brett Favre has ever done to support his needs is moot. He's no longer a Packer and free as a professional to make his best deal and with a team he considers a serious contender.

He's not a traitor. Favre is a man on a mission as a Pro atlhlete, and 'of course' that's possibly counter productive to our hopes, and only as he proves himself worthy of playing at a high level and winning the big games. He's fallen down many times but despite all that many NFL fans love him in the game. He's arguably, the most exciting player to ever play the QB position in the NFL.

Aaron Rodgers is our QB now and it's too simple. Suport Aaron Rodgers and certainly use some wisdom in terms of hating Brett Favre. That's just wrong to sick IMO.

Disagreeing with me won't change my position. :D

GO PACKERS!

Seriously Woodbuck, we have seen the timelines. We have discussed the terms of Favre's "retirement" several times. Your inability to even acknowledge the possibility that Favre retired and wanted out as opposed to being pushed out by TT is mind-boggling.

+1

[Scott Campbell]

I don't make ridiculous statements concerning HATE or act with undo emotion or lose my cool.


:shock:




:lol:

[packerbacker1234]

From PFT.Com

T.O. takes aim at Brett Favre

Posted by Mike Florio on September 8, 2010 12:38 PM ET

As you may have heard, Bengals receivers Chad Ochocinco and Terrell Owens will launch a new weekly show on Versus in October. For now, they'll making weekly appearances on The Daily Line, and presumably talking about all sorts of issues.

In their debut, T.O. took a shot at one of the quarterbacks that Owens used as a prop in one of his past in-house quarterback feuds: Brett Favre.

Specifically, Owens believes that not enough has been made of Favre's failure and/or refusal to participate in training camp in 2009 and 2010.

"Had it been one of us doing some of the same things, pulling these stunts that Brett Favre has done the last two or three years, then we would be labeled 'not a team player,' 'selfish,' and these are times where you want your guys to be in camp, bonding with your teammates, learning the plays, going through the whole team concept just like everybody else," Owens said in video that was forwarded to PFT by our friends at CSNPhilly.com. "And now it's like, yeah, he's set himself above team standards."

T.O. is right. Favre has largely gotten a pass for not attending offseason workouts or training camp the last three years. Though the Vikings bear some of the blame for allowing him to do it, the media isn't facing the same Favre-or-Tarvaris conundrum at quarterback, and yet many in the media have adopted the same "see no evil" posture when it comes to Brett.

If it were Owens or Ochocinco who were behaving this way, the army of folks calling them out would be much louder, and much larger.


It's a completely different situation, and they play different positions. Favre "skipping camp" in 2008 wasn't entirely his fault. In fact, he would of been back much earier in the packers camp if he was allowed back - so his late start with the jets wasn't completely his own fault. He was already reinstated before he was even on their roster.

The last two offseasons, though, are on him. Last year, it sounded if, from what was said on both sides, that favre wasn't coming back. He informed the vikings he wouldn't be coming back, and it was like... two weeks after that childress called up one last time, and presumably begged favre to give it a shot.

He did, and had one of, if not the best statistical season of his career.

This year, It's pretty obvious he was skipping camp to skip it, and I agree he gets less criticized for it, but why should he be hte one criticized? It's the vikings that should be - they are the ones that allowed it to happen,a nd in most respects... how can you blame them?

Favre does give them another year with another SB shot. Without him, it's pretty clear they wont be SB contendors.

So... yes, he isn't completely a team player, that isn't a news flash to anyone. However, he shows up on sunday, does his job, and dcoesn't cause locker room problems in season - something ochocinco and owens have done, which they tend to forget about themselves.

Favre plays QB, The team he is on has no real replacement. He should of arguably been the MVP over Manning (hell, so should of rodgers), different players get different treatment.

Owns and Ocho Cinco would get blaste dbecause they have a history of "tearing apart" locker rooms - where as favre has a history of bringing locker rooms together.

[Bossman641]

Hey Bossman641 ! I'm not the fella that proclaims such weakness as to hate anything. Doesn't hatred imply arrogance? Anger with anything that doesn't serve your needs, ideas, wish's, plans or agenda's etc. I'm as fair and mild a man as you'll come across here. I'm far removed from any BS.

I back myself up. I don't make ridiculous statements concerning HATE or act with undo emotion or lose my cool. I'll certainly not entertain such low life garbage from a man who means little to nothing to me, except to expect you to generally or always oppose my goodness. I'm too cool ... pour vour ... compondre? 8-)

Please mister. Re: me and being arrogant. Don't be confused between confidence and arrogance. There's a decided difference between arrogance and confidence. Find a dictionary and see for yourself. I'm certainly different from you but far from arrogant. If you feel the need to meet me in any challenge. I welcome your challenge, and ... good luck. :D

So let's leap ahead Bossman641. Just maybe, you'd like the challenge of attempting to railroad me? Please. If that's your agenda? I suggest that you put it to rest Bossman641. I don't railroad easily and to go there with me, is like you 'pissing in the wind'. Noone at anytime on this forum has ever managed to push me around, or seperate me from my views or beliefs. I'm as strong in what I believe in as you are in your positions. Let's just mutually accept that. OK? That's a healthy stance Bossman641. It's the democratic process in action. :D

Let's just go to the TRUTH of it. You and I are, in my observation, two very different people. I'm a decent man and I don't ever have to defend that fact. :)

I've seen the BS intimidation the likes of you put out at Packerrats and what it does to decent people that oppose in view the likes of you Bossman641. I choose to simply disagree with your views as I see necessary and in terms of my integrity. Is that difficult for you to come to terms with? If so? I suggest you eat it. K?

GO PACK GO!

Haha. I really don't even know how to respond to this, woodbuck27.

I get you don't like the term hate. I'd suggest you aren't as passionate about the Packers as some others are woodbuck27. What you call strong and confident, I call stubborn and hard-headed woodbuck27.

And I'm certainly not trying to intimidate you woodbuck27, I just think you are very narrow-minded when it comes to Favre.

[cheesner]

It's a completely different situation, and they play different positions. Favre "skipping camp" in 2008 wasn't entirely his fault. In fact, he would of been back much earier in the packers camp if he was allowed back - so his late start with the jets wasn't completely his own fault. He was already reinstated before he was even on their roster.

The last two offseasons, though, are on him. Last year, it sounded if, from what was said on both sides, that favre wasn't coming back. He informed the vikings he wouldn't be coming back, and it was like... two weeks after that childress called up one last time, and presumably begged favre to give it a shot.

He did, and had one of, if not the best statistical season of his career.

This year, It's pretty obvious he was skipping camp to skip it, and I agree he gets less criticized for it, but why should he be hte one criticized? It's the vikings that should be - they are the ones that allowed it to happen,a nd in most respects... how can you blame them?

Favre does give them another year with another SB shot. Without him, it's pretty clear they wont be SB contendors.

So... yes, he isn't completely a team player, that isn't a news flash to anyone. However, he shows up on sunday, does his job, and dcoesn't cause locker room problems in season - something ochocinco and owens have done, which they tend to forget about themselves.

Favre plays QB, The team he is on has no real replacement. He should of arguably been the MVP over Manning (hell, so should of rodgers), different players get different treatment.

Owns and Ocho Cinco would get blaste dbecause they have a history of "tearing apart" locker rooms - where as favre has a history of bringing locker rooms together.
Some fair points there.

I would just think he should be more honest about it. Announce earlier that you intend to play. Attend training camp. Instead of throwing the ball to some high school kids, throw to some of your teammates. Work with TJack in film study, teach the receivers what you know about the offense. HELP your team!

I am willing to give him that his body won't hold up an entire season with training camp. Maybe taking training camp off will be a positive by the end of the season. But why not show up and only attend 1 practice out of 3 days. Sit out anything with any chance of contact. Sip a pina colada on the sidelines on your day off watching practice. Just be there for your teammates and help them in any small way that you can.

[get louder at lambeau]

So, I've only been around this site for, I don't know, a year? Less? Not sure. But I gotta ask- Is this Woodbuck guy for real? Is he always like this? :lol:

If so, I think I'm a fan. He's hilarious.

[Gunakor]

where as favre has a history of bringing locker rooms together.

Well, I don't know about this. Let's ask Tannenbaum how Favre brought the Jets locker room together. Let's ask Zigi how the FavreWatch fiasco THIS season has helped bring the Vikings locker room together.

I think I have to disagree with your assessment that Favre brings locker rooms together.

[woodbuck27]

Given that 'in fact' that's true. What bearing does that have in terms of today? Brett Favre was in effect put out to pature by the Pacxker organizationb and even bribed by the Packers organization to retire from the game he loves.
Favre has integrity. He turned his nose up to that bribe Patler. How many men do you know that would turn down some $20 Millions $'s to retire from whatever? Just take that money and disappar. The fact he refused that offer stands Favre up even bigger in my estimation of that man as someone very special.

I as a Canadian love the NHL and always have followed my favourite team and player (s) ' with this ' as a fact of life in terms of any players career:

When any team trades a star player to another team, or otherwise waives that player or releases him. That player tries his best to shove that decision in his former teams face. To make the former team pay for not believing in him. Often he gets his revenge as he's justly motivated to do so. That's part of being a professional,, and all that which is related to a star or very talented players ego.

It was time for TT to get Favre out of sight and move forward with Aaron Rodgers. We saw that coming the day Aaron Rodgers was drafted. I certainly saw that coming and was concerned that Brett Favre wouldn't set significant personal records in a Packer uniform. Well he did all of that but his main incentive was not records. Rather win another Super Bowl. He came so close again in a Packer uniform and failure never dulled his appetite. The man wants to win very badly.

Try ... try ... try, until you succeed. :D

Once that was done ( culminating in that heart wrenching loss to the NY Giants ). I wanted Favre out of Green Bay. It was obvious to me and some others that we are not seeing around here these days. That there were certain frustrations that seperated the philosophies and intents of Brett Favre and TT. They were on different pages and worlds apart in terms of winning, now and 'YES' despite that ' Brett Favre and the Packers ' came close.

That's an old argument as well, and 'the fact is', and that we enjoy today. Is we're considered contenders to go to a Super Bowl. That's moot considering ' the fact of life ', that it'll be left on the field of play. Our success Vs any teams. We have alot of teams to play and defeat besides the Vikings.

In terms of Brett Favre and his present incentives and direction.

TT's personality and ' the will to win ' is now moot. Favre is free of TT. He certainly wants to demonstrate again this season that he had plenty in the tank when TT went in another direction. See above and National Hockey League players.

By the way the record will clearly demonstrate that personally I've supported that move of Rodgers over Favre by TT and the Packer organization. It was time. Given that was done. What Brett Favre has ever done to support his needs is moot. He's no longer a Packer and free as a professional to make his best deal and with a team he considers a serious contender.

He's not a traitor. Favre is a man on a mission as a Pro atlhlete, and 'of course' that's possibly counter productive to our hopes, and only as he proves himself worthy of playing at a high level and winning the big games. He's fallen down many times but despite all that many NFL fans love him in the game. He's arguably, the most exciting player to ever play the QB position in the NFL.

Aaron Rodgers is our QB now and it's too simple. Suport Aaron Rodgers and certainly use some wisdom in terms of hating Brett Favre. That's just wrong to sick IMO.

Disagreeing with me won't change my position. :D

GO PACKERS!

Seriously Woodbuck, we have seen the timelines. We have discussed the terms of Favre's "retirement" several times. Your inability to even acknowledge the possibility that Favre retired and wanted out as opposed to being pushed out by TT is mind-boggling.

No Man. Favre had to want to get far away from TT, as it was obvious to me and other's here that TT was not on the same page as Brett Favre RE: win now.

So here is that whole issue as I witnessed it as a member of Packerrats and I will deliver this to you, Bossman641 to try to give you adequate if not maximum respect.

Bossman641. Does any of us at Packerrats or elsewhere, really know exactly what transpired back in the weeks leading up to the 2008 Draft? In terms specifically or not related to Brett Favre coming back as our starting QB? Have we officially heard both sides of that issue or 'the TRUTH'? Have you? I havn't!

All I've read is someone's best case scenario. As accurate as that may have been or is. Do we really know of any or all agenda's? Favre's or TT's? Do you Bossman641? I don't? I may one day when the book arrives on the bookshelves.

Favre always said in the years leading up to the 2007 season that he wanted to feel wanted by the Packer Organization. Wanted ' as our starting QB '.

Let's go back to the real beginning of the move to Aaron Rodgers as our starting QB Bossman641.

In 2005 TT chose Aaron Rodgers in round one of that draft as the heir apparant to Brett Favre. The writing was on the wall and Aaron Rodgers began his tutilage to be our QB. In the 2006 and 2007 ' off seasons ' Aaron showed us some promise, but he also offered us a question concerning his ability not to have freak accidents (he fell off a bench one time and hurt himself), and otherwise, to remain healthy. I mean this fella looked like an accident looking for a time and a place to happen. Do you re-call that Bossman641?

Favre was running out of time no less, and in the 2007 off season we became well aware of Favre's desires for another star quality WR. To make the march to a Super Bowl, a more realistic proposition. So ... we re-call the whole Randy Moss out of Oakland and to whomever saga that landed Moss in New Englan where he had a monster season (what...23 TD's) with Tom Brady as his QB. Please no comparisons between Brady and Favre in terms of how well or not Moss would have done in Green Bay.

I'm trying to make a specific point here.

As I saw it back in 2007; and debate me as you may desire that. Favre with Moss and all other present company at that time = Super Bowl, too much negative adversity aside.

Some of us here at Packerrats, came to a conclusion that TT fell asleep on failing to bring in Randy Moss. TT's a strange animal to many and fully supported by alot of Packer fans. TT often acted like he was asleep on the job. Personally, I've never been too excited over TT's performance. I'm even on record as claiming that under his tenure as our GM. We won't enjoy a Super Bowl win.

Why do I feel that way? :

TT's not ' balls to the walls ' enough :D Re: Randy Moss, and please don't come back to me on whether you did or did not support Randy Moss in the Green and Gold. Brett Favre wanted him. Because he like some here saw the obvious potential for us to go all the way. To give a more realistic hope to/for us to go to and win a Super Bowl in 2007.

Well New England and Moss got to the show in 2007 and lost to the team we should have beaten. The NY Giants.

Wasn't it obvious to you Bossman641 that Favre was on his last legs in the Green and Gold. Personally I prayed that the BS he was given would end. I wanted to see Aaron Rodgers in as our starter and Favre retired or elsewhere. I wanted him free of all that is TT. Yes! I supported an awesome HOF QB or Brett Favre over a GM that didn't appear to have blood in his veins as long as Favre was wearing our colors.

I was 'in fact' very pleased for Favre when he was traded to the Jets. I was sick of all the damn agony I saw as TT stalled and poked around. I always believed that one of his main tasks ( assigned bt the real boss's ). Was to as delicately as possible remove Brett Favre.

I'm trying to make a specific point here.

We heard that TT 'thought' he had Randy Moss locked up and so as it was late in his day he went to went to bed thinking Randy Moss was a Packer. Thinking doesn't make it or anything happen ... ever! Do you re-call that Bossman641 as I do?

The bottom line was that in Favre's view TT certainly screwed up again. As Randy Moss's season in New England went down the error TT made had to become more and more obvious to Favre and cause more and more animosity 'only if' he got really weak. I believe that Brett Favre had to come to terms with the rteality of TT as a slow,plodding,bungling type of GM and their personal relationship had to suffer for that. Favre had only so much more time to get to the show. TT had as much time as his superiors desired for him to have after getting Favre out of Green Bay.

Now go back to the playoff game in what Jan. 2005 or our last match-up in the playoffs of the 2004-05 season after we defeated Minnesota 2X in the regular season and they got out of the gate way too fast. That same game where we almost came back but .... re-call that Favre's ... sloppy underhanded pass to the endzone. When he could have easily ran the ball into the endzone between the right uprights and RH sideline marker. That NO PLAY was ' just sick ' on behalf of Brett Favre. It reallyb shocked me and pissed me off. The silly smirk on his face got to me as well. That whole thing really harmed Brett Favre and I'm sure he lost many Packer fans as a result of that silly play.

After that. He had to go 'in the eyes of many'. Yes I believe that play was the catalyst to usher in our current GM. I believe he had to re-build the team and get Favre as best. RETIRED.

Favre always has and stil, does want one thing. To win another Super Bowl. TT did little in terms of making the big move to better ensure that result while Favre was our QB. That is as I see it and agree with me or not. That's what I observed; and it doesn't take ' a Rocket Scientist ' to come to the same conclusion as I have since playoff's 2004.

[ThunderDan]

Woodbuck,

The first part of your post I can understand that we all don't know. I actually can get behind that. As much as I think the evidence is slanted mainly in one direction only TT, MM and BF really know what happened. Of those 3 only 1 went on national television to plead his case. I leave that at that.

As per the whole Randy Moss thing. The Packers went 13-3 in 2007 the year we would have had Moss. We made it to the NFC Championship game that year. I am sorry but I don't care how good Randy Moss is he wouldn't have caught any more of the balls thrown by BF in the Giants game. BF was off by 4-10 feet all game. Horrible throws in cold weather.

Now let's look at the long-term Randy Moss impact. Gregg Jennings doesn't get to play and doesn't develop like he does. What happens to Jones? Our WR core has been excellent for a number of years and this teams ability to throw the ball has been its strength because of the skill position players. Instead of having one of the best WR cores in the league we would have one of the top WR cores in the league that is a year or two from being out of the league. It is kind of like our CB position right now. Yes Woodson and Harris are great but they are old and need to be replaced. When DD retires we have Jones and Nelson to step-up into the 2nd and 3rd WR roles.

In 2008 BF had an arm issue at the end of the year. Did you watch how he folded at the end of the year for the Jets. Being in GB with Randy Moss in 2008 wouldn't have changed that. It really wasn't the offense in 2008 that caused our 6-10 record. ARod got the lead over and over again in the 4th Q and the D couldn't hold the other team from scoring.

[woodbuck27]

43 years old?

That's only 20 years younger than I am mraynrand. So in 20 years I'll only be 83 years of age and v. alive ! :lol:


Just how many 63rd birthdays have you had Woody?

Hi Scott. I had my 63rd Bday last Dec. 29th and I'll be 64 years 'young' :D come this Dec. 29, 2010. I feel wonderful and expect to live at least as long as my Paternal grandfather or to get to 96 years of age and want to live to be 100 years old. I've been very fortunate to live a decent life and so far my health is excellent in terms of a prognosis for longetivity.

So one day I do expect we'll see and celebrate a Green Bay Packer Super Bowl win together ( given you have good fortune and live a long life also Scott :D ) but sorry Scott, as I always maintained and you well know; not in the TT era. Nope !

Why !? TT is just a step out of order Scott. Just ' my gut feeling' about TT Scott based on my experience of what makes a winner.

I hope on this one I'm mistaken Scott. I fully realize that many Packer supporters here are very hopeful that this team can get it done. I just cannot see it inspite of some accolades TT's received he's IMO, not a closer.

Chalk it up to a personality difference between TT's way and personality and what I'd desire our GM to be based on what I know. We have an awesome QB now but it has to get done really soon. Our team is getting older at other key positions. In the short term or this season, I see issues at RB and in our secondary, but we have a decent shot at making the playoffs and again this season with our biggest obstacle being the Vikings, we have a great shot at winning the NFCN.

Brett Favre will be giving all he has Scott no matter what else transpires that's either positive or negative from this point with his team. That man is a fierce competitor. One of the best in the entire historey of all Pro sports, over the course of my history as an athlete and sports fan. We'll see if the Vikings management is on the same page as he is.

TT wasn't there Scott.

The Vikings need help at WR and at RB. The loss of Chester Taylor and of Sydney Rice early in the season and his questionable impact in the second half; as this injury and recovery period isn't at all good news and that possible negative impact cannot be underestimated. They need a solid performance on their 'D' and should get that as it looks now; and a healthy and productive offense to support and justify Brett Favre's new contract.

I look forward to a very exciting NFCN race this season between two teams. Our team and the Vikings. Those experts that poo poo the Vikings are wrong. That's just my analysis to date Scott.

a) Assuming that they fully realize that they do have more work to do at WR to just win the NFCN; moreso to make the Big Show.

b) I'm also aware that Adrian Peterson has to share his ego with Brett Favre and stop fumbling the ball. His ego needs to be adressed by their HC (Childress) and their RB's coach.

c)That their Head Coach has to stay cool on the sidelines and manage the ego's of Favre and Peterson, and not 'hit the panic button', as we've seen in the past fr. Childress.

All of that ... or the Vikings will implode and we'll win the NFCN. The Vikings are still the team to beat Scott. Hating that team and Favre won't make the biscuits Scott. :lol:

Behaving in a manner that promotes good karma is a lot more positive for our side. Maybe you might consider TRUSTING that Scott. :D Again ... just a little of my life's experience to guide my beliefs Scott. WE need to generate all of the good karma that we can as Packer fans. Not anything else. :idea:


GO PACKERS!

[mraynrand]

woodbuck, you are like the Lou Holtz of this forum.

[mraynrand]

No Man. Favre had to want to get far away from TT, as it was obvious to me and other's here that TT was not on the same page as Brett Favre RE: win now.

How can you write stuff like this? It's demonstrably and obviously untrue. A team one play away from the Superbowl cannot possibly be equated in any way with a win later attitude. This is so bizarre. (Cue the four page response....)

[Bossman641]

WB

Just a few quick points.

You are right that we don't know the whole story, but I feel when you look at what we do know it is heavily weighted towards TT.

Favre is the one who went on TV to plead his case. What horrible facts did we learn as to how he had been so wronged? None. The Packers sent out a very thorough, very detailed timeline regarding what happened in regards to contact with Favre, scheduling a plane to announce his retirement, Favre calling back and saying forget it. Guess what? Favre couldn't deny or refute any of it. That right there tells me that there was a lot more truth in the organization's story then Favre's. Why would Favre have held anything back? He was already burning bridges as it was.

If Favre's main complaint was that TT wouldn't let him play GM, then then boo fuckin boo. That wasn't his job and he had no right to play GM.

Moreover, look at how Favre has acted since then. Retired from the Jets and then asked for his retirement "just because." Booked hotel rooms the weekend of Packers-Vikings game while still a member of the Jets.

When it comes down to a truth-telling contest between the Packers and Favre there is no question in my mind who I should believe. Favre hasn't given me reason to believe a single word that comes out of his mouth.

[pbmax]

From PFT.Com

Brett Favre: "It's a media frenzy world"

Posted by Michael David Smith on September 8, 2010 3:43 PM ET

Vikings quarterback Brett Favre knows he was the subject of constant media attention this offseason as everyone speculated about whether or not he'd retire. (Again.) But Favre believes that says more about the state of the media than it does about him.

"It's a media frenzy world," Favre said in an interview today with Adam Schein, Rich Gannon and John Madden on Sirius NFL Radio. "Nothing goes untouched or un-talked about. I quietly -- I thought quietly -- tried to make my decision. I had surgery about a month before camp and the media started camping out at the gate. I never asked them to come. I never asked them to talk about it"....

He was text messaging the reporters this season. And he did the interview with Al Jones. He emailed photos of his injuries to his agent, who sent them to the press. He gave an interview to Men's Health after talking to Werder about the surgery.

At this point Brett is like a late night talk show host, who with one arm is trying to hush the standing ovation before the monologue, and with the other arm is encouraging them.

[woodbuck27]

Woodbuck,

The first part of your post I can understand that we all don't know. I actually can get behind that. As much as I think the evidence is slanted mainly in one direction only TT, MM and BF really know what happened. Of those 3 only 1 went on national television to plead his case. I leave that at that.

As per the whole Randy Moss thing. The Packers went 13-3 in 2007 the year we would have had Moss. We made it to the NFC Championship game that year. I am sorry but I don't care how good Randy Moss is he wouldn't have caught any more of the balls thrown by BF in the Giants game. BF was off by 4-10 feet all game. Horrible throws in cold weather.

Now let's look at the long-term Randy Moss impact. Gregg Jennings doesn't get to play and doesn't develop like he does. What happens to Jones? Our WR core has been excellent for a number of years and this teams ability to throw the ball has been its strength because of the skill position players. Instead of having one of the best WR cores in the league we would have one of the top WR cores in the league that is a year or two from being out of the league. It is kind of like our CB position right now. Yes Woodson and Harris are great but they are old and need to be replaced. When DD retires we have Jones and Nelson to step-up into the 2nd and 3rd WR roles.

In 2008 BF had an arm issue at the end of the year. Did you watch how he folded at the end of the year for the Jets. Being in GB with Randy Moss in 2008 wouldn't have changed that. It really wasn't the offense in 2008 that caused our 6-10 record. ARod got the lead over and over again in the 4th Q and the D couldn't hold the other team from scoring.

I am sorry but I don't care how good Randy Moss is he wouldn't have caught any more of the balls thrown by BF in the Giants game. BF was off by 4-10 feet all game. Horrible throws in cold weather. ThunderDan

The point I tried to make wasn't in regard to the impact that Moss would have or not have made to our team had TT acquired him; but that TT fell asleep in the process of trying to acquire Moss and that had to really piss Brett Favre off. Favre was on record as trying to recruit Randy Moss and it's not a large leap to Favre asking TT to do all he could to make that happpoen. Thatb willbring out the railbirds that will claim that Favre had no business meddling in TT's solemn business. This is Pro Sports and there are no set rules. The bottom line is described in winning not just doing pretty good for the season. Yes there can be only one winner. WEll I always thought this way. I can compete and come in near the top or I can really give err and be a winner. Winning trumps even the Old precept of... 'it's really how you play the game'. That's for the losers to use as a feel good motto. Again yes! There can only be one winner. What does it really take to be us.

TT?

On top of that fact that TT admitted he screwed up on the posible acquisition of Randy Moss thatb fact was handled pretty well by the way by Brett Favre in the aftermath of TT's lapse of concentration.

Now is the time or place to raise this question. Is TT ' a dote ' or did he allow Moss to slip away 'on purpose'? Ohhhh my how could I make such a suggestion?If I'm Favre I want to get an answer to that question ASAP after TT blow sit. Can't you sede Favre now..tearing into TT's office and losing his cool. I can see TT's chair baxcking up to the back wall now in reaction to the tirade Favre should have exhibited. Favre wanted Randy Moss in Green Bay. That plan made just too much sense. Add Moss to DD not any Rookie WR at that point not even drafted ThunderDan. Yes ! Favre can make almost any WR better and especially one such as the Rookie Greg Jennings. With Randy Moss it was auto-ma-tic and Greg Jennings was taken after Randy Moss went to the New England Patriots.

13-3 has nothing to do with TT dropping the ball in the Randy Moss acqisition failure ThunderDan.

Moss was outstanding in NE and the best WR in the NFL after leaving the doldrums in Oakland. Yup 23 TD's works as the best for this NFL fan. I watched him play many games that season and Moss was as good as I've ever seen. How many WER's in Green Bay ever played better than Moss did in the 2008 season ThunderDan?


I am sorry but I don't care how good Randy Moss is he wouldn't have caught any more of the balls thrown by BF in the Giants game. BF was off by 4-10 feet all game. Horrible throws in cold weather ThunderDan

The main screw up there was that our HC decided to pussy whip our side with indoor practices, instead of braving the current elements. Favre was actually appearing frozen on the sidelines. MM screwed up their in a major way by electing to practise indoors.That makes zero sense.

Our team practiced indoors and was in a state of shock, due to more than harsh weather and low temperature conditions. The weather conditions were brutal and MM may as well have set practise in Barbados.

Yes Favre was way off his game. He was like a popsicle thast had to generate arms and hands to toss a football, ThunderDan. That wasn't all his fault. That man is the toughest in the NFL and proven that he is over and over again. He's not just an 'Iron Man' in his sport. His achievement in terms of the longest start streak is just wildly incredible. Favre is inhumanly tough ThunderDan. He's hard to believe man and I mean in the highest ordert of extreme accomplishment.

Randy Moss in Green Bay is better than Randy Moss in New England ThunderDan. Hello TT ! Taking your wake up pills TT? :idea:

Now let's look at the long-term Randy Moss impact. Gregg Jennings doesn't get to play and doesn't develop like he does. What happens to Jones? Our WR core has been excellent for a number of years and this teams ability to throw the ball has been its strength because of the skill position players. Instead of having one of the best WR cores in the league we would have one of the top WR cores in the league that is a year or two from being out of the league. It is kind of like our CB position right now. Yes Woodson and Harris are great but they are old and need to be replaced. When DD retires we have Jones and Nelson to step-up into the 2nd and 3rd WR roles. ThunderDan


Again ThunderDan it turns out just fine for TT in terms of our future. 2008 and counting forward. Farve was thinking Randy Moss and Super Bowl win in 2008.

but ......... we're talking about the 2008 season exclusively and ' the fact ' that Favre needs ' to win now '.

Not in terms of ....is Favre and TT on the same page, as the team shaped up during the 2008 off season and prior to the 2008 NFL Draft? If TT gets Randy Moss then he has other options available to him in rounds one and two of that draft. [/b]

Not getting Moss force him to WR early. Ohh I know he always picks BPA early but to debate this issue we have to be precise RE: the specific issue...not go to rationalizations ThunderDan.

I do appreciate your thoughts and posy man. if IMO humble opinion it's not out of context I do agree with your views Re: the teams direction as TT tried to get it done ' his way ' after missing out on Moss and pissing favre off.

GO PACK GO!

[woodbuck27]

woodbuck, you are like the Lou Holtz of this forum.


Geee !! :lol:

[mraynrand]

"The point I tried to make wasn't in regard to the impact that Moss would have or not have made to our team had TT acquired him; but that TT fell asleep in the process of trying to acquire Moss and that had to really piss Brett Favre off."


Woody, we've been over this. You are assuming it was a slam dunk that everyone wanted this guy and that he would have improved the team. Can't you recognize that it's entirely possible that TT though not adding Moss was better than adding him? Or at the very least that TT thought Moss was worth so much and no more? And so what if it pissed Favre off. The Packers did just fine without Moss. Maybe TT if better at evaluating talent and putting a squad together with chemistry and so forth than Favre or anyone else would or will give him credit for - Try looking at it from a non-Favre perspective and see what you see.

[swede]

A Favre perspective?

I thought he was just being Canadian.

[Pugger]

We are still hashing about MOSS? :roll: I suspect TT thought he had Moss until NE got involved and offered Al Davis something that TT wasn't willing to pay for Moss' services so NE got him instead. In the end we did fine without him. The last I heard Moss didn't help bring NE a ring either. If Favre was pissed about it, TS.

[ThunderDan]

I am sorry but I don't care how good Randy Moss is he wouldn't have caught any more of the balls thrown by BF in the Giants game. BF was off by 4-10 feet all game. Horrible throws in cold weather. ThunderDan

The point I tried to make wasn't in regard to the impact that Moss would have or not have made to our team had TT acquired him; but that TT fell asleep in the process of trying to acquire Moss and that had to really piss Brett Favre off. Favre was on record as trying to recruit Randy Moss and it's not a large leap to Favre asking TT to do all he could to make that happpoen. Thatb willbring out the railbirds that will claim that Favre had no business meddling in TT's solemn business. This is Pro Sports and there are no set rules. The bottom line is described in winning not just doing pretty good for the season. Yes there can be only one winner. WEll I always thought this way. I can compete and come in near the top or I can really give err and be a winner. Winning trumps even the Old precept of... 'it's really how you play the game'. That's for the losers to use as a feel good motto. Again yes! There can only be one winner. What does it really take to be us.

TT?

On top of that fact that TT admitted he screwed up on the posible acquisition of Randy Moss thatb fact was handled pretty well by the way by Brett Favre in the aftermath of TT's lapse of concentration.

Now is the time or place to raise this question. Is TT ' a dote ' or did he allow Moss to slip away 'on purpose'? Ohhhh my how could I make such a suggestion?If I'm Favre I want to get an answer to that question ASAP after TT blow sit. Can't you sede Favre now..tearing into TT's office and losing his cool. I can see TT's chair baxcking up to the back wall now in reaction to the tirade Favre should have exhibited. Favre wanted Randy Moss in Green Bay. That plan made just too much sense. Add Moss to DD not any Rookie WR at that point not even drafted ThunderDan. Yes ! Favre can make almost any WR better and especially one such as the Rookie Greg Jennings. With Randy Moss it was auto-ma-tic and Greg Jennings was taken after Randy Moss went to the New England Patriots.

13-3 has nothing to do with TT dropping the ball in the Randy Moss acqisition failure ThunderDan.

Moss was outstanding in NE and the best WR in the NFL after leaving the doldrums in Oakland. Yup 23 TD's works as the best for this NFL fan. I watched him play many games that season and Moss was as good as I've ever seen. How many WER's in Green Bay ever played better than Moss did in the 2008 season ThunderDan?


I am sorry but I don't care how good Randy Moss is he wouldn't have caught any more of the balls thrown by BF in the Giants game. BF was off by 4-10 feet all game. Horrible throws in cold weather ThunderDan

The main screw up there was that our HC decided to pussy whip our side with indoor practices, instead of braving the current elements. Favre was actually appearing frozen on the sidelines. MM screwed up their in a major way by electing to practise indoors.That makes zero sense.

Our team practiced indoors and was in a state of shock, due to more than harsh weather and low temperature conditions. The weather conditions were brutal and MM may as well have set practise in Barbados.

Yes Favre was way off his game. He was like a popsicle thast had to generate arms and hands to toss a football, ThunderDan. That wasn't all his fault. That man is the toughest in the NFL and proven that he is over and over again. He's not just an 'Iron Man' in his sport. His achievement in terms of the longest start streak is just wildly incredible. Favre is inhumanly tough ThunderDan. He's hard to believe man and I mean in the highest ordert of extreme accomplishment.

Randy Moss in Green Bay is better than Randy Moss in New England ThunderDan. Hello TT ! Taking your wake up pills TT? :idea:

Now let's look at the long-term Randy Moss impact. Gregg Jennings doesn't get to play and doesn't develop like he does. What happens to Jones? Our WR core has been excellent for a number of years and this teams ability to throw the ball has been its strength because of the skill position players. Instead of having one of the best WR cores in the league we would have one of the top WR cores in the league that is a year or two from being out of the league. It is kind of like our CB position right now. Yes Woodson and Harris are great but they are old and need to be replaced. When DD retires we have Jones and Nelson to step-up into the 2nd and 3rd WR roles. ThunderDan


Again ThunderDan it turns out just fine for TT in terms of our future. 2008 and counting forward. Favre was thinking Randy Moss and Super Bowl win in 2008.

but ......... we're talking about the 2008 season exclusively and ' the fact ' that Favre needs ' to win now '.

Not in terms of ....is Favre and TT on the same page, as the team shaped up during the 2008 off season and prior to the 2008 NFL Draft? If TT gets Randy Moss then he has other options available to him in rounds one and two of that draft. [/b]

Not getting Moss force him to WR early. Ohh I know he always picks BPA early but to debate this issue we have to be precise RE: the specific issue...not go to rationalizations ThunderDan.

I do appreciate your thoughts and posy man. if IMO humble opinion it's not out of context I do agree with your views Re: the teams direction as TT tried to get it done ' his way ' after missing out on Moss and pissing favre off.

GO PACK GO!

To address your points then:
If winning the Super Bowl is the way to judge GMs and everyone else is a loser.

TT got rid of a QB who showed against CHI and NYG in the playoffs that he wanted nothing to do with playing in the bitterly cold weather. If GB is going to be an NFL powerhouse theere will be end of the season games and playoff games played in GB in December and January that the Packers have to win. BF showed in 2007 he didn't want to do that. So a good GM should fix the problem right?

In the NFC Championship BF threw the dagger that killed the Packer's season. (I personally blame J Bush for the loss but when the game was still in the balance BF choked it). A QB who can't get it done should be replaced right?

TT is the GM not BF. Plain and simple. Just because the starting QB has an idea it doesn't mean it is in the best interest of your team.

By the way Greg Jennings was drafted in 2006 and played for the Packers. GJ was on the team while Moss was being a malcontent in Oakland long before BF wanted Moss to join the team. So that whole rant about BF wanting Moss before we drafted Jennings is BS.

As per the 2008 draft. Favre retired after missing out on a Super Bowl trip. TT had only 1 health QB on the roster and he had health concerns (and I am talking about ARod). We had to use 1 of our high draft picks on a QB because BF left. We had to draft 2 QBs in that draft because BF left. So if Favre had wanted to come back and play in GB we had to use 1 of our high draft pick for QB insurance instead of getting another offensive weapon for BF to throw to. So BF would have crippled his own chances in 2008.

One other note you seem to dismiss is that BF had a shoulder injury in 2008 and his play dropped off at the end of 2008. That would have happened no matter where he was. BF couldn't get the ball out like he wanted to. It would have happened in GB. It would have happened with Moss on the team. We would have had a crippled QB limping into the playoffs at best. Once again a GM shouldn't allow that. So would you have benched an injuried BF and allowed ARod to win the Super Bowl with Moss? Anything else would have not been preparing to be the best.

[Pugger]

Given that 'in fact' that's true. What bearing does that have in terms of today? Brett Favre was in effect put out to pature by the Pacxker organizationb and even bribed by the Packers organization to retire from the game he loves.
Favre has integrity. He turned his nose up to that bribe Patler. How many men do you know that would turn down some $20 Millions $'s to retire from whatever? Just take that money and disappar. The fact he refused that offer stands Favre up even bigger in my estimation of that man as someone very special.

I as a Canadian love the NHL and always have followed my favourite team and player (s) ' with this ' as a fact of life in terms of any players career:

When any team trades a star player to another team, or otherwise waives that player or releases him. That player tries his best to shove that decision in his former teams face. To make the former team pay for not believing in him. Often he gets his revenge as he's justly motivated to do so. That's part of being a professional,, and all that which is related to a star or very talented players ego.

It was time for TT to get Favre out of sight and move forward with Aaron Rodgers. We saw that coming the day Aaron Rodgers was drafted. I certainly saw that coming and was concerned that Brett Favre wouldn't set significant personal records in a Packer uniform. Well he did all of that but his main incentive was not records. Rather win another Super Bowl. He came so close again in a Packer uniform and failure never dulled his appetite. The man wants to win very badly.

Try ... try ... try, until you succeed. :D

Once that was done ( culminating in that heart wrenching loss to the NY Giants ). I wanted Favre out of Green Bay. It was obvious to me and some others that we are not seeing around here these days. That there were certain frustrations that seperated the philosophies and intents of Brett Favre and TT. They were on different pages and worlds apart in terms of winning, now and 'YES' despite that ' Brett Favre and the Packers ' came close.

That's an old argument as well, and 'the fact is', and that we enjoy today. Is we're considered contenders to go to a Super Bowl. That's moot considering ' the fact of life ', that it'll be left on the field of play. Our success Vs any teams. We have alot of teams to play and defeat besides the Vikings.

In terms of Brett Favre and his present incentives and direction.

TT's personality and ' the will to win ' is now moot. Favre is free of TT. He certainly wants to demonstrate again this season that he had plenty in the tank when TT went in another direction. See above and National Hockey League players.

By the way the record will clearly demonstrate that personally I've supported that move of Rodgers over Favre by TT and the Packer organization. It was time. Given that was done. What Brett Favre has ever done to support his needs is moot. He's no longer a Packer and free as a professional to make his best deal and with a team he considers a serious contender.

He's not a traitor. Favre is a man on a mission as a Pro atlhlete, and 'of course' that's possibly counter productive to our hopes, and only as he proves himself worthy of playing at a high level and winning the big games. He's fallen down many times but despite all that many NFL fans love him in the game. He's arguably, the most exciting player to ever play the QB position in the NFL.

Aaron Rodgers is our QB now and it's too simple. Suport Aaron Rodgers and certainly use some wisdom in terms of hating Brett Favre. That's just wrong to sick IMO.

Disagreeing with me won't change my position. :D

GO PACKERS!

Seriously Woodbuck, we have seen the timelines. We have discussed the terms of Favre's "retirement" several times. Your inability to even acknowledge the possibility that Favre retired and wanted out as opposed to being pushed out by TT is mind-boggling.

No Man. Favre had to want to get far away from TT, as it was obvious to me and other's here that TT was not on the same page as Brett Favre RE: win now.

So here is that whole issue as I witnessed it as a member of Packerrats and I will deliver this to you, Bossman641 to try to give you adequate if not maximum respect.

Bossman641. Does any of us at Packerrats or elsewhere, really know exactly what transpired back in the weeks leading up to the 2009 Draft? In terms specifically or not related to Brett Favre coming back as our starting QB? Have we officially heard both sides of that issue or 'the TRUTH'? Have you? I havn't!

All I've read is someone's best case scenario. As accurate as that may have been or is. Do we really know of any or all agenda's? Favre's or TT's? Do you Bossman641? I don't? I may one day when the book arrives on the bookshelves.

Favre always said in the years leading up to the 2009 season that he wanted to feel wanted by the Packer Organization. Wanted ' as our starting QB '.

Let's go back to the real beginning of the move to Aaron Rodgers as our starting QB Bossman641.

In 2005 TT chose Aaron Rodgers in round one of that draft as the heir apparant to Brett Favre. The writing was on the wall and Aaron Rodgers began his tutilage to be our QB. In the 2008 ' off season ' Aaron showed us some promise but he also offered us a question concerning his ability not to have freak accidents (he fell off a bench one time and hurt himself), and otherwise, to remain healthy. I mean this fella looked like an accident looking for a time and a place to happen. Do you re-call that Bossman641?

Favre was running out of time no less, and in the 2008 off season we became well aware of Favre's desires for another star quality WR. To make the march to a Super Bowl, a more realistic proposition. So ... we re-call the whole Randy Moss out of Oakland and to whomever saga that landed Moss in New Englan where he had a monster season (what...23 TD's) with Tom Brady as his QB. Please no comparisons between Brady and Favre in terms of how well or not Moss would have done in Green Bay.

I'm trying to make a specific point here.

As I saw it back in 2008; and debate me as you may desire that. Favre with Moss and all other present company at that time = Super Bowl, too much negative adversity aside.

Some of us here at Packerrats, came to a conclusion that TT fell asleep on failing to bring in Randy Moss. TT's a strange animal to many and fully supported by alot of Packer fans. TT often acted like he was asleep on the job. Personally, I've never been too excited over TT's performance. I'm even on record as claiming that under his tenure as our GM. We won't enjoy a Super Bowl win.

Why do I feel that way? :

TT's not ' balls to the walls ' enough :D Re: Randy Moss, and please don't come back to me on whether you did or did not support Randy Moss in the Green and Gold. Brett Favre wanted him. Because he like some here saw the obvious potential for us to go all the way. To give a more realistic hope to/for us to go to and win a Super Bowl in 2008.

Well New England and Moss got to the show in 2008 and lost to the team we should have beaten. The NY Giants.

Wasn';t it obvious to you Bossman641 that Favre was on his last legs in the Green and Gold. Personally I prayed that the BS he was given would end. I wanted to see Aaron Rodgers in as our starter and Favre retired or elsewhere. I wanted him free of all that is TT. Yes! I supported an awesome HOF QB or Brett Favre over a GM that didn't appear to have blood in his veins as long as Favre was wearing our colors.

I was 'in fact' very pleased for Favre when he was traded to the Jets. I was sick of all the damn agony I saw as TT stalled and poked around. I always believed that one of his main tasks ( assigned bt the real boss's ). Was to as delicately as possible remove Brett Favre.

I'm trying to make a specific point here.

We heard that TT 'thought' he had Randy Moss locked up and so as it was late in his day he went to went to bed thinking Randy Moss was a Packer. Thinking doesn't make it or anything happen ... ever! Do you re-call that Bossman641 as I do?

The bottom line was that in Favre's view TT certainly screwed up again. As Randy Moss's season in New England went down the error TT made had to become more and more obvious to Favre and cause more and more animosity 'only if' he got really weak. I believe that Brett Favre had to come to terms with the rteality of TT as a slow,plodding,bungling type of GM and their personal relationship had to suffer for that. Favre had only so much more time to get to the show. TT had as much time as his superiors desired for him to have after getting Favre out of Green Bay.

Now go back to the playoff game in what Jan. 2005 or our last match-up in the playoffs of the 2004 season after we defeated Minnesota 2X in the regular season and they got out of the gate way too fast. That same game where we almost came back but..re-call Favre's sloppy underhanded pass to the endzone when he could have easily ran the ball into the endzone between the right uprights and RH sideline marker. That NO PLAY was 'just sick' on behalf of Brett Favre.

After that. He had to go 'in the eyes of many'. Yes I believe that play was the catalyst to usher in our current GM. I believe he had to re-build the team and get Favre as best. RETIRED.

Favre always has and stil, does want one thing. To win another Super Bowl. TT did little in terms of making the big move to better ensure that result while Favre was our QB. That is as I see it and agree with me or not. That's what I observed; and it doesn't take a Rocket Scientist to come to the same conclusion as I have since playoff's 2004.

Horse feathers!! Just a couple of weeks before Favre's teary press conference the team that TT assembled just played in the NFC Championship game. That team was primed for the Super Bowl until #4 threw another INT in a playoff game so you can't sit there and say with a straight face that TT didn't want to win in 2007. And had #4 not "retired" I am positive that he would have been the Packers starting QB in 2008 too.

[Fritz]

I think Ted was surprised and frustrated that the Packers played so well in '07. He had a timeline for winning that was a little later than '07, so when the Packers began to win and it became clear they were close, Ted stubbornly stuck to his plan. It was too soon. Probably he thought it was a fluke, that season. So he probably thought he'd be foolish to try to win that very next year.

[woodbuck27]

woodbuck, you are like the Lou Holtz of this forum.

A second thought on this post mraynrand.

Lou Holtz is outstanding and recognized as such by his peers. The only thing I have in common with him and will lay claim to here at Packerrats is that we're both of Irish heritage.

I've never coached football but I have coached baseball and fastball (softball) and saw my teams win several championships. I do recognize what it takes to be a winner man.

I never competed without expecting to give the maximum required to win at anything and that was especially so when I competed as an individual in say tennis, track and field, Xcountry or road racing, martial arts, table tennis, golf (match play only) or shooting stick (shooting pool ... eight or nine ball) , darts etc.

Half way yields inferior results. Half way ends up down in the rankings. It's very important to inspire a spirit of good sportsmanship in the players that want to contribute the best they are capable of on any team you coach or participate with. Also, I found that I had ... 'as a coach', the necessary demands of making your team players ' believe in maximum results' or themselves through the required effort and preparation to win it all.

You don't get there though without star players supplemented with role players as well. You need stars with quiet egos that 'of course' expect a supporting cast that helps relieve the pressure or stress on them.

The formula to be a winner isn't rocket science. It's easier depended on the size of a team in terms of roster. That fact makes it so hard to win in the NFL. An NFL football team isn't a rugby team in terms of the complex player/position moves needed to excel or compete and gain a winning record. To be the winner calls for more. Good fortune and plans or stratagies to deal with adversity come to mind.

It's easier to win as an individual. You need only to be competitive and think positively and have the necessary guts to get over the top. You need a spirit of mind control and positive thinking and be extremely determined, well prepared or expect failure.

[mraynrand]

woodbuck, you are like the Lou Holtz of this forum.

A second thought on this post mraynrand.

Lou Holtz is outstanding and recognized as such by his peers. The only thing I have in common with him and will lay claim to here at Packerrats is that we're both of Irish heritage.

I've never coached football but I have coached baseball and fastball (softball) and saw my teams win several championships. I do recognize what it takes to be a winner man.

I never competed without expecting to give the maximum required to win at anything and that was especially so when I competed as an individual in say tennis, track and field, Xcountry or road racing, martial arts, table tennis, golf (match play only) or shooting stick (shooting pool ... eight or nine ball) , darts etc.

Half way yields inferior results. Half way ends up down in the rankings. It's very important to inspire a spirit of good sportsmanship in the players that want to contribute the best they are capable of on any team you coach or participate with. Also, I found that I had ... 'as a coach', the necessary demands of making your team players ' believe in maximum results' or themselves through the required effort and preparation to win it all.

You don't get there though without star players supplemented with role players as well. You need stars with quiet egos that 'of course' expect a supporting cast that helps relieve the pressure or stress on them.

The formula to be a winner isn't rocket science. It's easier depended on the size of a team in terms of roster. That fact makes it so hard to win in the NFL. An NFL football team isn't a rugby team in terms of the complex player/position moves needed to excel or compete and gain a winning record. To be the winner calls for more. Good fortune and plans or stratagies to deal with adversity come to mind.

It's easier to win as an individual. You need only to be competitive and think positively and have the necessary guts to get over the top. You need a spirit of mind control and positive thinking and be extremely determined, well prepared or expect failure.

It's like Lou has been cloned! Priceless!

[bobblehead]

Woody, you say that we don't know the truth for certain about what transpired, then you assert as truth that we would have won it all in '08 (you meant '07 season I assume) if we had landed moss. How can you know that for certain??

I also would like to ask, while I'm at it, how you can say TT was using a "win later" approach, but landing that ONE player would have made us superbowl champions? I would think if your team is one player away from it all it can NOT be using a win later approach.

[mraynrand]

Woody, you say that we don't know the truth for certain about what transpired, then you assert as truth that we would have won it all in '08 (you meant '07 season I assume) if we had landed moss. How can you know that for certain??

I also would like to ask, while I'm at it, how you can say TT was using a "win later" approach, but landing that ONE player would have made us superbowl champions? I would think if your team is one player away from it all it can NOT be using a win later approach.

Hi there!

http://turbo.inquisitr.com/wp-content/2010/07/lebron-james.jpg

[DannoMac21]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

[DannoMac21]

Woody, you say that we don't know the truth for certain about what transpired, then you assert as truth that we would have won it all in '08 (you meant '07 season I assume) if we had landed moss. How can you know that for certain??

I also would like to ask, while I'm at it, how you can say TT was using a "win later" approach, but landing that ONE player would have made us superbowl champions? I would think if your team is one player away from it all it can NOT be using a win later approach.

Hi there!

http://turbo.inquisitr.com/wp-content/2010/07/lebron-james.jpg

Miami still won't win (at least now). Artest smothers LeBron, Kobe can handle Wade, and Gasol puts the lapdog (Bosh) in his place. Lakers are still a better team, and have the better coach, with the best player in the game.

[cheesner]

The Moss Deal:

TT made the trade for Moss for a 4th round pick. The paperwork was to be signed the next day. Overnight, NE offered a 3rd and Al Davis took it rather than give TT a chance to up his offer. For the love of God! Do you expect TT to call up Al and say, 'look, we have this deal for a 4th round, but I would like to give you a 3rd instead.'?

Moss stated that he did not want to play for the Raiders. He would jog during plays that he wasn't going to get any passes. He ran different routes because he didn't want to go over the middle. He wouldn't block on running plays.

Moss stated that he did not want to play for the Packers. What makes you think he would have had any impact for us?

[woodbuck27]

"The point I tried to make wasn't in regard to the impact that Moss would have or not have made to our team had TT acquired him; but that TT fell asleep in the process of trying to acquire Moss and that had to really piss Brett Favre off."


Woody, we've been over this. You are assuming it was a slam dunk that everyone wanted this guy and that he would have improved the team. Can't you recognize that it's entirely possible that TT though not adding Moss was better than adding him? Or at the very least that TT thought Moss was worth so much and no more? And so what if it pissed Favre off. The Packers did just fine without Moss. Maybe TT if better at evaluating talent and putting a squad together with chemistry and so forth than Favre or anyone else would or will give him credit for - Try looking at it from a non-Favre perspective and see what you see.

This isn't a thread discussed from a non Favre perspective mraynrand.

Go back and check the record on this issue of the Packers and our GM. Your sharp at this stuff man.

TT said he attempted to and thought that he 'in fact' secured Randy Moss for our teams efforts in 2007.

There are people in this forum that will ignore this fact as they cannot imagine the likes of a Randy Moss in our colors, as a Green Bay Packer. These people may hold an animosity forever and are seldom open to seeing the benefit of a real talent on their team at the expense of their needs to despise forever a simple act or insult even one time years priior. That's too foolish for me to comprehend.

An example mraynrand:

Animosity and outrage over an incident like the time Randy Moss rubbed his ass on our goal post after scoring a TD. You re-call that incident don't you? What was that?

Well only this:

It's called gamesmanship and that's not usually sportsmanship. :)

Back to our fine GM and I mean that sincerely, as he has received praise and recognition for all his efforts inthe past. TT may have gone to school over the failure to follow-up on acquiring Randy Moss.

RE: this thread and it most certainly would apply. Favre held it together when he determined that TT failed to acquire Randy Moss. We all should agree here that Favre very much desired Randy Moss to toss to in 2008. Randy Moss in a Packer uniform made Favre's heart beat really fast. (check)

TT tried to get a deal done with Al Davis and Oakland and he felt he had succeeded. ( check)

Later and upon questioning his interest and failure to secure Randy Moss. TT admitting that he sincerely tried to acquire Randy Moss from Al Davis. He said 'in fact ' that when he retired for the night. That he felt that it was a done deal. That Randy Moss was destined to be a Green Bay Packer. That he had successfully secured Randy Moss at a price acceptable to both himself and Al Davis (Oakland).

As you may re-call mraynrand. That acquisition attempt happened just before the Sat. draft day ( wasn't it that Friday night? or was it later on Sat. night? ) of the 2007 Draft Weekend?

With all due respect. Your post is moot in terms related to the fact that TT felt he had acquired Randy Moss just prior to ending his day. That is an admission to me and to Favre of the fact he bobbled the ball in this issue of RandyMoss and him being a Green Bay Packer at the start of the 2007 season.

IMO. If we had Randy Moss. That ' as a fact ' was a far better proposition than not having him. I'm fairly sure back then that Favre would have agreed and the evidence only supports that mraynrand.

Later.... and GO Packers.

[ThunderDan]

"The point I tried to make wasn't in regard to the impact that Moss would have or not have made to our team had TT acquired him; but that TT fell asleep in the process of trying to acquire Moss and that had to really piss Brett Favre off."


Woody, we've been over this. You are assuming it was a slam dunk that everyone wanted this guy and that he would have improved the team. Can't you recognize that it's entirely possible that TT though not adding Moss was better than adding him? Or at the very least that TT thought Moss was worth so much and no more? And so what if it pissed Favre off. The Packers did just fine without Moss. Maybe TT if better at evaluating talent and putting a squad together with chemistry and so forth than Favre or anyone else would or will give him credit for - Try looking at it from a non-Favre perspective and see what you see.

This isn't a thread discussed from a non Favre perspective mraynrand.

Go back and check the record on this issue of the Packers and our GM. Your sharp at this stuff man.

TT said he attempted to and thought that he 'in fact' secured Randy Moss for our teams efforts in 2008.

There are people in this forum that will ignore this fact as they cannot imagine the likes of a Randy Moss in our colors, as a Green Bay Packer. These people may hold an animosity forever and are seldom open to seeing the benefit of a real talent on their team at the expense of their needs to despise forever a simple act or insult even one time years priior. That's too foolish for me to comprehend.

An example mraynrand:

Animosity and outrage over an incident like the time Randy Moss rubbed his ass on our goal post after scoring a TD. You re-call that incident don't you? What was that?

Well only this:

It's called gamesmanship and that's not usually sportsmanship. :)

Back to our fine GM and I mean that sincerely, as he has received praise and recognition for all his efforts inthe past. TT may have gone to school over the failure to follow-up on acquiring Randy Moss.

RE: this thread and it most certainly would apply. Favre held it together when he determined that TT failed to acquire Randy Moss. We all should agree here that Favre very much desired Randy Moss to toss to in 2008. Randy Moss in a Packer uniform made Favre's heart beat really fast. (check)

TT tried to get a deal done with Al Davis and Oakland and he felt he had succeeded. ( check)

Later and upon questioning his interest and failure to secure Randy Moss. TT admitting that he sincerely tried to acquire Randy Moss from Al Davis. He said 'in fact ' that when he retired for the night. That he felt that it was a done deal. That Randy Moss was destined to be a Green Bay Packer. That he had successfully secured Randy Moss at a price acceptable to both himself and Al Davis (Oakland).

As you may re-call mraynrand. That acquisition attempt happened just before the Sat. draft day ( wasn't it that Friday night? or was it later on Sat. night? ) of the 2008 Draft Weekend?

With all due respect. Your post is moot in terms related to the fact that TT felt he had acquired Randy Moss just prior to ending his day. That is an admission to me and to Favre of the fact he bobbled the ball in this issue of RandyMoss and him being a Green Bay Packer at the start of the 2008 season.

IMO. If we had Randy Moss. That ' as a fact ' was a far better proposition than not having him. I'm fairly sure back then that Favre would have agreed and the evidence only supports that mraynrand.

Later.... and GO Packers.

The really funny part about this is that he doesn't even know what year he is talking about. It was 2007 that TT thought he had gotten Moss from the Raiders for a 4th round pick.

It was the 2007 season that we made the NFC CHampionship game. A few weeks later BF had retired. It was 2007 that Moss put up the 23 TDs for NE. In 2008 BF was moved to NYJ and 2009 he went to MINN.

You are arguing facts in wrong years.

[woodbuck27]

The Moss Deal:

TT made the trade for Moss for a 4th round pick. The paperwork was to be signed the next day. Overnight, NE offered a 3rd and Al Davis took it rather than give TT a chance to up his offer. For the love of God! Do you expect TT to call up Al and say, 'look, we have this deal for a 4th round, but I would like to give you a 3rd instead.'?

Moss stated that he did not want to play for the Raiders. He would jog during plays that he wasn't going to get any passes. He ran different routes because he didn't want to go over the middle. He wouldn't block on running plays.

Moss stated that he did not want to play for the Packers. What makes you think he would have had any impact for us?

What makes you think he would have had any impact for us? cheesner

My response to the immediate above:

Because he's Randy Moss. woodbuck27

I'm just a Packer fan folks. You need not sharpen the knives. LOL it's not about what I think here in this thread but what Brett Favre may or likely felt. Isn't that where we are folks? That's where I am; so for the future. Please post accordingly. I'll appreciate it. and THANKS. :D


Yes Moss hated his time in Oakland and certainly demonstrated that fact. He wanted to play for a winner. He's an awesome talent and wants to win. Ala Favre. Stars are like that. Like that in most sports amatuer or Pro.


GO PACKERS!

Moss proved to us that he still had it in 2008. 23 TD's and a Pro Bowl under NE colors and recognized BEST WR in the NFL proves that's the TRUTH. He was wasted in Oakland. He's a star WR. I won't get into the ego or attitude of s0 called or deemed *stars*; but their ego is usually huge. That is part and parcel of their excellence. They're wired differently than most people.

[ThunderDan]

Randy Moss stats from NFL.com:

2009 New England Patriots 16 16 83 1,264 15.2 71T 13
2008 New England Patriots 16 16 69 1,008 14.6 76T 11
2007 New England Patriots 16 16 98 1,493 15.2 65T 23

I hope this helps show that Moss went to NE in 2007 to catch 23 TDs.

[woodbuck27]

"The point I tried to make wasn't in regard to the impact that Moss would have or not have made to our team had TT acquired him; but that TT fell asleep in the process of trying to acquire Moss and that had to really piss Brett Favre off."


Woody, we've been over this. You are assuming it was a slam dunk that everyone wanted this guy and that he would have improved the team. Can't you recognize that it's entirely possible that TT though not adding Moss was better than adding him? Or at the very least that TT thought Moss was worth so much and no more? And so what if it pissed Favre off. The Packers did just fine without Moss. Maybe TT if better at evaluating talent and putting a squad together with chemistry and so forth than Favre or anyone else would or will give him credit for - Try looking at it from a non-Favre perspective and see what you see.

This isn't a thread discussed from a non Favre perspective mraynrand.

Go back and check the record on this issue of the Packers and our GM. Your sharp at this stuff man.

TT said he attempted to and thought that he 'in fact' secured Randy Moss for our teams efforts in 2008.

There are people in this forum that will ignore this fact as they cannot imagine the likes of a Randy Moss in our colors, as a Green Bay Packer. These people may hold an animosity forever and are seldom open to seeing the benefit of a real talent on their team at the expense of their needs to despise forever a simple act or insult even one time years priior. That's too foolish for me to comprehend.

An example mraynrand:

Animosity and outrage over an incident like the time Randy Moss rubbed his ass on our goal post after scoring a TD. You re-call that incident don't you? What was that?

Well only this:

It's called gamesmanship and that's not usually sportsmanship. :)

Back to our fine GM and I mean that sincerely, as he has received praise and recognition for all his efforts inthe past. TT may have gone to school over the failure to follow-up on acquiring Randy Moss.

RE: this thread and it most certainly would apply. Favre held it together when he determined that TT failed to acquire Randy Moss. We all should agree here that Favre very much desired Randy Moss to toss to in 2008. Randy Moss in a Packer uniform made Favre's heart beat really fast. (check)

TT tried to get a deal done with Al Davis and Oakland and he felt he had succeeded. ( check)

Later and upon questioning his interest and failure to secure Randy Moss. TT admitting that he sincerely tried to acquire Randy Moss from Al Davis. He said 'in fact ' that when he retired for the night. That he felt that it was a done deal. That Randy Moss was destined to be a Green Bay Packer. That he had successfully secured Randy Moss at a price acceptable to both himself and Al Davis (Oakland).

As you may re-call mraynrand. That acquisition attempt happened just before the Sat. draft day ( wasn't it that Friday night? or was it later on Sat. night? ) of the 2008 Draft Weekend?

With all due respect. Your post is moot in terms related to the fact that TT felt he had acquired Randy Moss just prior to ending his day. That is an admission to me and to Favre of the fact he bobbled the ball in this issue of RandyMoss and him being a Green Bay Packer at the start of the 2008 season.

IMO. If we had Randy Moss. That ' as a fact ' was a far better proposition than not having him. I'm fairly sure back then that Favre would have agreed and the evidence only supports that mraynrand.

Later.... and GO Packers.

The really funny part about this is that he doesn't even know what year he is talking about. It was 2007 that TT thought he had gotten Moss from the Raiders for a 4th round pick.

It was the 2007 season that we made the NFC CHampionship game. A few weeks later BF had retired. It was 2007 that Moss put up the 23 TDs for NE. In 2008 BF was moved to NYJ and 2009 he went to MINN.

You are arguing facts in wrong years.

Sure in your need to put down anyone that may have a point you disagree with you have to draw on small minded stuff to propose your the man.

I simply admit my error man.

Yes all that Moss and maybe becoming a Packer stuff went down
(April - 2007) and that preceded Favre going to ' the Jets ' for the 2008 season and ohh my gosh THANKS again, I forgot. Favre becoming a Viking last season or in 2009.

Thanks for the help.

THANKS for helping me get that ' absolutely ' correct.

NO better 'of course' your always right. I've noticed that. :lol:

[woodbuck27]

"The point I tried to make wasn't in regard to the impact that Moss would have or not have made to our team had TT acquired him; but that TT fell asleep in the process of trying to acquire Moss and that had to really piss Brett Favre off."


Woody, we've been over this. You are assuming it was a slam dunk that everyone wanted this guy and that he would have improved the team. Can't you recognize that it's entirely possible that TT though not adding Moss was better than adding him? Or at the very least that TT thought Moss was worth so much and no more? And so what if it pissed Favre off. The Packers did just fine without Moss. Maybe TT if better at evaluating talent and putting a squad together with chemistry and so forth than Favre or anyone else would or will give him credit for - Try looking at it from a non-Favre perspective and see what you see.

This isn't a thread discussed from a non Favre perspective mraynrand.

Go back and check the record on this issue of the Packers and our GM. Your sharp at this stuff man.

TT said he attempted to and thought that he 'in fact' secured Randy Moss for our teams efforts in 2007.

There are people in this forum that will ignore this fact as they cannot imagine the likes of a Randy Moss in our colors, as a Green Bay Packer. These people may hold an animosity forever and are seldom open to seeing the benefit of a real talent on their team at the expense of their needs to despise forever a simple act or insult even one time years priior. That's too foolish for me to comprehend.

An example mraynrand:

Animosity and outrage over an incident like the time Randy Moss rubbed his ass on our goal post after scoring a TD. You re-call that incident don't you? What was that?

Well only this:

It's called gamesmanship and that's not usually sportsmanship. :)

Back to our fine GM and I mean that sincerely, as he has received praise and recognition for all his efforts inthe past. TT may have gone to school over the failure to follow-up on acquiring Randy Moss.

RE: this thread and it most certainly would apply. Favre held it together when he determined that TT failed to acquire Randy Moss. We all should agree here that Favre very much desired Randy Moss to toss to in 2007. Randy Moss in a Packer uniform made Favre's heart beat really fast. (check)

TT tried to get a deal done with Al Davis and Oakland and he felt he had succeeded. ( check)

Later and upon questioning his interest and failure to secure Randy Moss. TT admitting that he sincerely tried to acquire Randy Moss from Al Davis. He said 'in fact ' that when he retired for the night. That he felt that it was a done deal. That Randy Moss was destined to be a Green Bay Packer. That he had successfully secured Randy Moss at a price acceptable to both himself and Al Davis (Oakland).

As you may re-call mraynrand. That acquisition attempt happened just before the Sat. draft day ( wasn't it that Friday night? or was it later on Sat. night? ) of the 2007 Draft Weekend?

With all due respect. Your post is moot in terms related to the fact that TT felt he had acquired Randy Moss just prior to ending his day. That is an admission to me and to Favre of the fact he bobbled the ball in this issue of RandyMoss and him being a Green Bay Packer at the start of the 2007 season.

IMO. If we had Randy Moss. That ' as a fact ' was a far better proposition than not having him. I'm fairly sure back then that Favre would have agreed and the evidence only supports that mraynrand.

Later.... and GO Packers.

The really funny part about this is that he doesn't even know what year he is talking about. It was 2007 that TT thought he had gotten Moss from the Raiders for a 4th round pick.

It was the 2007 season that we made the NFC CHampionship game. A few weeks later BF had retired. It was 2007 that Moss put up the 23 TDs for NE. In 2008 BF was moved to NYJ and 2009 he went to MINN.

You are arguing facts in wrong years.

[Bossman641]

WB

Just a few quick points.

You are right that we don't know the whole story, but I feel when you look at what we do know it is heavily weighted towards TT.

Favre is the one who went on TV to plead his case. What horrible facts did we learn as to how he had been so wronged? None. The Packers sent out a very thorough, very detailed timeline regarding what happened in regards to contact with Favre, scheduling a plane to announce his retirement, Favre calling back and saying forget it. Guess what? Favre couldn't deny or refute any of it. That right there tells me that there was a lot more truth in the organization's story then Favre's. Why would Favre have held anything back? He was already burning bridges as it was.

If Favre's main complaint was that TT wouldn't let him play GM, then then boo fuckin boo. That wasn't his job and he had no right to play GM.

Moreover, look at how Favre has acted since then. Retired from the Jets and then asked for his retirement "just because." Booked hotel rooms the weekend of Packers-Vikings game while still a member of the Jets.

When it comes down to a truth-telling contest between the Packers and Favre there is no question in my mind who I should believe. Favre hasn't given me reason to believe a single word that comes out of his mouth.

Woodbuck I am awaiting your reply.

[ThunderDan]

The really funny part about this is that he doesn't even know what year he is talking about. It was 2007 that TT thought he had gotten Moss from the Raiders for a 4th round pick.

It was the 2007 season that we made the NFC CHampionship game. A few weeks later BF had retired. It was 2007 that Moss put up the 23 TDs for NE. In 2008 BF was moved to NYJ and 2009 he went to MINN.

You are arguing facts in wrong years.

Sure in your need to put down anyone that may have a point you disagree with you have to draw on small minded stuff to propose your the man.

I simply admit my error man.

Yes all that Moss and maybe becoming a Packer stuff went down
(April - 2007) and that preceded Favre going to ' the Jets ' for the 2008 season and ohh my gosh THANKS again, I forgot. Favre becoming a Viking last season or in 2009.

Thanks for the help.

THANKS for helping me get that ' absolutely ' correct.

NO better 'of course' your always right. I've noticed that. :lol:

Actually, I wanted to clarify because a 2008 timeline supports your position of Favre feeling TT wasn't supporting a 2008 run for the Super Bowl and Favre then wanting out.

[Cheesehead Craig]

But why is the rum gone?

[woodbuck27]

No Man. Favre had to want to get far away from TT, as it was obvious to me and other's here that TT was not on the same page as Brett Favre RE: win now.

How can you write stuff like this? It's demonstrably and obviously untrue. A team one play away from the Superbowl cannot possibly be equated in any way with a win later attitude. This is so bizarre. (Cue the four page response....)

Yes your correct too mraynrand;and I'm writing in the context of Favre Vs TT's effort Re: agreeing with Favre and obtaining Randy Moss and that failure on TT's part to try to get Moss and not close the deal.

What issue came up between TT and Favre 'over that specific issue', that may have caused a real dissention between them that led to the final break in 2008? Was Favre fed up with TT's failure to set the 2007 season up to make us look like a very solid contender? In spite of that failure to get Moss. Favre worked it out within himself and had a very decent season in 2007, as far as his personal numbers went and the teams regular season record was steller.

GO Packers !

[woodbuck27]

The really funny part about this is that he doesn't even know what year he is talking about. It was 2007 that TT thought he had gotten Moss from the Raiders for a 4th round pick.

It was the 2007 season that we made the NFC CHampionship game. A few weeks later BF had retired. It was 2007 that Moss put up the 23 TDs for NE. In 2008 BF was moved to NYJ and 2009 he went to MINN.

You are arguing facts in wrong years.

Sure in your need to put down anyone that may have a point you disagree with you have to draw on small minded stuff to propose your the man.

I simply admit my error man.

Yes all that Moss and maybe becoming a Packer stuff went down
(April - 2007) and that preceded Favre going to ' the Jets ' for the 2008 season and ohh my gosh THANKS again, I forgot. Favre becoming a Viking last season or in 2009.

Thanks for the help.

THANKS for helping me get that ' absolutely ' correct.

NO better 'of course' your always right. I've noticed that. :lol:

Actually, I wanted to clarify because a 2008 timeline supports your position of Favre feeling TT wasn't supporting a 2008 run for the Super Bowl and Favre then wanting out.

Good grief man! :D

Favre didn't want out. He didn't want to be a back-up either and that's what was offered him by TT and MM, even given the way he performed in 2007 ThunderDan. That performance was a steller one overall.

Favre as a backup? That's too funny.

GO PACKERS!

[falco]

http://www.sherwoodcpas.com/images/Moose.jpg

[MJZiggy]

But why is the rum gone?

There's rum? For the love of god, send it my way. Why are we rehashing this all 3 years later. We put this thing to bed so many times we're running out of beds.

[woodbuck27]

The really funny part about this is that he doesn't even know what year he is talking about. It was 2007 that TT thought he had gotten Moss from the Raiders for a 4th round pick.

It was the 2007 season that we made the NFC CHampionship game. A few weeks later BF had retired. It was 2007 that Moss put up the 23 TDs for NE. In 2008 BF was moved to NYJ and 2009 he went to MINN.

You are arguing facts in wrong years.

Sure in your need to put down anyone that may have a point you disagree with you have to draw on small minded stuff to propose your the man.

I simply admit my error man.

Yes all that Moss and maybe becoming a Packer stuff went down
(April - 2007) and that preceded Favre going to ' the Jets ' for the 2008 season and ohh my gosh THANKS again, I forgot. Favre becoming a Viking last season or in 2009.

Thanks for the help.

THANKS for helping me get that ' absolutely ' correct.

NO better 'of course' your always right. I've noticed that. :lol:

Actually, I wanted to clarify because a 2008 timeline supports your position of Favre feeling TT wasn't supporting a 2008 run for the Super Bowl and Favre then wanting out.

Ahhhh excuse me but I believe that TT and MM knew exactly what role Favre was going to be playing in 2008. I believe that one day 'the real story' will reveal that TRUTH.

TT wanted to go to Aaron Rodgers and had to play it cute. He wanted to make the Packers his team and the only obstacle to that result was Favre and his strong desire to win now. Favre wanted TT to fuel the team to be really solid, as we saw Wolf do when we last won the Super Bowl. TT was always 'the plodder'.

I believe we will one day learn that; that plodding style of TT's, annoyed Brett Favre as it did some members here. I believe that he informed TT of that and their relationship became strained.

Maybe we'll find that Favre and TT were more than less on the same page too. They both realized it was time to divorce. For Aaron Rodgers to get his career really started.

I felt thatb way and I love Brett Favre. I wanted him anywhere but in a Packer uniform. I couldn't handle TT anymore in terms of the way he certainly appeared to me to be holding back.

I will never change my position on this folks. It's just too clear to me. I watched it all too closely.

GO PACK GO.

[woodbuck27]

WB

Just a few quick points.

You are right that we don't know the whole story, but I feel when you look at what we do know it is heavily weighted towards TT.

Favre is the one who went on TV to plead his case. What horrible facts did we learn as to how he had been so wronged? None. The Packers sent out a very thorough, very detailed timeline regarding what happened in regards to contact with Favre, scheduling a plane to announce his retirement, Favre calling back and saying forget it. Guess what? Favre couldn't deny or refute any of it. That right there tells me that there was a lot more truth in the organization's story then Favre's. Why would Favre have held anything back? He was already burning bridges as it was.

If Favre's main complaint was that TT wouldn't let him play GM, then then boo fuckin boo. That wasn't his job and he had no right to play GM.

Moreover, look at how Favre has acted since then. Retired from the Jets and then asked for his retirement "just because." Booked hotel rooms the weekend of Packers-Vikings game while still a member of the Jets.

When it comes down to a truth-telling contest between the Packers and Favre there is no question in my mind who I should believe. Favre hasn't given me reason to believe a single word that comes out of his mouth.

Woodbuck I am awaiting your reply.

Sorry but right now I have an audience with 'the Pope'. 8-)

GO PACK GO!

[MichiganPackerFan]

http://static.foxsports.com/content/fscom/img/2010/09/07/4_20100907200454_600_400.JPG

[Fritz]

Favre didn't really "betray" anyone. It's a business and he wanted to work at the place of his choice.

He handled it badly. Butchered it. Showed himself to be more selfish and manipulative than people had hoped. Threw a few folks under busses attempting to make himself appear to be an "innocent" when he was not, at all.

But he didn't "betray" anyone.

Still, I liked that sign!

[Scott Campbell]

I would very much enjoy seeing him get smacked around again tonight.

[get louder at lambeau]

I would very much enjoy seeing him get smacked around again tonight.

Break a leg Brett!


No, seriously.

[cheesner]

Favre didn't really "betray" anyone. It's a business and he wanted to work at the place of his choice.

He handled it badly. Butchered it. Showed himself to be more selfish and manipulative than people had hoped. Threw a few folks under busses attempting to make himself appear to be an "innocent" when he was not, at all.

But he didn't "betray" anyone.

Still, I liked that sign!I would say he betrayed Campen, or whoever it was that went to talk to him and he betrayed his confidence by talking to the media about it.

Favre contacted Detroit GM, Matt Millen, and told him 'inside' info on how to beat the Packers. I would call this a betrayal.

Favre admits he wanted to play for the Vikings so that he could 'stick it' to TT. TT is a Packer. When BF said this he was saying, IMO, that he wanted to stick it to the Packers as an organization. I consider this a betrayal.

[Scott Campbell]

Favre didn't really "betray" anyone. It's a business and he wanted to work at the place of his choice.

He handled it badly. Butchered it. Showed himself to be more selfish and manipulative than people had hoped. Threw a few folks under busses attempting to make himself appear to be an "innocent" when he was not, at all.

But he didn't "betray" anyone.

Still, I liked that sign!I would say he betrayed Campen, or whoever it was that went to talk to him and he betrayed his confidence by talking to the media about it.

Favre contacted Detroit GM, Matt Millen, and told him 'inside' info on how to beat the Packers. I would call this a betrayal.

Favre admits he wanted to play for the Vikings so that he could 'stick it' to TT. TT is a Packer. When BF said this he was saying, IMO, that he wanted to stick it to the Packers as an organization. I consider this a betrayal.



The jury has spoken:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-L5UyGDlVM

[mission]

I would very much enjoy seeing him get smacked around again tonight.

Break a leg Brett!


No, seriously.

No, really.

That interview they just had up there... his "we could have been there easily" talk is just pathetic. When exactly did Favre fall from grace? He's just gone off the deep end; never remember Montana doing interviews like that.

[Pugger]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

[Tarlam!]

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

I'm still bitter. I spent $200 dollars on his Packers uniforrm for one. But I'm bitter that he acted the way he did and basically shat on all Packer fans.

[mission]

Bitter is the wrong word. Bitter is like me wishing I still had my ex-girlfriend who is now with another dude.

There's a certain feeling you have when you were with that crazy ***** and you tried to break up with her and it kept dragging on... then you finally moved on and starting banging some new chicks. That's more of the kind of relief most Packers fans have. We love our new life and almost wish we would have done it sooner. We don't have to start liking him now -- it's ok to move on. I have, just don't wonder why I don't love the guy.

[channtheman]

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

I'm still bitter. I spent $200 dollars on his Packers uniforrm for one. But I'm bitter that he acted the way he did and basically shat on all Packer fans.

And if we still had Spencer Havner on the team, I would advise you to convert your jersey. Unfortunately, with the news from the last week, that is now no longer a viable option either. :(

[MichiganPackerFan]

Favre didn't really "betray" anyone. It's a business and he wanted to work at the place of his choice.

He handled it badly. Butchered it. Showed himself to be more selfish and manipulative than people had hoped. Threw a few folks under busses attempting to make himself appear to be an "innocent" when he was not, at all.

But he didn't "betray" anyone.

Still, I liked that sign!

Agree and sign was funny

[woodbuck27]

Randy Moss stats from NFL.com:

2009 New England Patriots 16 16 83 1,264 15.2 71T 13
2008 New England Patriots 16 16 69 1,008 14.6 76T 11
2007 New England Patriots 16 16 98 1,493 15.2 65T 23

I hope this helps show that Moss went to NE in 2007 to catch 23 TDs.

What I see is Randy Moss and 47 TD catch's in only three seasons in New England; plus an average of > 1250 yards /season.

15 + avg. TD's / season = outstanding.

[woodbuck27]

WB

Just a few quick points.

You are right that we don't know the whole story, but I feel when you look at what we do know it is heavily weighted towards TT.

Favre is the one who went on TV to plead his case. What horrible facts did we learn as to how he had been so wronged? None. The Packers sent out a very thorough, very detailed timeline regarding what happened in regards to contact with Favre, scheduling a plane to announce his retirement, Favre calling back and saying forget it. Guess what? Favre couldn't deny or refute any of it. That right there tells me that there was a lot more truth in the organization's story then Favre's. Why would Favre have held anything back? He was already burning bridges as it was.

If Favre's main complaint was that TT wouldn't let him play GM, then then boo fuckin boo. That wasn't his job and he had no right to play GM.

Moreover, look at how Favre has acted since then. Retired from the Jets and then asked for his retirement "just because." Booked hotel rooms the weekend of Packers-Vikings game while still a member of the Jets.

When it comes down to a truth-telling contest between the Packers and Favre there is no question in my mind who I should believe. Favre hasn't given me reason to believe a single word that comes out of his mouth.

Woodbuck I am awaiting your reply.

Is it possible that some of you are a tad sensitive? Since when is there any loyality in Pro Sports in these times.

As I see it TT got what he wanted. Aaron Rodgers behind center and it's obvious Favre had to retire or otherwise go before that would be a very comfortable move for TT and Aaron Rodgers.

Darn it ! It's really as it ended up; a win-win for both TT and our team and for Brett Favre. Why are we kicking Favre?

a)He gave us alot to cheer for.

b)He's a first ballot HOFer.

c)He has set every major NFL passing record.

d)He still looks great playing in his 40's. He's smooth as a drink of Gibson's Finest. :D

e) His Iron Man record is amongst the most astonishing in all of sports.

f) He's arguably the most exciting player that ever played in the NFL. He's certainly one of the most exciting players to ever play the game.

g) He never says die. That man just keeps on ticking. He plays his butt off.

h) He's definitely one of the All Time Great NFLers.

i) He wants still to go to and win another Super Bowl. Isn't that 'the Spirit'?

No ... he's simply this to many Packer fans. THE ENEMY. He's also really good and really scary and he'd love nothing better than to lead the Vikings to two more wins over us this season.

That comes with the territory as I see it and maybe we have to just suck it up till he hangs em up or for some of you:

HATE HIM. :lol: HATE AWAY and see where that gets y'all.

GO PACK GO!

[Scott Campbell]

Favre looked tired according to Tony Dungy. It must have been that grueling training camp that Chilly The Ogre put him through.

[Scott Campbell]

HATE HIM. :lol: HATE AWAY and see where that gets y'all.




It sure worked out great tonight! :lol:

[gbgary]

Favre looked tired according to Tony Dungy...

a bit frustrated too. hehe

[Joemailman]

Favre looked tired according to Tony Dungy. It must have been that grueling training camp that Chilly The Ogre put him through.

I'm not sure about tired. He's immobile as hell, and doesn't seem in sync with his receivers. I wonder if he would have come back if he had known he wouldn't have Rice.

[retailguy]

Favre looked tired according to Tony Dungy. It must have been that grueling training camp that Chilly The Ogre put him through.

I'm not sure about tired. He's immobile as hell, and doesn't seem in sync with his receivers. I wonder if he would have come back if he had known he wouldn't have Rice.

I think he would have. No question in my mind.

[gex]

I thought he looked good overall (arm strength, mental awarness, dropbacks...)
There is work needed to be done with the timing between him and the receivers. I think that Camirillo will become his go to possesion guy after a few games (actually I hope cause I have him on a few ffl teams).
Wasn't a lot of hope of winning the season opener away in New Orleans, but they held their own.

[Bossman641]

Maybe the Vikings should sign some of the high school kids from Hattiesburg. They have better timing with Favre then anybody else on the team.

[Scott Campbell]

I thought he looked good overall .......................


:lol: :lol: :lol:


Good one gex. You had me there for a moment. I thought you were being seriousl

[CaptainKickass]

http://static.foxsports.com/content/fscom/img/2010/09/07/4_20100907200454_600_400.JPG

I had not seen this one yet and am mildly entertained by it. Thanks.

[CaptainKickass]

When exactly did Favre fall from grace?

I firmly believe it was very shortly after Big Irv died. Nobody with the balls to put in him in his place anymore.

[Gunakor]

HATE HIM. :lol: HATE AWAY and see where that gets y'all.

Where will supporting Favre get you that hating Favre will not?

Seriously, in the grand scheme of your own life, what's the difference?

[Tony Oday]

Chuck Norris Hates Favre :)

[Lurker64]

HATE HIM. :lol: HATE AWAY and see where that gets y'all.

Where will supporting Favre get you that hating Favre will not?

Seriously, in the grand scheme of your own life, what's the difference?

Hating Favre brings you joy when he fails, and sorrow when he succeeds. Supporting Favre brings you joy when he succeeds and joy when he fails. Hating Favre or Supporting Favre is just a wager on how well you think the Vikings are going to do this year.

I've hated every single Vikings quarterback since Denny Green was the coach, so far it's brought me a lot more joy than sorrow. I think hating NFL teams is a good bet, since odds are they'll either miss the playoffs or lose their last game.

[MichiganPackerFan]

As Aaron Rodgers continues to skyrocket, my frustration and interest in Favre dissipate. Clearly TT made the right choice to move on, regardless of all the break-up drama that transpired. A pair of regular season wins against FAvre and his Vikings and a playoff win if we meet will really help the healing.

And maybe watching that highlight real of the Saints beating the hell out of him in the NFC Championship game too!

[bobblehead]

There is work needed to be done with the timing between him and the receivers.

Isn't that why you have training camp?? Seriously, if you believe this, then you have to believe that missing TC probably cost the vikings this game. If they miss the playoffs by a game, or lose homefield by a game, etc, you would have to understand why MM was adamant about BF actually being a part of the team and going through off season activities.

For my part I hope they start out slow and miss the playoffs by.....that much....then I can taunt the favre fans even more by pointing out how his selfishness cost an entire organization a playoff berth.

[denverYooper]

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/102594989.html?elr=KArksUUUycaEacyU

[Freak Out]

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/102594989.html?elr=KArksUUUycaEacyU

The guy was missing his #1 WR and LORD HAVE PERCY was seeing double or some damn thing. That's what cost them the game....plus one of their CBs getting worked like a bitch early in the game.

[denverYooper]

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/102594989.html?elr=KArksUUUycaEacyU

The guy was missing his #1 WR and LORD HAVE PERCY was seeing double or some damn thing. That's what cost them the game....plus one of their CBs getting worked like a bitch early in the game.

Don't forget that Vilma was manhandling Shiancoe on all but 2 plays.

[Joemailman]

When exactly did Favre fall from grace?

http://blog.ticketchest.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/brett_favre_vikings.jpg

[pbmax]

I saw the Sporting News preseason interview with Rodgers in a waiting room a day ago, and unlike the online excerpt, there were a couple of questions about Favre and Thomspon.

Of note, Rodgers said the story of the near trade for Moss (for a 4th round pick before New England snatched him up) before 2007 was not true and that he knew what really happened. But he declined to say.

I can't wait to read the book about this era. I just hope Bedard doesn't write it.

[mraynrand]

I saw the Sporting News preseason interview with Rodgers in a waiting room a day ago, and unlike the online excerpt, there were a couple of questions about Favre and Thomspon.

Of note, Rodgers said the story of the near trade for Moss (for a 4th round pick before New England snatched him up) before 2007 was not true and that he knew what really happened. But he declined to say.

I can't wait to read the book about this era. I just hope Bedard doesn't write it.

http://i453.photobucket.com/albums/qq254/mraynrand/HisWay.jpg

[HowardRoark]

When exactly did Favre fall from grace?

http://blog.ticketchest.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/brett_favre_vikings.jpg

http://cache.deadspin.com/assets/images/deadspin/2008/07/brett1.jpg

[Scott Campbell]

When exactly did Favre fall from grace?


I think the tide turned most sharply when the Packers hired Ari.

[woodbuck27]

Favre looked tired according to Tony Dungy. It must have been that grueling training camp that Chilly The Ogre put him through.

Yup. Favre looked tired in the second half. Too many miscues on his offense and I mean in terms of WR routes will do that to an NFL QB. I'm referring specifically Percy Harvin and there was a throw for a long gainer that Bernard Berrian lost his concentration on and blew it. They have to get on the same page with their QB. The botttom line is that the Viking team's management has to get some help in to secure their investment in Brett Favre. Give him another weapon or two and look out Packer fans. This man is still very capable inspite of what he's done that's annoying to us in the past. He has to get in some sorta grooove and relax and just execute.

I cannot wait to see how well we do against this team in 2010-11. The big plus for us as I see it now is the schedule the Vikings must handle after their week four bye. It's going to be testy and could blow out their season?

When all is said and done. That game was very close and in my view rather dull with neither team looking very sharp. The Vikings 'D' was solid after the first Saints series for an early TD. There are questions in the Vikings secondary but the same goes for ours. The play of the Viking linebackers was impressive.

That was less than a one TD game Packer fans with the Vikings 'O' looking more than less unglued throughout that game Also we have to consider that the Saints are viable contenders for the Super Bowl again this season but realistically. As hard as that will be ' to repeat ' based on doing so and history in the NFL.

On the plus side Favre still moves well (he did have excellent protection fr. his OL) but for the most part he could stay in the pocket. His throws over the top to TE Visanthe Shiancoe, were outstanding but so is Shiancoe. As I viewed that matcup a sure target for Favre. He has to be seriously dealt with when we play the Vikings. I predict that Visanthe Shiancoe will be a Pro Bowler this season.

GO PACKERS!

[woodbuck27]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

[Scott Campbell]

I'd agree that Bert has the potential to be excellent again this year, because he certainly was last year. But it's not a given, and a falloff at his age could be very sudden and steep. I don't think he's nearly as evasive in the pocket anymore, and he couldn't have looked more immobile on the sack he took Thursday. But he started slow last year too, but got tuned up by about game 3. So I guess we'll see.

Good posts Woody.

[Scott Campbell]

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/102305684.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_term=packers


Great article Vince. I borrowed this from the other thread because I'm pretty sure none of what happened to him in 08 was by accident. He got punked by a spiteful Favre.

[woodbuck27]

There is work needed to be done with the timing between him and the receivers.

Isn't that why you have training camp?? Seriously, if you believe this, then you have to believe that missing TC probably cost the vikings this game. If they miss the playoffs by a game, or lose homefield by a game, etc, you would have to understand why MM was adamant about BF actually being a part of the team and going through off season activities.

For my part I hope they start out slow and miss the playoffs by.....that much....then I can taunt the favre fans even more by pointing out how his selfishness cost an entire organization a playoff berth.

What!? Are you saying above that that Vikings loss by less than a TD was on Brett Favre? That loss could mostle be attributed to execution of WR routes enabling Favre to get the ball realistically into the hands of his receivers.

Percy Harvin didn't have a good game . Bernard Berrian didn't have a good game. If they played better then the Vikings win that game. All other things the same.

I analylized that game as best I could and had the Saints over the Vikings by at least a TD but not two. I concluded that the Vikings appeared weak at WR and Favre would have one primary weapon to toss to. His TE Visanthe Shiancoe. In fact my analysis was pretty accurate.

Favre looked fine. In the second half he ran out of gas. Too many miscues on behalf of receivers will wear an NFL QB out. Favre didn't have the deep threat go to guy either. If the Vikings management goes out soon and gets that man. Look out! Many of you underestimate Brett Favre. He's a lights out QB with some decent weapons. He's usually going to win with almost anyting decent if they get on the same page as he is.

A QB throws to spots and WRE's have to follow the correct route to make the hook-up. That was certainly not the case and that hurt the Vikings offense.

It wasn't on Brett Favre. Brett Favre cannot be blamed for that Vikings loss. Please get real. Please.... get your blinders off bobblehead. Please be fair and objective. Hint: That will make your ability to grow as an NFL fan more complete.

Enjoy 'the game' as well as your need for prejudice and senseless hatred. JUsat hope that the Vikings brass are slow or neglectful of their obvious needs for a star WR to provide the encouragement and realistic deeep threat Favre needs to bust open games in the Vikings favor. Also please realize that Rome wasn't built in a dayv and neither is an NFL offense that may be a man or two away from pure domination over the rest of the NFL. The Vikings have such potential and Favre 'of course' knows that and will push to get help.

In my final analysis. Favre played overall pretty well. He did get tired in the second half but why? Was it conditioning or maybe just frustration? He's a throughbred and that means he needs attention to detail.

Don't you want to see us defeat the Vikings at their best not in a weakened state? That case reflect the TRUE strength of our team and the promise we deserve as Packer fans.

A Super Bowl Victory.

GO PACK GO!

[Tony Oday]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!

[Scott Campbell]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!


I'm confused.

I thought Favre's mere presence was supposed to make everyone around him better.

[Tony Oday]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!


I'm confused.

I thought Favre's mere presence was supposed to make everyone around him better.

No there is more to practice than actually playing. They would be around looking at film and getting on the right page.

[woodbuck27]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!

Your hot against Favre. OK Your ' a BIG TIME ' Packer fan that see's ' all Green and Gold '. Good for YOU Tony Oday. :D

I respect your opinion but I saw what I saw Packer fan. Then there is this to back that up as I watched the play and we see the final stat's:

Favre falls 66 yards short of Drew Brees results in passing yards:

1. D. Brees NO 237 yds Final

2. B. Favre MIN 171 yds Final

Then I re-call the Percy Harvin miscue's on his routes and that 'almost catch' on the RH hash marks by Bernard Berrian that would have set up a possible score. We know how well Brett Favre did last season ' in the Red Zone '. Doesn't he look for his TE Visanthe Shiancoe, again? That man is effective and Brett Favre and he will hook up alot in 2010-11. Given that both remain healthy and on the same page.

Brett Favre always knew what to do with his favourite GO-TO WR's. We just must hope it takes awhile for their timing to come and the Vikings management stalls getting Favre the help he certainly appears to need at this time.

GO PACK GO!

[Tony Oday]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!

Your hot against Favre. OK Your ' a BIG TIME ' Packer fan that see's ' all Green and Gold '. Good for YOU Tony Oday. :D

I respect your opinion but I saw what I saw Packer fan. Then there is this to back that up as I watched the play and we see the final stat's:

Favre falls 66 yards short of Drew Brees results in passing yards:

1. D. Brees NO 237 yds Final

2. B. Favre MIN 171 yds Final

Then I re-call the Percy Harvin miscue's on his routes and that 'almost catch' on the RH hash marks by Bernard Berrian that would have set up a possible score. We know how well Brett Favre did last season ' in the Red Zone '. Doesn't he look for his TE Visanthe Shiancoe, again? That man is effective and Brett Favre and he will hook up alot in 2010-11. Given that both remain healthy and on the same page.

Brett Favre always knew what to do with his favourite GO-TO WR's. We just must hope it takes awhile for their timing to come and the Vikings management stalls getting Favre the help he certainly appears to need at this time.

GO PACK GO!

But brINT makes his WR they dont make him!

Favre said himself it was his fault and the score was not as close as it should be since Hartley missed TWO easy FGs and Meacham dropped a TD.

[woodbuck27]

Viking’s focus turns to division rival

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-fridayofferings091010

GO PACKERS GO in 2010-11. It's OUR season in the NFCN Packer fans. :D

[MichiganPackerFan]

Woody, how many words per minute can you type?

[Scott Campbell]

I respect your opinion but I saw what I saw Packer fan. Then there is this to back that up as I watched the play and we see the final stat's:

Favre falls 66 yards short of Drew Brees results in passing yards:

1. D. Brees NO 237 yds Final

2. B. Favre MIN 171 yds Final


Don't the final stats usually include INT's?



What the hell Woody. Favre had a bad game. So what. He'll bounce back.

[woodbuck27]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!

Your hot against Favre. OK Your ' a BIG TIME ' Packer fan that see's ' all Green and Gold '. Good for YOU Tony Oday. :D

I respect your opinion but I saw what I saw Packer fan. Then there is this to back that up as I watched the play and we see the final stat's:

Favre falls 66 yards short of Drew Brees results in passing yards:

1. D. Brees NO 237 yds Final

2. B. Favre MIN 171 yds Final

Then I re-call the Percy Harvin miscue's on his routes and that 'almost catch' on the RH hash marks by Bernard Berrian that would have set up a possible score. We know how well Brett Favre did last season ' in the Red Zone '. Doesn't he look for his TE Visanthe Shiancoe, again? That man is effective and Brett Favre and he will hook up alot in 2010-11. Given that both remain healthy and on the same page.

Brett Favre always knew what to do with his favourite GO-TO WR's. We just must hope it takes awhile for their timing to come and the Vikings management stalls getting Favre the help he certainly appears to need at this time.

GO PACK GO!

But brINT makes his WR they dont make him!

Favre said himself it was his fault and the score was not as close as it should be since Hartley missed TWO easy FGs and Meacham dropped a TD.

OK I'll give. So when it all evens out the defending Super Bowl Champion wins by a TD at home over a team (the Vikings) that is presently in disarray on offense. I personally predicted a similiar result but felt the score would be higher for both teams given that they had the two best 'O's in the league last season. although I went with some emotion and placed 4 CP's on the Vikings because of all the hype A. Peterson brought to that match-up and contradictory to what we actually saw. I had some reservations over how effective the Vikings OL would be.

That OL looked horrible at seasons end last year. Favre was hung out to dry in that NFCN Championship Game. 18 hits and no sacks. . .wow !

That was painful to watch.

Some here just loved to see that hurt layed on Favre. I've only seen one man get more beat up. Heavy weight boxer Floyd Patterson in the Sonny Liston match's back in the early 1960's.

Few serious NFL fans could be realistically surprized at the result of that Thursday night game. If anything Brees had 'a light game' stat's wise, based on his ability and past performances. Favre needs support at WR. Thus the score was lower than we may have thought.

GO PACKERS!

[Scott Campbell]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!

Your hot against Favre. OK Your ' a BIG TIME ' Packer fan that see's ' all Green and Gold '. Good for YOU Tony Oday. :D

I respect your opinion but I saw what I saw Packer fan. Then there is this to back that up as I watched the play and we see the final stat's:

Favre falls 66 yards short of Drew Brees results in passing yards:

1. D. Brees NO 237 yds Final

2. B. Favre MIN 171 yds Final

Then I re-call the Percy Harvin miscue's on his routes and that 'almost catch' on the RH hash marks by Bernard Berrian that would have set up a possible score. We know how well Brett Favre did last season ' in the Red Zone '. Doesn't he look for his TE Visanthe Shiancoe, again? That man is effective and Brett Favre and he will hook up alot in 2010-11. Given that both remain healthy and on the same page.

Brett Favre always knew what to do with his favourite GO-TO WR's. We just must hope it takes awhile for their timing to come and the Vikings management stalls getting Favre the help he certainly appears to need at this time.

GO PACK GO!

But brINT makes his WR they dont make him!

Favre said himself it was his fault and the score was not as close as it should be since Hartley missed TWO easy FGs and Meacham dropped a TD.

OK I'll give. So when it all evens out the defending Super Bowl Champion wins by a TD at home over a team (the Vikings) that is presently in disarray on offense. I personally predicted a similiar result but felt the score would be higher for both teams given that they had the two best 'O's in the league last season. although I went with some emotion and placed 4 CP's on the Vikings because of all the hype A. Peterson brought to that match-up and contradictory to what we actually saw. I had some reservations over how effective the Vikings OL would be.

That OL looked horrible at seasons end last year. Favre was hung out to dry in that NFCN Championship Game. 18 hits and no sacks. . .wow !

That was painful to watch.

Some here just loved to see that hurt layed on Favre. I've only seen one man get more beat up. Heavy weight boxer Floyd Patterson in the Sonny Liston match's back in the early 1960's.

Few serious NFL fans could be realistically surprized at the result of that Thursday night game. If anything Brees had 'a light game' stat's wise, based on his ability and past performances. Favre needs support at WR. Thus the score was lower than we may have thought.

GO PACKERS!



Favre took 2 games last season to shake off the rust after missing camp. I wouldn't worry this year unless he's still looking ragged at the end of this month.

[Tony Oday]

Actually the Vikes would have won if AP got the damn ball in the 4th. Favre was off and there is no way he repeats last years stats. They NEED help at WR...Rice even when he comes back it was a hip injury how good will he actually be? They have 2 number 2 WRs a 3 and a guy that should be out of the NFL.

[woodbuck27]

I respect your opinion but I saw what I saw Packer fan. Then there is this to back that up as I watched the play and we see the final stat's:

Favre falls 66 yards short of Drew Brees results in passing yards:

1. D. Brees NO 237 yds Final

2. B. Favre MIN 171 yds Final


Don't the final stats usually include INT's?



What the hell Woody. Favre had a bad game. So what. He'll bounce back.

Hey Scott his pick was one of his sick stupid ass plays. That is only ' a part of ' his genious exposed. I was certainly pissed at that stupid shovel pass. I immediately had to go outside to get some fresh air after that dumb pass. Yes he annoy's me too. It's not all .. "Geee Brett your wonderful."

but ... what else did we see, or what did I see Scott?

He makes those outstanding over the top toss's to his TE. One for a long gainer and then the exciting go ahead TD pass. I give equal credit to V. Shiancoe and we have to cover him very well when we play the Vikings as he's lights good.

So we see the full extent of Favre's realm of ability / talent still in tact aat nearly 41 years of age. He's still impressive and very competitive with alot of ' piss and vinegar' left in him.

He's awesome and he sometimes sucks. I love him and he piss's me off but I love him. He's HUMAN Scott like YOU and I man. Yet ' his human ' will always be described overall and remembered by NFL fans and hitorians as GREATNESS.

We will never enjoy another NFLmQB like Favre.

YES !!!

Yes. I am one of Favre's greatest fans Scott. Damn proud of that too. He's given me alot and a Packer, NFL fan and hobbiest.

Long LIVE Brett Favre's name and status. :D

after all that.....

GO PACK GO!

[Scott Campbell]

I think there are a growing number of people beginning to believe that Rodgers could end up being better - even as hard as that is to fathom.

[woodbuck27]

Woody, how many words per minute can you type?

ahhh .... with both ... of ... my ... two fingers???

Come on over to Vermont and time me. :lol:

Yeaaaa Packers! Get errrr done in 2010-11.

[falco]

Hey Scott his pick was one of his sick stupid ass plays. That is only ' a part of ' his genious exposed. I was certainly pissed at that stupid shovel pass. I immediately had to go outside to get some fresh air after that dumb pass. Yes he annoyas me too. It's not all .. "Geee Brett your wonderful."


I think there are a growing number of people beginning to believe that Rodgers could end up being better - even as hard as that is to fathom.

Yup. :wink:

[Patler]

I think there are a growing number of people beginning to believe that Rodgers could end up being better - even as hard as that is to fathom.

First, he needs to quit missing open receivers with a playoff game on the line! :x

[woodbuck27]

I'd agree that Bert has the potential to be excellent again this year, because he certainly was last year. But it's not a given, and a falloff at his age could be very sudden and steep. I don't think he's nearly as evasive in the pocket anymore, and he couldn't have looked more immobile on the sack he took Thursday. But he started slow last year too, but got tuned up by about game 3. So I guess we'll see.

Good posts Woody.

Yea Scott ! Some good coffee this morning. Special beans. :lol:

[Pugger]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

What, exactly, am I making a poor judgement on? That the 'divorce' wasn't Favre's fault in the least? That I find it puzzling that a Packer fan would want the QB of a divisional rival to have success at the expense of the Packers? As long as Favre is QBing MN and winning that is detrimental to the Packers' fortunes, just like if Cutler or Stafford have success.

[Pugger]

NO NO NO! Favre is bailed out by the announcers again. You have NO idea if they ran the wrong routes, in my opinion Bert was throwing the ball to the wrong place. The reason for the opinion is that the receiving corp, save Camarillo, was actually in camp this year for ATLEAST the study of the plays where as brINT was a selfish player who thinks he is above being a team player.

This jack ass Viqueens player I hope will be terrible this year ala Ray Rhodes year in GB. When the prima donna finally quits because he cant do it anymore he will get at least me back as a fan...jack ass queens QB!!!

Exactly. TC is for the QB and his receivers to get on the same page. #4 would rather not be bothered and knows Chilly and company will let him skip all that mondane offseason stuff. How come MN's passing game didn't have these problems when Jackson played in those preseason games this summer?

[woodbuck27]

Sorry fella's the entertainment committee has to leave the building.

Joyce and I are off to brunch.

That game with Philly should be a douusey. :D We need that one really bad to get a jump on the Vikings. Therre will be some big upsets today.

Houston gets by Indy that uncharacteristically stumbles out of the gate after a Super Bowl hangover ... still. Don't pat P. Manning too much! :D

Carolina over the Giants on the road makes ' that Irish Tommy ' pull out the remaining hair in his head.

Dallas gets all they can handle from Shanahan and from a QB that can put up some points and loses in Washington.

[mraynrand]

In his post-game presser Favre said he missed on about 4 throws. Not my evaluation, but Favre's.

My evaluation is that he missed on at least two passes that I saw. Favre could be completely truthful or partially truthful and protecting his receivers. I think the latter is likely the case. Favre doesn't throw teammates under the bus.

[Scott Campbell]

I think there are a growing number of people beginning to believe that Rodgers could end up being better - even as hard as that is to fathom.

First, he needs to quit missing open receivers with a playoff game on the line! :x


Yup.

And he needs the hardware that accompanies being truly great.

[mraynrand]

I think there are a growing number of people beginning to believe that Rodgers could end up being better - even as hard as that is to fathom.

First, he needs to quit missing open receivers with a playoff game on the line! :x


Yup.

And he needs the hardware that accompanies being truly great.



http://www.freakingnews.com/pictures/38000/Brett-Favre-Rock-Star--38411.jpg

[Scott Campbell]

That's bling - not hardware.

[mraynrand]

That's bling - not hardware.

Don't get technical with me.

[woodbuck27]

Actually the Vikes would have won if AP got the damn ball in the 4th. Favre was off and there is no way he repeats last years stats. They NEED help at WR...Rice even when he comes back it was a hip injury how good will he actually be? They have 2 number 2 WRs a 3 and a guy that should be out of the NFL.

You can bet that Childress is spinning over his need of something of quality at WR. That he has to protect Favre 's contract and justify having him back. We will see some action in that direction very soon.

I agree with your comments on S. Rice. The Vikings are in trouble at that position and must act ASAP or it will be a long tough season and too much wear and tear on AP. Their early season schedule calls for action yesterda and more than Ruvelle Martin is required to better shore up the WR position. Why? they made so many late TC cuts at WR is beyond any sensible reason given Sydney Rice's status.

The Vikings cannot allow us to get too far out in front and right now we are the team to beat in the NFCN inspite of that close win yesterday over 'the Eagles'.

Boy! We nearly allowed that one to slip away. :D

GO Packers.

I'll throw this down here for what it's worth on the logic of generally looking at FA'a for many positions, not just as the Vikings have need for more depth at WR:

http://blog.vikings.com/2010/09/13/vikings-to-look-at-wrs/

GO PACK GO!

[woodbuck27]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

What, exactly, am I making a poor judgement on? That the 'divorce' wasn't Favre's fault in the least? That I find it puzzling that a Packer fan would want the QB of a divisional rival to have success at the expense of the Packers? As long as Favre is QBing MN and winning that is detrimental to the Packers' fortunes, just like if Cutler or Stafford have success.

Hey your entitled to your feelings just as I am mine Packer fan. WE live in a democrascy. :D

If we all agreed here it wouldn't be half as interesting. The thing is to disagree without undo attack and ridicule. To post as gentleman and keep this Packer home as healthy as it deserves to be. It does get out of hand at times but only the extreme haters/abusive types have suffered expulsion from this place on a permanant basis.

Everyone that has been suspended from here has even had a second and sometimes more than that chance to clean up. WE cannot afford to let Packerrats down. Disagreeing isn't abnormal. Attacking one another subjectively and unfairly is lousy behaviour and from that sort of behaviour everyone suffers.

WE need to promote an environment at Packerrats that will somehow encourage some of the quality posters we lost to consider returning and realize this is 'as a bottom line' OUR Packer home.

I will never be anything than what I've been for 51 years. A Green Bay Packer fan. If there are posters here that imagine I'm for the Vikings now. They're sadly disallutioned. That's too funny. :D

I'm a Packer fan. I will die a Packer fan.

GO PACK GO!

[Sparkey]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

What, exactly, am I making a poor judgement on? That the 'divorce' wasn't Favre's fault in the least? That I find it puzzling that a Packer fan would want the QB of a divisional rival to have success at the expense of the Packers? As long as Favre is QBing MN and winning that is detrimental to the Packers' fortunes, just like if Cutler or Stafford have success.

Hey your entitled to your feelings just as I am mine Packer fan. WE live in a democrascy. :D

If we all agreed here it wouldn't be half as interesting. The thing is to disagree without undo attack and ridicule. To post as gentleman and keep this Packer home as healthy as it deserves to be. It does get out of hand at times but only the extreme haters/abusive types have suffered expulsion from this place on a permanant basis.

Everyone that has been suspended from here has even had a second and sometimes more than that chance to clean up. WE cannot afford to let Packerrats down. Disagreeing isn't abnormal. Attacking one another subjectively and unfairly is lousy behaviour and from that sort of behaviour everyone suffers.

WE need to promote an environment at Packerrats that will somehow encourage some of the quality posters we lost to consider returning and realize this is 'as a bottom line' OUR Packer home.

I will never be anything than what I've been for 51 years. A Green Bay Packer fan. If there are posters here that imagine I'm for the Vikings now. They're sadly disallutioned. That's too funny. :D

I'm a Packer fan. I will die a Packer fan.

GO PACK GO!

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.

[Fritz]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

What, exactly, am I making a poor judgement on? That the 'divorce' wasn't Favre's fault in the least? That I find it puzzling that a Packer fan would want the QB of a divisional rival to have success at the expense of the Packers? As long as Favre is QBing MN and winning that is detrimental to the Packers' fortunes, just like if Cutler or Stafford have success.

Hey your entitled to your feelings just as I am mine Packer fan. WE live in a democrascy. :D

If we all agreed here it wouldn't be half as interesting. The thing is to disagree without undo attack and ridicule. To post as gentleman and keep this Packer home as healthy as it deserves to be. It does get out of hand at times but only the extreme haters/abusive types have suffered expulsion from this place on a permanant basis.

Everyone that has been suspended from here has even had a second and sometimes more than that chance to clean up. WE cannot afford to let Packerrats down. Disagreeing isn't abnormal. Attacking one another subjectively and unfairly is lousy behaviour and from that sort of behaviour everyone suffers.

WE need to promote an environment at Packerrats that will somehow encourage some of the quality posters we lost to consider returning and realize this is 'as a bottom line' OUR Packer home.

I will never be anything than what I've been for 51 years. A Green Bay Packer fan. If there are posters here that imagine I'm for the Vikings now. They're sadly disallutioned. That's too funny. :D

I'm a Packer fan. I will die a Packer fan.

GO PACK GO!

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.

Which, I believe, gives us the right to be rude and crude and obnoxious to other human beings. Don't tread on my right to be an ass___, baby!

[woodbuck27]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

What, exactly, am I making a poor judgement on? That the 'divorce' wasn't Favre's fault in the least? That I find it puzzling that a Packer fan would want the QB of a divisional rival to have success at the expense of the Packers? As long as Favre is QBing MN and winning that is detrimental to the Packers' fortunes, just like if Cutler or Stafford have success.

Hey your entitled to your feelings just as I am mine Packer fan. WE live in a democrascy. :D

If we all agreed here it wouldn't be half as interesting. The thing is to disagree without undo attack and ridicule. To post as gentleman and keep this Packer home as healthy as it deserves to be. It does get out of hand at times but only the extreme haters/abusive types have suffered expulsion from this place on a permanant basis.

Everyone that has been suspended from here has even had a second and sometimes more than that chance to clean up. WE cannot afford to let Packerrats down. Disagreeing isn't abnormal. Attacking one another subjectively and unfairly is lousy behaviour and from that sort of behaviour everyone suffers.

WE need to promote an environment at Packerrats that will somehow encourage some of the quality posters we lost to consider returning and realize this is 'as a bottom line' OUR Packer home.

I will never be anything than what I've been for 51 years. A Green Bay Packer fan. If there are posters here that imagine I'm for the Vikings now. They're sadly disallutioned. That's too funny. :D

I'm a Packer fan. I will die a Packer fan.

GO PACK GO!

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.

Which, I believe, gives us the right to be rude and crude and obnoxious to other human beings. Don't tread on my right to be an ass___, baby!

Hey! We can't all be 'the nice guy' on this forum. :D

GO PACK GO !

[Sparkey]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

What, exactly, am I making a poor judgement on? That the 'divorce' wasn't Favre's fault in the least? That I find it puzzling that a Packer fan would want the QB of a divisional rival to have success at the expense of the Packers? As long as Favre is QBing MN and winning that is detrimental to the Packers' fortunes, just like if Cutler or Stafford have success.

Hey your entitled to your feelings just as I am mine Packer fan. WE live in a democrascy. :D

If we all agreed here it wouldn't be half as interesting. The thing is to disagree without undo attack and ridicule. To post as gentleman and keep this Packer home as healthy as it deserves to be. It does get out of hand at times but only the extreme haters/abusive types have suffered expulsion from this place on a permanant basis.

Everyone that has been suspended from here has even had a second and sometimes more than that chance to clean up. WE cannot afford to let Packerrats down. Disagreeing isn't abnormal. Attacking one another subjectively and unfairly is lousy behaviour and from that sort of behaviour everyone suffers.

WE need to promote an environment at Packerrats that will somehow encourage some of the quality posters we lost to consider returning and realize this is 'as a bottom line' OUR Packer home.

I will never be anything than what I've been for 51 years. A Green Bay Packer fan. If there are posters here that imagine I'm for the Vikings now. They're sadly disallutioned. That's too funny. :D

I'm a Packer fan. I will die a Packer fan.

GO PACK GO!

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.

Which, I believe, gives us the right to be rude and crude and obnoxious to other human beings. Don't tread on my right to be an ass___, baby!

LOL, that also means the Admin, as the sovereign power, has the right to ban your ass. :lol:

[Fritz]

I guess I don't understand how Pack fans can still be bitter about Favre when we're blessed with the QB we have now...who's first 3 years as a starter in the NFL are uncomparable. Maybe it's just me.

I don't think most Packer fans are still bitter about Favre but we find it incredible that some Packer fans still cheer for a QB that is playing on a divisional rival that stands in the way for the Packers to win the division and that some of them blame the 'divorce' soley on TT and Packers' management. Most Packer fans feel there is enough blame to go around.

You may be making a bad judgement or poor one at best there Packer fan.

I cannot write as I speak ' about all Packer fans ' that will remain loyal to Brett Favre the NFL QB; and are pleased that he could extend his career as he has, inspite of the pressure from our management etc. to retire.

I write (speak ) for me. I like Brett Favre and will always take pleasure in seeing him perform, when he does so at a high level. I enjoy watching the style he uses in getting his team wins. I still see his outstanding skills come forward and really know he can play lights out at his position and take any team downtown. Favre is a fierce competitor and certainly stands in the way of out team advancing from the season we enjoyed last year.

That's just all a given. This is Brett Favre. We have to play the Vikings twice and defeat them at least once. That won't be an easy task Packer fans if they get their 'O' set. We don't want to see Favre get anymore weapons or he'll cause our team alot of headache.

I see the Vikings having trouble with their first half schedule, and ' the fact ' that it may take the next two games for them to get their 'O' anywhere close to what it needs to be. Then they have a bye week and after that more than enogh challenge, with a brutal schedule to deal with, playing playoff teams from last season.

I see us taking advantage of the Vikings questionable 'at best' off season and winning the NFCN. I see the Vikings facing adversity with a call to reason, given Favre's contract and service in likely his final season. I believe his decision to come back this year was very difficult. He needed more on 'O' and well...has less at this point. Yet the Vikings 'D' looks excellent. Questions with their secondary prevail.

Packer fans. It shouldn't be Aaron Rodgers Vs Brett Favre but more reasonably the Packers Vs the Vikings over the course of 16 games. With just that view I believe we will do very well.

WE have to win today in Philly and that's a nice test on the road. I cannot wait for that game to see what we have overall as a team. I'll be specifically watching our running game Vs receiving game for balance on 'O' and our play at LBer and in the secondary on 'D'.

In matchups us Vs the Vikings. I look at it this way. I believe that the best team will win. It's simply this. It is what it is. It's just a contest for us to see how well our GM and coach's have prepared OUR team to compete and excell.

I don't pull for BrettFavre to beat the crap out of his Ex team. That's just silly to go there. I want to see the very best from our team and for that to shine over any opponent. The Vikings are a major opponent.

I want to see the Packers handle the Vikings 2X this season; to make the playoff's and advance to the Super Bowl. Has our GM done his very best to better ensure that great hope?

WE will soon see what our real prospects are and how our GM reacts accordingly.

GO PACK GO!

What, exactly, am I making a poor judgement on? That the 'divorce' wasn't Favre's fault in the least? That I find it puzzling that a Packer fan would want the QB of a divisional rival to have success at the expense of the Packers? As long as Favre is QBing MN and winning that is detrimental to the Packers' fortunes, just like if Cutler or Stafford have success.

Hey your entitled to your feelings just as I am mine Packer fan. WE live in a democrascy. :D

If we all agreed here it wouldn't be half as interesting. The thing is to disagree without undo attack and ridicule. To post as gentleman and keep this Packer home as healthy as it deserves to be. It does get out of hand at times but only the extreme haters/abusive types have suffered expulsion from this place on a permanant basis.

Everyone that has been suspended from here has even had a second and sometimes more than that chance to clean up. WE cannot afford to let Packerrats down. Disagreeing isn't abnormal. Attacking one another subjectively and unfairly is lousy behaviour and from that sort of behaviour everyone suffers.

WE need to promote an environment at Packerrats that will somehow encourage some of the quality posters we lost to consider returning and realize this is 'as a bottom line' OUR Packer home.

I will never be anything than what I've been for 51 years. A Green Bay Packer fan. If there are posters here that imagine I'm for the Vikings now. They're sadly disallutioned. That's too funny. :D

I'm a Packer fan. I will die a Packer fan.

GO PACK GO!

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.

Which, I believe, gives us the right to be rude and crude and obnoxious to other human beings. Don't tread on my right to be an ass___, baby!

LOL, that also means the Admin, as the sovereign power, has the right to ban your ass. :lol:

If he's the sovereign then we're not in a republic here. Uh oh.

[woodbuck27]

" You can bet that Childress is spinning over his need of something of quality at WR. That he has to protect Favre 's contract and justify having him back. We will see some action in that direction very soon. " woodbuck27


Here is a look at the four wide receivers, as reported in the www.startribune.com that ' the Vikings ' were planning to take a look at today:

■ Sam Aiken: Spent his first five seasons with the Buffalo Bills (2003-07) before playing in 14 games and catching 28 passes the past two years with New England. Aiken, a fourth-round pick of the Bills out of North Carolina in 2003, is listed at 6-2, 220 pounds and is 29 years old. He is a very good special teams player. The Patriots let him go in the final cutdown to the 53-man roster this month.

■ Reggie Brown: Much like Greg Lewis, this is another guy with whom Brad Childress is familiar with from his time as offensive coordinator in Philadelphia. Brown, 6-1, 197 pounds, is 29 years old and played for the Eagles from 2005 to 2009, catching 177 pass for 2,574 yards and 17 touchdowns. He started 40 games in his first three seasons but lost that job early in 2008 and started only five after that. The Eagles traded Brown to the Buccaneers in the offseason for a sixth-round draft pick in 2011, but Tampa Bay waived him last Monday. Brown had four receptions for 57 yards in the preseason.

■ Ruvell Martin: Played for the Packers from 2006 to 2008, before spending last season with the Rams and then going to training camp with the Seahawks this year. The 28-year-old Martin, 6-4, 220 pounds, played two seasons with Favre in Green Bay and caught a career-high 21 passes for 358 yards with one touchdown as a rookie in 2006. Martin was let go in the Seahawks' final cuts. Martin had two touchdown catches in the Packers' 34-0 victory over the Vikings on Nov. 10, 2007.

■ Demetrius Williams: The 6-2, 202-pound Williams had 63 receptions for 1,008 yards and four touchdowns in four seasons with the Ravens. Williams, 27, was another guy let go in his team's final cuts. Williams, drafted in the fourth round of the 2006 draft by Baltimore, had issues with injuries while playing for the Ravens and this summer a sprained ankle slowed him.

There is also some interest in acquiring holdout WR Vincent Jackson of 'the Bolts'; but that's not without a lot of concerns and conditions that have to be met as it now appears to stand.

GO PACKERS!

[pbmax]

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.
Do you have a definition handy for pedantic? :D

[retailguy]

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.
Do you have a definition handy for pedantic? :D

Look, I don't want to split hairs here, but technically Woody is correct. He's Canadian, and they have a Parliamentary Democracy, and a Constitutional Monarchy.

We, in the states, have what remains of a representative republic, just don't tell Wist, because it'll lead to a 20 minute dissertation on the evils of the Federal Reserve.

Those Canadians do it differently. :D

[woodbuck27]

" Those Canadians do it differently. " :D retailguy

We do!? :shock: I thought we did it basically the same way as in any nation/country etc. and foremost prudence with planned parenting as a first insight.

GO PACK GO!

[woodbuck27]

Vikings owner Zygi Wilf: 'We're all in'

http://www.startribune.com/blogs/56735627.html

Hit the LINK for the entire story.

"We've built a team that we expect to go all the way," he said. "We're not holding back right now. We're in it for the whole match." Zygi Wilf

Asked about his sense of urgency after getting Brett Favre back for one more season, Wilf said: "We've built our team to be at this point. We feel that we're all in. We're going to try our best to fulfill our goal. So we're all in."

Wilf said at the start of training camp that Favre was the team's quarterback, even before Favre announced he was returning. Wilf was asked if he ever became nervous as the waiting game continued.

"I certainly had a lot of confidence that he would be back," Wilf said. "But I knew that his feeling was genuine, that he was thinking deep and hard about it. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and waited and hoped that he would make the decision to come, as he did. That's why I'm optimistic that we'll do very well this year."

Man. Lots of pressure there on Brett Favre. It seems like Zygi Wilf will provide for the Vikings as best he's able to and justify Favre and his $ 3 Million dollar increase to $ 16 Million dollars total, not including deferments/incentives etc.

This is the team we have to leap over to win the NFCN Championship.

I'm keeping a close watch over the Vikings until we get some distance between ourselves and them. I'm presently interested and watching ' the Vikings ' wheel and deal and move forward in terms of whatever adversity that already exists or that crops up in this new season.

GO PACK GO!

[RashanGary]

This is the team we have to leap over to win the NFCN Championship.




Actually, it's a 15 game season, we're up by one and it's on them to jump us. This is 2010, Woodbuck. You're living in the past.

[Patler]

This is the team we have to leap over to win the NFCN Championship.




Actually, it's a 15 game season, we're up by one and it's on them to jump us. This is 2010, Woodbuck. You're living in the past.

...and looking through my green and gold crystal ball, I see two Packer victories over the Vikings this year, which means the Vikings will have to make up four games in 13, since the tie breaker will go to the Packers! :D

[woodbuck27]

" Actually, it's a 15 game season, we're up by one and it's on them to jump us. This is 2010, Woodbuck. You're living in the past.
This is what I'm seeing this season RE: OUR arch nemesis Vikings. " Justin Harrell

Am I? I don't think so Justin Harrell. I'm too much the realist. You fella's on this forum just never seem to get that. I pay close attention to the NFL scene and I've proven ' that fact ' over and over, since I began posting with the old crew of Packer fans going back to the history beginning in 2005.

Before I saw your post. I was working this post up Justin Harrell:

Instead ' of hating Brett Favre and his team. Why not look at ' the Vikings ' prognosis for success in 2010-11? I have and see it as follows:

I believe that their not anywhere as strong as they were last season. Sure they got a one year older Brett Favre back but their far and removed from the team that went to the NFC Championship game and should have won that and a berth in the Super Bowl last year.

Brett Favre is no dummy. He knows that his team didn't have the off season it needed to get back to being as competitive as they were in 2009-10. Still key members of that team ( R.Longwell, S.Hutchinson and Jared Allen) visited Favre and went with ' why pack the season in and just maybe with Favre tact and somehow that reached Brett Favre, in spite of all his better instincts, and a likely gut feeling that their time was last year, and they blew that? It was that '12 man on the field 'in the huddle' penalty' in the NFC Championship game that screwed that team folks. That was the Vikings equivalent to OUR ... 4th and 26 abomination.

:x before reality and getting really ill. BaaAAARRFFF !! :roll:

The Vikings lost alot in Chester Taylor and lots more in terms of ' depth and personnel '. Did they fill? I didn't nor don't see it, and I'm positive neither does Brett Favre.

So we have learned that Brett Favre has stated. That that this will be his 20th season and final kick at the can. This will be Favre's Swan Song Packer fans. Your last year to hate him for those of you that applies to.

Mark that down as 'a fact of our lives' as NFL fans'.

The TRUTH:

This will be the end of our days watching this fine competitor and Ex Packer great play in the NFL. I for one will relish every moment he shows his still great competitive spirit, but this won't be as great a season as we saw last. He doesn't have enough on 'O' to work with and due to adversity can their OL hold up? Not very likely. That's what scares me as I don't want to see him get seriously injured after the legasy he's delivered to date as an NFL QB and Iron Man of awesome and next to impossible to believe distinction.

Now that Viking 'D' may step it up and reduce the pressure on their 'O'; but that's alot to expect.

The Vikings had a poor off season. They do have a strong starting cast but what of their depth and versatility. Sure most of the NFL teams are in the same soup but are the Vikings a real competitor for a Super Bowl berth coming off last season's success?

I think not and then add this: The ' coup de gras'. When WR Sydney Rice went down and he will give his all but likely won't recover enough to make an impact. Even if he does. The Vikings schedule early this season can be summed up with these words of prognostication ... ' Really rough start as the schedule eats Em' up ' and ' Vikings lose again - too late to recover. The olive branch lost ' .

The early seaon Vikings schedule is brutal and IMO may well play with ' the chorus '. La la la ... Adversity takes it's toll; the oposite of ' a roll '. On a field with equal opponents. Two teams get rattled. The nature, ' of extreme battle '.

In my view. The Vikings are cooked Packer fans. They won't win the NFCN. They will be very fortunate to make the playoffs. Of course, their owner Zygi Wilf may ' walk his talk '; get really busy and sincerely try to plug the holes we know they have now. The rest of the NFL is very aware of what they need and it must come at some cost. It won't be like a present from Santa. :D

It's really this in 2010-11 and next season as well.

PACKERS!

The only ? is how far will we go?

[mraynrand]

...and looking through my green and gold crystal ball, I see two Packer victories over the Vikings this year, which means the Vikings will have to make up four games in 13, since the tie breaker will go to the Packers! :D

I don't see that. Even when the Packers have been vastly superior to Minnesota, those games are close. MN has a better D than Philly, and probably has a better O too - or will by the time GB plays in MN. That's a loss right there. GB absolutely has to win that divisional game against MN in Green Bay. That's the key to the North (barring injuries) - it was last year too.

[Patler]

...and looking through my green and gold crystal ball, I see two Packer victories over the Vikings this year, which means the Vikings will have to make up four games in 13, since the tie breaker will go to the Packers! :D

I don't see that. Even when the Packers have been vastly superior to Minnesota, those games are close. MN has a better D than Philly, and probably has a better O too - or will by the time GB plays in MN. That's a loss right there. GB absolutely has to win that divisional game against MN in Green Bay. That's the key to the North (barring injuries) - it was last year too.

Did you miss that I was using my "green and gold crystal ball"?
My regular crystal ball agrees with you, but the green and gold one shows a Packer victory in every important game. It has since the time of Vince Lombardi!

[mraynrand]

Did you miss that I was using my "green and gold crystal ball"?

yes

[woodbuck27]

...and looking through my green and gold crystal ball, I see two Packer victories over the Vikings this year, which means the Vikings will have to make up four games in 13, since the tie breaker will go to the Packers! :D

I don't see that. Even when the Packers have been vastly superior to Minnesota, those games are close. MN has a better D than Philly, and probably has a better O too - or will by the time GB plays in MN. That's a loss right there. GB absolutely has to win that divisional game against MN in Green Bay. That's the key to the North (barring injuries) - it was last year too.

The real key, as I view it realistically. Lies in these three major points that I want to raise, today.

a) Will the Vikings overcome ' the adversity ' given, by their off season and to date as we know it now?

b) If ' the Vikings ' do stay close early? How much Aaron Rodgers and the Pack' wants to defeat 'the Vikings. May fly in their (OUR) face, if they don't just simply go into those match's with pizzass versus ' the Minnesota Vikings ' and simply play as they can and get it done.

c) The above will be opposed by ' the Brett Favre Factor ' or Favre knowing and believing. That he still has all it takes to lead the Vikings with whatever they have that's positive and will prevail in the battle between his team and OUR's as he feels he can and must. They sqeak into the playoffs and pick it up from there and prevail over our team.

Alot of if's that point out all that's so interesting to me this season in terms of our team and the Brett Favre and A Peterson on offense led Vikings.

Also the Vikings arn't exactly shabby on 'D'. We saw that last Monday night if you forgot or ignored that fact. :D We're in for alot of excitement Packer fans.

It's all ... very interesting. :idea:

GO PACK GO!

[woodbuck27]

...and looking through my green and gold crystal ball, I see two Packer victories over the Vikings this year, which means the Vikings will have to make up four games in 13, since the tie breaker will go to the Packers! :D

I don't see that. Even when the Packers have been vastly superior to Minnesota, those games are close. MN has a better D than Philly, and probably has a better O too - or will by the time GB plays in MN. That's a loss right there. GB absolutely has to win that divisional game against MN in Green Bay. That's the key to the North (barring injuries) - it was last year too.

Did you miss that I was using my "green and gold crystal ball"?
My regular crystal ball agrees with you, but the green and gold one shows a Packer victory in every important game. It has since the time of Vince Lombardi!

Then Patler. That crystal ball of yours, obviously cleans up really well. Based on OUR teams performance during the 70's and 80's.

Havn't you thrown your Brett Favre shammy away Patler? Guessing that the Aaron Rodgers model works pretty good or is satisfactory to you? :?:

GO PACKERS ! !

Run better than YOU did in ... ** the 70's and 80's.

** The post modern ' skinny lean, not so mean, hapless Green and Gold ' not a machine '. Gee , we're really really hungry era.

That era tested OUR loyalty as Packer fans. How many of us here at PackerRats? are included with you Patler, KY Pack and myself as survivors of that long drought and little thought of, moreso, a drink of Kool Aid?

I wonder if you'll offer a contradiction Patler? If so Patler. Maybe we can debate that from this point of view. That it's ' more than how you play the game ', when it comes to elevating the glory of Packer history?

Ohh before we possibly go there.

Maybe you might check how many NFCN Championships we've won Vs ' the Vince Lombardi and post Vince Lombard. Arch rival Minnesota Vikings total ' or since their inception. They've done very well in that category.

I'm positive your well aware of that fact Patler. :D

Might ' that fact ' play against this season? Turn against us, in terms of the Vikings Oreganization's history and their pride based in that?

[Patler]

Did you miss that I was using my "green and gold crystal ball"?
My regular crystal ball agrees with you, but the green and gold one shows a Packer victory in every important game. It has since the time of Vince Lombardi!

Then Patler. That crystal ball of yours, obviously cleans up really well. Based on OUR teams performance during the 70's and 80's.


Actually, I don't recall many predictions at all from that old green and cold crystal ball in the '70s and '80s. Not very many important games! :lol:

[Scott Campbell]

Also the Vikings arn't exactly shabby on 'D'. We saw that last Monday night if you forgot or ignored that fact.


I saw the Saints run the clock out with over 5 minutes left in the game. Not good if you're a Viking fan. Not good at all.

[packerbacker1234]

Also the Vikings arn't exactly shabby on 'D'. We saw that last Monday night if you forgot or ignored that fact.


I saw the Saints run the clock out with over 5 minutes left in the game. Not good if you're a Viking fan. Not good at all.

That was mostly on the offense of the vikings. That defense spent A LOT of time on the field in that game. It looks like fatigue to me.

[woodbuck27]

Did you miss that I was using my "green and gold crystal ball"?
My regular crystal ball agrees with you, but the green and gold one shows a Packer victory in every important game. It has since the time of Vince Lombardi!

Then Patler. That crystal ball of yours, obviously cleans up really well. Based on OUR teams performance during the 70's and 80's.


Actually, I don't recall many predictions at all from that old green and cold crystal ball in the '70s and '80s. Not very many important games! :lol:

Uhh!? They were all important to this Packer fan. It just seemed that the Packer Organization didn't see it the same way as this fan did.

Man O Man those were 'the hurtin' alot years. To exist as a dedicated Packer fan. A true test ' of conviction and loyalty ' for anyone maintaining they were a Packer fan back then.

To ' the Green Bay Packer Fans '. You gotta be tough.

GO PACKERS!

[Scott Campbell]

Also the Vikings arn't exactly shabby on 'D'. We saw that last Monday night if you forgot or ignored that fact.


I saw the Saints run the clock out with over 5 minutes left in the game. Not good if you're a Viking fan. Not good at all.

That was mostly on the offense of the vikings. That defense spent A LOT of time on the field in that game. It looks like fatigue to me.


No way.

Pat Williams looked old. Any half assed D could have gotten the ball back with that much time left. The Saints just kept ramming it down their throats with their mediocre running game. First down after first down, timeout after timeout. It was a terrible showing.

[packerbacker1234]

Also the Vikings arn't exactly shabby on 'D'. We saw that last Monday night if you forgot or ignored that fact.


I saw the Saints run the clock out with over 5 minutes left in the game. Not good if you're a Viking fan. Not good at all.

That was mostly on the offense of the vikings. That defense spent A LOT of time on the field in that game. It looks like fatigue to me.


No way.

Pat Williams looked old. Any half assed D could have gotten the ball back with that much time left. The Saints just kept ramming it down their throats with their mediocre running game. First down after first down, timeout after timeout. It was a terrible showing.

That defense had been stopping the run most the 3rd quarter. In the 2nd half, however, the defense was on the field for 19 minutes.

That, to me, spells fatigue. Especially if your a fat, and old, linemen - thats a lot of time on the field.

[Scott Campbell]

Also the Vikings arn't exactly shabby on 'D'. We saw that last Monday night if you forgot or ignored that fact.


I saw the Saints run the clock out with over 5 minutes left in the game. Not good if you're a Viking fan. Not good at all.

That was mostly on the offense of the vikings. That defense spent A LOT of time on the field in that game. It looks like fatigue to me.


No way.

Pat Williams looked old. Any half assed D could have gotten the ball back with that much time left. The Saints just kept ramming it down their throats with their mediocre running game. First down after first down, timeout after timeout. It was a terrible showing.

That defense had been stopping the run most the 3rd quarter. In the 2nd half, however, the defense was on the field for 19 minutes.

That, to me, spells fatigue. Especially if your a fat, and old, linemen - thats a lot of time on the field.


It wouldn't bother a great D. 5 and a half minutes is an eternity, and no team should be able to run that much time off the clock to kill a game. And the Vikings even had 2 time outs and the 2 minute warning to stop the clock.

Terrible. Just utterly horrid.

[woodbuck27]

Also the Vikings arn't exactly shabby on 'D'. We saw that last Monday night if you forgot or ignored that fact.


I saw the Saints run the clock out with over 5 minutes left in the game. Not good if you're a Viking fan. Not good at all.

Scott. I'm not a Viking fan. I'm 'of course' a Green Bay Packer fan. That's been my team for too long now to switch for any reason. I suffered through two damn decades of terrible to mediocre Packer fortunes. We're still a decade short of that sort of futility in terms of longevity.

The Viking 'D' played very well after the slow opening Vs the Number one 'O' in the NFL. For much of that game Drew Brees was perplexed. We saw the Vikings ahead at the half.

In fact both team 'D's played very well. So much so, that game (a 14-9 Saints 'W') appeared boreing to some NFL fans. The game had an uncharacteristic lack of offensive on behalf of both teams. Giving that we were watching the two top offensive teams of last season.

Isn't it possible that given the early season start, that the Vikings 'D' simply worked too hard and got tired? There was a regular game day conditioning factor involved in terms of less than maximum energy availability.

The same might apply to Brett Favre and why he ran out of gas. Maybe due to the fact it's really early in this season for him. He might have been depleated of energy due to frustration interms of WR routes and connecting with them? Also, Favre appeared 'a tad pumped' early in that game :D , and thus wasted energy needed as the game progressed.

Scott. It was only one game but that Vikings 'D' is solid. Drew Brees and ' the Super Bowl Champion ' Saints, only scored 14 Pt's.

GO PACKERS!

[woodbuck27]

Shooter Now: What will Vikings do when Favre retires? Will the 'media frenzy' end?

By Charley Walters ; cwalters@pioneerpress.com

Updated: 09/09/2010

http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_16032648?source=topixheadlines

[Tony Oday]

The Saints should have won that game 27-9...one dropped TD pass and two missed FGs...The Vikings defense looked like swiss cheese on the line.

[woodbuck27]

What if the Minnesota Vikings had not put 12 men in the huddle late in the NFC championship game?

By Brian Murphy

Updated: 09/09/2010

http://www.twincities.com/ci_16026324nclick_check=1&source=topixheadlines

[HarveyWallbangers]

That defense had been stopping the run most the 3rd quarter. In the 2nd half, however, the defense was on the field for 19 minutes.

That, to me, spells fatigue. Especially if your a fat, and old, linemen - thats a lot of time on the field.

Not sure they stopped the Saints rushing the ball. It was more that the Saints didn't try to run the ball. They had 11 carries for 45 yards with a one yard TD run after their first drive of the third quarter--which would be before the Vikings defense was gassed.

It's only one game though. Pat Williams did look old, but the Saints have two good OGs.

[woodbuck27]

With a focus on a stupid penalty that led to a series of events that cost Brett Favre and the Vikings a Super Bowl appearance last season; and led to other factors of Vikings concern:

12 MEN IN THE HUDDLE REWIND

Coming out of their second timeout with 19 seconds remaining in the fourth quarter and the score tied 28-28, the Vikings were in chaos facing a crucial third-and-long.

Fullback Naufahu Tahi was still on the field after blocking for Adrian Peterson on the previous no gain. Head coach Brad Childress and running backs coach Eric Bieniemy frantically waved for Tahi to get out of the huddle. Brett Favre, too, realized the problem and hurriedly called timeout, but not before flags flew.

The penalty knocked Minnesota back to the 38, confronting kicker Ryan Longwell with a potential 56-yard attempt instead of 51 yards and convincing the Vikings they needed to pass on third and 15.

Favre, gimpy on a severely sprained left ankle, rolled right and had at least 10 yards of open field between him and the far sideline to run, but he elected to throw across his body for Sidney Rice. Cornerback Tracy Porter intercepted.

New Orleans promptly won the overtime coin toss. Returner Pierre Thomas raced 40 yards from the goal line to give the Saints fantastic field position and set up Garrett Hartley for the 40-yard boot that put them in the Super Bowl.

The Vikings never touched the ball again.

On the kick coverage, Cedric Griffin, the Vikings' interception leader, tore his left anterior cruciate ligament, which required reconstructive surgery and leaves his status for tonight's rematch a game-time decision.

— Brian Murphy

[hoosier]

With a focus on a stupid penalty that led to a series of events that cost Brett Favre and the Vikings a Super Bowl appearance last season; and led to other factors of Vikings concern:

12 MEN IN THE HUDDLE REWIND

Coming out of their second timeout with 19 seconds remaining in the fourth quarter and the score tied 28-28, the Vikings were in chaos facing a crucial third-and-long.

Fullback Naufahu Tahi was still on the field after blocking for Adrian Peterson on the previous no gain. Head coach Brad Childress and running backs coach Eric Bieniemy frantically waved for Tahi to get out of the huddle. Brett Favre, too, realized the problem and hurriedly called timeout, but not before flags flew.

The penalty knocked Minnesota back to the 38, confronting kicker Ryan Longwell with a potential 56-yard attempt instead of 51 yards and convincing the Vikings they needed to pass on third and 15.

Favre, gimpy on a severely sprained left ankle, rolled right and had at least 10 yards of open field between him and the far sideline to run, but he elected to throw across his body for Sidney Rice. Cornerback Tracy Porter intercepted.

New Orleans promptly won the overtime coin toss. Returner Pierre Thomas raced 40 yards from the goal line to give the Saints fantastic field position and set up Garrett Hartley for the 40-yard boot that put them in the Super Bowl.

The Vikings never touched the ball again.

On the kick coverage, Cedric Griffin, the Vikings' interception leader, tore his left anterior cruciate ligament, which required reconstructive surgery and leaves his status for tonight's rematch a game-time decision.

— Brian Murphy

I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? Whatever the case, let's note for the record that: (1) Favre didn't call timeout until the Vikings had broken the huddle and were getting set at the line of scrimmage; and (2) that the Vikings had already taken a timeout after the previous play and thus Favre's calling a second timeout would have resulted in a penalty in its own right had they not been penalized for 12 in the huddle.

[Sparkey]

Actually, FWIW, we live in a Federal Republic, not a democracy. One of 21 nations that does so.
Do you have a definition handy for pedantic? :D

I already gave you the example! :lol:

[Scott Campbell]

What if the Minnesota Vikings had not put 12 men in the huddle late in the NFC championship game?

By Brian Murphy

Updated: 09/09/2010

http://www.twincities.com/ci_16026324nclick_check=1&source=topixheadlines


The Vikes finally got their Lombardi trophy! :lol:

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site569/2010/0908/20100908__100909_Favre_whatif_AP%20copy_300.jpg

[woodbuck27]

With a focus on a stupid penalty that led to a series of events that cost Brett Favre and the Vikings a Super Bowl appearance last season; and led to other factors of Vikings concern:

12 MEN IN THE HUDDLE REWIND

Coming out of their second timeout with 19 seconds remaining in the fourth quarter and the score tied 28-28, the Vikings were in chaos facing a crucial third-and-long.

Fullback Naufahu Tahi was still on the field after blocking for Adrian Peterson on the previous no gain. Head coach Brad Childress and running backs coach Eric Bieniemy frantically waved for Tahi to get out of the huddle. Brett Favre, too, realized the problem and hurriedly called timeout, but not before flags flew.

The penalty knocked Minnesota back to the 38, confronting kicker Ryan Longwell with a potential 56-yard attempt instead of 51 yards and convincing the Vikings they needed to pass on third and 15.

Favre, gimpy on a severely sprained left ankle, rolled right and had at least 10 yards of open field between him and the far sideline to run, but he elected to throw across his body for Sidney Rice. Cornerback Tracy Porter intercepted.

New Orleans promptly won the overtime coin toss. Returner Pierre Thomas raced 40 yards from the goal line to give the Saints fantastic field position and set up Garrett Hartley for the 40-yard boot that put them in the Super Bowl.

The Vikings never touched the ball again.

On the kick coverage, Cedric Griffin, the Vikings' interception leader, tore his left anterior cruciate ligament, which required reconstructive surgery and leaves his status for tonight's rematch a game-time decision.

— Brian Murphy

I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? Whatever the case, let's note for the record that: (1) Favre didn't call timeout until the Vikings had broken the huddle and were getting set at the line of scrimmage; and (2) that the Vikings had already taken a timeout after the previous play and thus Favre's calling a second timeout would have resulted in a penalty in its own right had they not been penalized for 12 in the huddle.

" I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? "
... hoosier

I was looking at a popular Minnesota website last night and discovered similiar stories that we've seen of late RE: Vikings and need or not at WR. and ... Of their owners passion to see his team go all the way and win the Super Bowl .

When I found this article. I thought it was interesting that the author revisited that penalty. I felt that penalty was a crushing blow to the Vikings chance to be NFC Champ. I was heavily involved in that game.

Just prior to that penalty. I was picturing former Packer kicker Ryan Longwell, making about a 50 yarder. Also I was amazed given the punishment Favre received, and the turns of fortune that went against the Vikings. That they still looked good to advance to the Super Bowl. I'm sure many Vikings fans were tasting it. NFL fans were somewhere between pleased for 'the Vikings ' given their undaunted yet unrewarded history and hating the moment, as the Vikings looked good to win that berth to the Super Bowl.

Then that ridiculous or untimely penalty. It had to be brutal to be a Vikings fan.... Then I began to reflect on this wonderful game we love. Of all the experiences we have felt as football fans of the NFL or a specific team.

We are Packer fans and damn proud of that fact. :D

Last night I reflected on the past experiences I felt as a Packer and NFL fan. It made me think of OUR sudden loss to the 49ers on ' the Steve Young closing series', that shouldn't have been, as the Officials blew that call on 49er's WR Jerry Rice.

It still bugs me. :x

Then ' the drive ' by San Fran QB Steve Young and that subsequent incredibly acrobatic leaping tand falling to the ground catch by Terrell Owens. T.O. was surrounded by Packer defenders and he wouldn't be denied on that wild right to left slant to the end zone. What a frick'n catch !!

I couldn't believe I saw that happen. My immediate reaction: It should never have been. NFL Officials had done it to us again! As they've done it to many NFL teams, and will do so in the future. Sunday afternoon Officials in ' the most exciting league on the planet '. The look of Holmgren and Favre on the sideline, as our fate was sealed. The feeling we as Packer fans felt, ' disbelief '. We had lost that vital game. All the passion... of that whole thing.

That 12 man in the huddle penalty also made me think of the improbable, the infamous ' 4 and 26 '. How we blew that game. How since we tossed that around. How we have come to somehow gleen a wee bit of ' the people we are here' as individuals. How we have agreed and disagreed with one another and somehow maintained this Packer fan site. Our Packer home.

Look back at that 12 man in the huddle penalty, from a standpoint of how similiar happenings in crucial games affected us as Packer fans. I'm much more than ' just as Packer fan '. I love the NFL game and all the build up, hype and drama.

I happen to feel that the common fans have alot more on the ball than alot of people (people even here at Packerrats) are willing to credit them with. It seems to me that some of the people here actually believe that ** their team managements, ALL RIGHT **. I seperate religion and Pro sports.

Back to:

a)12 men in the huddle .. Saints/Vikings NFC Championship Game 2009/10

b)The Steve Young Drive and the T.O. catch ( 49ers Steve Young, Jerry Rice and T.O. )

c)Packers and Philly NFC Championship game ( 4th and 26 )

That as NFL fans we take any moment in a game, any way we want to, as individuals. We either like it, love it, hate it, or are asleep, don't give a damn or otherwise, indifferent to it. We all share the moment as NFL fans and react as our emotions or intellect direct us. That's just one example of how ' I feel ' we should conduct ourselves in this lifetime. With respect.

These are my thoughts hoosier. Can't we as members here grow as a community and learn something from every member? Re-build PackerRats to the best fan site offered on the internet?

I believe 'that utopian thought' has promise. I reached out to a member here ' last night ' that has disappeared for some reason. I'm concerned about this fella. Is he ok. Has his life taken a down turn? Is it any of my business? **

**Well he'll get my message or not and decide that matter.

This is a community. As members we should care more about our posters that have made significant contributions to the growth and experience at Packerrats. That attitude may influence other posters to step up their game and fill the roles of those missing. :D

My name is Ed. woodbuck27

[Scott Campbell]

It was a 5 yard penalty. It'll never excuse Bert for gift wrapping the Superbowl berth to the Saints with that horrible pass to Joey Porter.

[mraynrand]

With a focus on a stupid penalty that led to a series of events that cost Brett Favre and the Vikings a Super Bowl appearance last season; and led to other factors of Vikings concern:

12 MEN IN THE HUDDLE REWIND

Coming out of their second timeout with 19 seconds remaining in the fourth quarter and the score tied 28-28, the Vikings were in chaos facing a crucial third-and-long.

Fullback Naufahu Tahi was still on the field after blocking for Adrian Peterson on the previous no gain. Head coach Brad Childress and running backs coach Eric Bieniemy frantically waved for Tahi to get out of the huddle. Brett Favre, too, realized the problem and hurriedly called timeout, but not before flags flew.

The penalty knocked Minnesota back to the 38, confronting kicker Ryan Longwell with a potential 56-yard attempt instead of 51 yards and convincing the Vikings they needed to pass on third and 15.

Favre, gimpy on a severely sprained left ankle, rolled right and had at least 10 yards of open field between him and the far sideline to run, but he elected to throw across his body for Sidney Rice. Cornerback Tracy Porter intercepted.

New Orleans promptly won the overtime coin toss. Returner Pierre Thomas raced 40 yards from the goal line to give the Saints fantastic field position and set up Garrett Hartley for the 40-yard boot that put them in the Super Bowl.

The Vikings never touched the ball again.

On the kick coverage, Cedric Griffin, the Vikings' interception leader, tore his left anterior cruciate ligament, which required reconstructive surgery and leaves his status for tonight's rematch a game-time decision.

— Brian Murphy

I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? Whatever the case, let's note for the record that: (1) Favre didn't call timeout until the Vikings had broken the huddle and were getting set at the line of scrimmage; and (2) that the Vikings had already taken a timeout after the previous play and thus Favre's calling a second timeout would have resulted in a penalty in its own right had they not been penalized for 12 in the huddle.

" I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? "
... hoosier

I was looking at a popular Minnesota website last night and discovered similiar stories that we've seen of late RE: Vikings and need or not at WR. and ... Of their owners passion to see his team go all the way and win the Super Bowl .

When I found this article. I thought it was interesting that the author revisited that penalty. I felt that penalty was a crushing blow to the Vikings excellent chance to be NFC Champ. I was heavily involved in that game 'of course'. :D Well invested isn't an incorrect claim.

At the time and just prior to that penalty. I was picturing former Packer kicker 'and Packer great to me :D ' Ryan Longwell, making about a 50 yarder, to seal the deal. I was also at that time amazed given the punishment Favre received, and the turns of fortune that went against the Vikings. That they still looked good to advance to the Super Bowl. I'm sure many Vikings fans were tasting it and NFL fans were somewhere between pleased for 'the Vikings ' given their undaunted yet unrewarded history and just OKing to hating the moment, as the Vikings were setting up for a visit to the show.

Then that ridiculous 'given the time and circumstances' penalty. Holy mackeral I thought... Noooo! It had to be brutal to be a die hard Vikings fan.... Then I began much later and right up to last night ... to reflect on this wonderful game we love. Of all the experiences we have felt as football fans of the NFL generally, or of a specific team.

We are Packer fans and damn proud of that fact. :D

Last night as I wrote before. I reflected on the past experiences I felt as a Packer and NFL fan. It made me think of OUR sudden loss to the 49ers on ' the Steve Young closing series' that shouldn't have been. Yet was, after the Officials blew that call on 49er's WR Jerry Rice on the RH side.

Damn! It still bugs me. :x

Then ' the drive ', led by San Fran QB Steve Young and that subsequent incredibly acrobatic leaping to grab the ball and falling, to the ground catch by a WR that had been coming on our radar with his steller talent and colorful ways. San Fran WR Terrell Owens.

T.O. was surrounded by Packer defenders and he wouldn't be denied on that wild right to left slant to the end zone. What a frick'n catch !!

My whaaaat " I can't believe I saw that happen" moment for me, of sudden dispair and grief. My immediate reactions included this: It should never have been...Damn!! NFL Officials have done it to us again!

As they've done it to many NFL teams, and will in the future.

Sunday afternoon Officials in 'the most exciting league on the planet'. Unbelievable BS. The look of Holmgren and Favre on the sideline, as our fate was sealed. The feeling we as Packer fans felt, 'as disbelief', that we had lost that vital game. All the passion... of that whole thing.

That 12 man in the huddle penalty also made me think of the improbable, the infamous ' 4 and 26 ' and how we blew that game. The blame. How we tossed that around time after time as common posters in different forums. Given all of that. How we have come to somehow gleen a wee bit of ' the people we are here' as individuals. How we have agreed and disagreed with one another and somehow maintained this Packer fan site. We all deem or Packer home.

Take a look back at that horrible 12 man in the huddle penalty from a standpoint of how similiar happenings in crucial games affected us as Packer fans. I'm much more than ' just as Packer fan '. I love the NFL game and all the build up, all the hype and drama.

I love Packerrats. This is my only fan site. I never post in other site, yet from time to time depended on what I seek; I do visit other team sites. Why? Well I look for an edge as an NFL fan. I want to grow as an NFL fan.

I happen to feel that the common fans have alot more on the ball than alot of people (people even here at Packerrats) are willing to credit them with. It seems to me that some of the people here actually believe that ** their team managements, ALL RIGHT **. I seperate religion and Pro sports. I'm never going to be there **. I've too much experience to realize the counter argument holds alot of water.

Back to

a)12 men in the huddle .. Saints/Vikings NFC Championship Game 2009/10

b)The Steve Young Drive and the T.O. catch ( 49ers Steve Young, Jerry Rice and T.O. )

c)Packers and Philly NFC Championship game ( 4th and 26 )

That we as NFL fans take any moment in a game, any way we want to, as individuals. We either like it or love it or hate it, or are asleep, don't give a damn or otherwise are indifferent to it. All the same, we share it as we need to, as we feel in ourselves. We all share the moment as NFL fans and react as our emotions or intellect direct us. That is the deal. Just one example of how ' I feel ', we should conduct ourselves best in this lifetime. The respect we owe one another here and as we live our lives one to another, generally.

These are simply my thoughts hoosier and all posters at packerrats.

We go through this life one time. There is no set way we need to live here at Packerrats; but to try to respect one another or to live life generally. Arn't there better ways to live than to take up defensive, controlling, over assertive to aggressive, mind wasted strategies with people alot of us here hardly or really don't know? Can't we as members here grow as a community and learn something from every member?

Re-build Packerrasts to the best fan site offered on the internet?

I believe 'that utopian thought' has promise. I reached out to a member here ' last night ' that has disappeared for some reason. I'm concerned about this fella. Is he ok. Has his life taken a down turn? Is it any of my business?**

**Well he'll get my message or not and decide that matter.

This is a community of sorts and as members here we need to at least consider caring more about our posters that have made significant contributions to the growth and experience at Packerrats. That attitude will only play on other posters, to step up their game and fill the roles of those we now see amongst the missing. :D

My name is Ed. woodbuck27

Holy Toledo!

The mind of Woodbuck is a mysterious place:

http://www.movieforum.com/movies/titles/labyrinth/images/labyrinth.jpg

[swede]

That is why I don't read them. I take one peek into that labyrinth of canuckian canoodlings and back out before I get sucked through my monitor into another dimension.

[Zool]

Holy Toledo!

The mind of Woodbuck is a mysterious place:

http://www.movieforum.com/movies/titles/labyrinth/images/labyrinth.jpg

Is that David Bowie in the background?

[hoosier]

Andrew Brandt on Randy Moss, Favre and the bidding wars between NE and the Packers: http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Randys-rant-was-almost-a-Packer-twice.html.

While the column takes the obligatory neutral view of how Favre/Cook dealt with the situation, it seems pretty clear to me that what Brandt witnessed in the aftermath--Favre's first retirement in spring 2008 and the ensuing spectacle in fall 2008--was basically the tantrum of a player who had discovered that he was no longer able to influence the team's strategic thinking about personnel.

[Tarlam!]

That is why I don't read them. I take one peek into that labyrinth of canuckian canoodlings and back out before I get sucked through my monitor into another dimension.

I sometimes read it and need a shower afterwards.

[woodbuck27]

With a focus on a stupid penalty that led to a series of events that cost Brett Favre and the Vikings a Super Bowl appearance last season; and led to other factors of Vikings concern:

12 MEN IN THE HUDDLE REWIND

Coming out of their second timeout with 19 seconds remaining in the fourth quarter and the score tied 28-28, the Vikings were in chaos facing a crucial third-and-long.

Fullback Naufahu Tahi was still on the field after blocking for Adrian Peterson on the previous no gain. Head coach Brad Childress and running backs coach Eric Bieniemy frantically waved for Tahi to get out of the huddle. Brett Favre, too, realized the problem and hurriedly called timeout, but not before flags flew.

The penalty knocked Minnesota back to the 38, confronting kicker Ryan Longwell with a potential 56-yard attempt instead of 51 yards and convincing the Vikings they needed to pass on third and 15.

Favre, gimpy on a severely sprained left ankle, rolled right and had at least 10 yards of open field between him and the far sideline to run, but he elected to throw across his body for Sidney Rice. Cornerback Tracy Porter intercepted.

New Orleans promptly won the overtime coin toss. Returner Pierre Thomas raced 40 yards from the goal line to give the Saints fantastic field position and set up Garrett Hartley for the 40-yard boot that put them in the Super Bowl.

The Vikings never touched the ball again.

On the kick coverage, Cedric Griffin, the Vikings' interception leader, tore his left anterior cruciate ligament, which required reconstructive surgery and leaves his status for tonight's rematch a game-time decision.

— Brian Murphy

I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? Whatever the case, let's note for the record that: (1) Favre didn't call timeout until the Vikings had broken the huddle and were getting set at the line of scrimmage; and (2) that the Vikings had already taken a timeout after the previous play and thus Favre's calling a second timeout would have resulted in a penalty in its own right had they not been penalized for 12 in the huddle.

" I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? "
... hoosier

I was looking at a popular Minnesota website last night and discovered similiar stories that we've seen of late RE: Vikings and need or not at WR. and ... Of their owners passion to see his team go all the way and win the Super Bowl .

When I found this article. I thought it was interesting that the author revisited that penalty. I felt that penalty was a crushing blow to the Vikings excellent chance to be NFC Champ. I was heavily involved in that game 'of course'. :D Well invested isn't an incorrect claim.

At the time and just prior to that penalty. I was picturing former Packer kicker 'and Packer great to me :D ' Ryan Longwell, making about a 50 yarder, to seal the deal. I was also at that time amazed given the punishment Favre received, and the turns of fortune that went against the Vikings. That they still looked good to advance to the Super Bowl. I'm sure many Vikings fans were tasting it and NFL fans were somewhere between pleased for 'the Vikings ' given their undaunted yet unrewarded history and just OKing to hating the moment, as the Vikings were setting up for a visit to the show.

Then that ridiculous 'given the time and circumstances' penalty. Holy mackeral I thought... Noooo! It had to be brutal to be a die hard Vikings fan.... Then I began much later and right up to last night ... to reflect on this wonderful game we love. Of all the experiences we have felt as football fans of the NFL generally, or of a specific team.

We are Packer fans and damn proud of that fact. :D

Last night as I wrote before. I reflected on the past experiences I felt as a Packer and NFL fan. It made me think of OUR sudden loss to the 49ers on ' the Steve Young closing series' that shouldn't have been. Yet was, after the Officials blew that call on 49er's WR Jerry Rice on the RH side.

Damn! It still bugs me. :x

Then ' the drive ', led by San Fran QB Steve Young and that subsequent incredibly acrobatic leaping to grab the ball and falling, to the ground catch by a WR that had been coming on our radar with his steller talent and colorful ways. San Fran WR Terrell Owens.

T.O. was surrounded by Packer defenders and he wouldn't be denied on that wild right to left slant to the end zone. What a frick'n catch !!

My whaaaat " I can't believe I saw that happen" moment for me, of sudden dispair and grief. My immediate reactions included this: It should never have been...Damn!! NFL Officials have done it to us again!

As they've done it to many NFL teams, and will in the future.

Sunday afternoon Officials in 'the most exciting league on the planet'. Unbelievable BS. The look of Holmgren and Favre on the sideline, as our fate was sealed. The feeling we as Packer fans felt, 'as disbelief', that we had lost that vital game. All the passion... of that whole thing.

That 12 man in the huddle penalty also made me think of the improbable, the infamous ' 4 and 26 ' and how we blew that game. The blame. How we tossed that around time after time as common posters in different forums. Given all of that. How we have come to somehow gleen a wee bit of ' the people we are here' as individuals. How we have agreed and disagreed with one another and somehow maintained this Packer fan site. We all deem or Packer home.

Take a look back at that horrible 12 man in the huddle penalty from a standpoint of how similiar happenings in crucial games affected us as Packer fans. I'm much more than ' just as Packer fan '. I love the NFL game and all the build up, all the hype and drama.

I love Packerrats. This is my only fan site. I never post in other site, yet from time to time depended on what I seek; I do visit other team sites. Why? Well I look for an edge as an NFL fan. I want to grow as an NFL fan.

I happen to feel that the common fans have alot more on the ball than alot of people (people even here at Packerrats) are willing to credit them with. It seems to me that some of the people here actually believe that ** their team managements, ALL RIGHT **. I seperate religion and Pro sports. I'm never going to be there **. I've too much experience to realize the counter argument holds alot of water.

Back to

a)12 men in the huddle .. Saints/Vikings NFC Championship Game 2009/10

b)The Steve Young Drive and the T.O. catch ( 49ers Steve Young, Jerry Rice and T.O. )

c)Packers and Philly NFC Championship game ( 4th and 26 )

That we as NFL fans take any moment in a game, any way we want to, as individuals. We either like it or love it or hate it, or are asleep, don't give a damn or otherwise are indifferent to it. All the same, we share it as we need to, as we feel in ourselves. We all share the moment as NFL fans and react as our emotions or intellect direct us. That is the deal. Just one example of how ' I feel ', we should conduct ourselves best in this lifetime. The respect we owe one another here and as we live our lives one to another, generally.

These are simply my thoughts hoosier and all posters at packerrats.

We go through this life one time. There is no set way we need to live here at Packerrats; but to try to respect one another or to live life generally. Arn't there better ways to live than to take up defensive, controlling, over assertive to aggressive, mind wasted strategies with people alot of us here hardly or really don't know? Can't we as members here grow as a community and learn something from every member?

Re-build Packerrasts to the best fan site offered on the internet?

I believe 'that utopian thought' has promise. I reached out to a member here ' last night ' that has disappeared for some reason. I'm concerned about this fella. Is he ok. Has his life taken a down turn? Is it any of my business?**

**Well he'll get my message or not and decide that matter.

This is a community of sorts and as members here we need to at least consider caring more about our posters that have made significant contributions to the growth and experience at Packerrats. That attitude will only play on other posters, to step up their game and fill the roles of those we now see amongst the missing. :D

My name is Ed. woodbuck27

Holy Toledo!

The mind of Woodbuck is a mysterious place:

http://www.movieforum.com/movies/titles/labyrinth/images/labyrinth.jpg

I wrote that this morning as I would a rough copy and with no edit. If I want to write something better I edit three times. I just made my first edit. I apologize to the forum. :D

[woodbuck27]

That is why I don't read them. I take one peek into that labyrinth of canuckian canoodlings and back out before I get sucked through my monitor into another dimension.

I sometimes read it and need a shower afterwards.

Yes sure Tarlam! and your such a fine example of perfection.

My Father told me something really sensable. He said to me.

" Ed! If you cannot say something nice about someone or some thing. Then my advice is to say nothing. " Bert Wood

That's wisdom Tarlam! Just a thought. Ever seriously take time for one Tarlam!? Thought? :idea:

GO PACK GO!

[mraynrand]

With a focus on a stupid penalty that led to a series of events that cost Brett Favre and the Vikings a Super Bowl appearance last season; and led to other factors of Vikings concern:

12 MEN IN THE HUDDLE REWIND

Coming out of their second timeout with 19 seconds remaining in the fourth quarter and the score tied 28-28, the Vikings were in chaos facing a crucial third-and-long.

Fullback Naufahu Tahi was still on the field after blocking for Adrian Peterson on the previous no gain. Head coach Brad Childress and running backs coach Eric Bieniemy frantically waved for Tahi to get out of the huddle. Brett Favre, too, realized the problem and hurriedly called timeout, but not before flags flew.

The penalty knocked Minnesota back to the 38, confronting kicker Ryan Longwell with a potential 56-yard attempt instead of 51 yards and convincing the Vikings they needed to pass on third and 15.

Favre, gimpy on a severely sprained left ankle, rolled right and had at least 10 yards of open field between him and the far sideline to run, but he elected to throw across his body for Sidney Rice. Cornerback Tracy Porter intercepted.

New Orleans promptly won the overtime coin toss. Returner Pierre Thomas raced 40 yards from the goal line to give the Saints fantastic field position and set up Garrett Hartley for the 40-yard boot that put them in the Super Bowl.

The Vikings never touched the ball again.

On the kick coverage, Cedric Griffin, the Vikings' interception leader, tore his left anterior cruciate ligament, which required reconstructive surgery and leaves his status for tonight's rematch a game-time decision.

— Brian Murphy

I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? Whatever the case, let's note for the record that: (1) Favre didn't call timeout until the Vikings had broken the huddle and were getting set at the line of scrimmage; and (2) that the Vikings had already taken a timeout after the previous play and thus Favre's calling a second timeout would have resulted in a penalty in its own right had they not been penalized for 12 in the huddle.

" I am not clear on why you are rehashing this sequence now. Is there something new in what Murphy is writing that we didn't know before? "
... hoosier

I was looking at a popular Minnesota website last night and discovered similiar stories that we've seen of late RE: Vikings and need or not at WR. and ... Of their owners passion to see his team go all the way and win the Super Bowl .

When I found this article. I thought it was interesting that the author revisited that penalty. I felt that penalty was a crushing blow to the Vikings excellent chance to be NFC Champ. I was heavily involved in that game 'of course'. :D Well invested isn't an incorrect claim.

At the time and just prior to that penalty. I was picturing former Packer kicker 'and Packer great to me :D ' Ryan Longwell, making about a 50 yarder, to seal the deal. I was also at that time amazed given the punishment Favre received, and the turns of fortune that went against the Vikings. That they still looked good to advance to the Super Bowl. I'm sure many Vikings fans were tasting it and NFL fans were somewhere between pleased for 'the Vikings ' given their undaunted yet unrewarded history and just OKing to hating the moment, as the Vikings were setting up for a visit to the show.

Then that ridiculous 'given the time and circumstances' penalty. Holy mackeral I thought... Noooo! It had to be brutal to be a die hard Vikings fan.... Then I began much later and right up to last night ... to reflect on this wonderful game we love. Of all the experiences we have felt as football fans of the NFL generally, or of a specific team.

We are Packer fans and damn proud of that fact. :D

Last night as I wrote before. I reflected on the past experiences I felt as a Packer and NFL fan. It made me think of OUR sudden loss to the 49ers on ' the Steve Young closing series' that shouldn't have been. Yet was, after the Officials blew that call on 49er's WR Jerry Rice on the RH side.

Damn! It still bugs me. :x

Then ' the drive ', led by San Fran QB Steve Young and that subsequent incredibly acrobatic leaping to grab the ball and falling, to the ground catch by a WR that had been coming on our radar with his steller talent and colorful ways. San Fran WR Terrell Owens.

T.O. was surrounded by Packer defenders and he wouldn't be denied on that wild right to left slant to the end zone. What a frick'n catch !!

My whaaaat " I can't believe I saw that happen" moment for me, of sudden dispair and grief. My immediate reactions included this: It should never have been...Damn!! NFL Officials have done it to us again!

As they've done it to many NFL teams, and will in the future.

Sunday afternoon Officials in 'the most exciting league on the planet'. Unbelievable BS. The look of Holmgren and Favre on the sideline, as our fate was sealed. The feeling we as Packer fans felt, 'as disbelief', that we had lost that vital game. All the passion... of that whole thing.

That 12 man in the huddle penalty also made me think of the improbable, the infamous ' 4 and 26 ' and how we blew that game. The blame. How we tossed that around time after time as common posters in different forums. Given all of that. How we have come to somehow gleen a wee bit of ' the people we are here' as individuals. How we have agreed and disagreed with one another and somehow maintained this Packer fan site. We all deem or Packer home.

Take a look back at that horrible 12 man in the huddle penalty from a standpoint of how similiar happenings in crucial games affected us as Packer fans. I'm much more than ' just as Packer fan '. I love the NFL game and all the build up, all the hype and drama.

I love Packerrats. This is my only fan site. I never post in other site, yet from time to time depended on what I seek; I do visit other team sites. Why? Well I look for an edge as an NFL fan. I want to grow as an NFL fan.

I happen to feel that the common fans have alot more on the ball than alot of people (people even here at Packerrats) are willing to credit them with. It seems to me that some of the people here actually believe that ** their team managements, ALL RIGHT **. I seperate religion and Pro sports. I'm never going to be there **. I've too much experience to realize the counter argument holds alot of water.

Back to

a)12 men in the huddle .. Saints/Vikings NFC Championship Game 2009/10

b)The Steve Young Drive and the T.O. catch ( 49ers Steve Young, Jerry Rice and T.O. )

c)Packers and Philly NFC Championship game ( 4th and 26 )

That we as NFL fans take any moment in a game, any way we want to, as individuals. We either like it or love it or hate it, or are asleep, don't give a damn or otherwise are indifferent to it. All the same, we share it as we need to, as we feel in ourselves. We all share the moment as NFL fans and react as our emotions or intellect direct us. That is the deal. Just one example of how ' I feel ', we should conduct ourselves best in this lifetime. The respect we owe one another here and as we live our lives one to another, generally.

These are simply my thoughts hoosier and all posters at packerrats.

We go through this life one time. There is no set way we need to live here at Packerrats; but to try to respect one another or to live life generally. Arn't there better ways to live than to take up defensive, controlling, over assertive to aggressive, mind wasted strategies with people alot of us here hardly or really don't know? Can't we as members here grow as a community and learn something from every member?

Re-build Packerrasts to the best fan site offered on the internet?

I believe 'that utopian thought' has promise. I reached out to a member here ' last night ' that has disappeared for some reason. I'm concerned about this fella. Is he ok. Has his life taken a down turn? Is it any of my business?**

**Well he'll get my message or not and decide that matter.

This is a community of sorts and as members here we need to at least consider caring more about our posters that have made significant contributions to the growth and experience at Packerrats. That attitude will only play on other posters, to step up their game and fill the roles of those we now see amongst the missing. :D

My name is Ed. woodbuck27

Holy Toledo!

The mind of Woodbuck is a mysterious place:

http://www.movieforum.com/movies/titles/labyrinth/images/labyrinth.jpg

I wrote that this morning as I would a rough copy and with no edit. If I want to write something better I edit three times. I just made my first edit. I apologize to the forum. :D

Are you really saying that your other posts have been edited? Three times? :shock:

[woodbuck27]

No mraynrand.

I should edit a long post like that abomination 'at least' three times. :D

I just felt like ramblin' on this morning. I got carried away with my thoughts about a bunch of things, that are connected and related to what is the cause of a big loss for any NFL team.

I tried to relate that 12 man in the huddle penalty on the Vikings last year. To happenings that caused our team a failure to advance deeper in the playoffs in our history.

If anyone was to have some insight into that post. There is a point I wanted to make mraynrand. That was a sloppy post. I admit it and apologize.

That too long post could have been summed up with these words:

Shit happens. :lol:

GO PACKERS!

[Tarlam!]

My Father told me something really sensable. He said to me.

" Ed! If you cannot say something nice about someone or some thing. Then my advice is to say nothing. " Bert Wood

That's wisdom Tarlam! Just a thought. Ever seriously take time for one Tarlam!? Thought? :idea:

GO PACK GO!

Actually, that quote predates Bert Wood. It dates back to the earliest Free Masons and my father told it to me when I was about 7 years old. The problem is, Ed, you don't take your own advice. You come on here, self righteuos, beating your chest and write pages of jiberish and you stick it to more posters than I care to count, all the while proclaiming your superior intellect and morals.

It makes me, and obviously others, sick. I have no problems with your views. I have a problem with you.

My name is Norbert.

[woodbuck27]

My Father told me something really sensable. He said to me.

" Ed! If you cannot say something nice about someone or some thing. Then my advice is to say nothing. " Bert Wood

That's wisdom Tarlam! Just a thought. Ever seriously take time for one Tarlam!? Thought? :idea:

GO PACK GO!

Actually, that quote predates Bert Wood. It dates back to the earliest Free Masons and my father told it to me when I was about 7 years old. The problem is, Ed, you don't take your own advice. You come on here, self righteuos, beating your chest and write pages of jiberish and you stick it to more posters than I care to count, all the while proclaiming your superior intellect and morals.

It makes me, and obviously others, sick. I have no problems with your views. I have a problem with you.

My name is Norbert.

I won't apologize for my confidence, nor my intelligence or wisdom Tarlam! ( Norbert ). I won't apologize for all I do to try to be a Packer fan and support for this forum that's hopefully viewed overall as positive. I certainly aim at that Tarlam!. I'm far from ' the tyrant ' you try to paint me to be.

I'm a gentleman Tarlam!, a team player. I'm ' all in ', attempting to be a positive poster and contributor here. You'll never deter that Tarlam!; inspite of your efforts over our past to run me down. Funny I've always treated you fairly and it's YOU Tarlam! that takes the low road. That attacks. Then you disparage me as I must respond to your attacks. It's not meant to be any circle jerk, Tarlam! I always wish for a win-win. We both win man if you only try to meet me half way and we build on that.

An alternative would be this.

T just give it up. Go back to the weak approach you suggested sometime ago. YOU and I no longer post one another. Not my way yours Tarlam!. See the problem lies in YOU Tarlam! not me. You'll never get that, because of who or what you are Norbert.

I rather suggest we act towords one another 'as gentleman'. Be ... to the positive man. :D

Going back to 2005. You've always taken the stance that I'm some really bad fella that is here to slam others. That's just BS Tarlam! I'm not capable of such low life behaviour. I'm capable of defending my views, rights and backing up my skills and I do Tarlam! That piss's you off. Right!?

I assert myself under attack, yet I'm not an antagonistic person / troublemaker. I defend my rights Tarlam! I back myself up as need be. I never judge a soul here at PackerRats Tarlam! Yet you'll hold me to some ridiculous standard based on yourself?

I won't apologize for working to be a knowlegeable NFL fan. I work hard at that Tarlam! Year after year I back myself up with solid performances in terms of various competitions I've entered. Your certainly aware of that.

I'll go on doing my thing and whatever you chose to think of me isn't my concern Tarlam!. This is a Packer forum not a popularity contest. I don't lose sleep, because you've always disparaged me Tarlam!.


GO PACKERS!

[Tarlam!]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

[Tarlam!]

To all at PR

I apologize for my personal attack on Woodbuck27. I just couldn't hold it in any longer. I am totally against personally attacking another poster. I will do my utmost to leave it behind me and be a decent contributor.

[swede]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

Do Australians and Canadians generally feel a bit of sibling rivalry as children of the British Empire?

The Canadians seem to be the prissy favored child what with the gaudy ostentatiousness of the R.M.C.P., their willingness to speak French and all.

And Australians...well they were sent away to a kind of boarding school for wayward naughties.

[woodbuck27]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

I also have a decent set of manners and am of good character Tarlam! I always have tried my very best to reach you as such and I constantly have failed. I don't have excessive pride and always can admit any error as it applys.

Our history is repleat with your constant barrage of attacks against me Norbert. Far removed from the other way around. Why can't you be at least honest with yourself Norbert. Be a decent man and own up to the facts Vs me? That goes way back in time from your first attack to the one in this thread.

This is not meant as an attack against you Norbert. Merely I question you and your motives Vs me? It's not fair to me or to this forum for you to act as you always get to with me. I merely sometimes respond to your attacks as an honour to myself and to my integrity. In you that isn't ever right man.

Your just frustrating and unfair to yourself as I see it.

How's my clarity in this post Norbert?

I'll give as I've always have given to you. Only that Norbert. I believe that it's this simple between us. A personality difference that leads to unwanted conflict. It's personally embarassing to me to have to always defend my self against your angst. I won't ever go there again.

Judge me as YOU so please, Norbert. Whatever works for you. I'm man enough to withstand you. I always have.

I'm not your enemy rather your friend Norbert. Try to understand that. Try to build from that, as it's TRUTH.

Have a lovely day Packer fan. :D

My name is Ed. wooodbuck27

[woodbuck27]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

Do Australians and Canadians generally feel a bit of sibling rivalry as children of the British Empire?

The Canadians seem to be the prissy favored child what with the gaudy ostentatiousness of the R.M.C.P., their willingness to speak French and all.

And Australians...well they were sent away to a kind of boarding school for wayward naughties.

hahaaha.You Swede can always defuse a poor situation.

By the way Swede. As I know mine and Austrailian history your certainly making a fair point of reference. Hahaaha

Your ... 8-) cool man.

Can we discuss football now Tarlam!? :idea:

GO PACKERS! Go tough on the Bills this Sunday.

Predicted score ... 34-10 ... Packers!!

[Guiness]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

*sigh* wish that there would be another Packer Rats poster's game. I had a chance to go to the last one, but didn't - not knowing it would be the last at the time!

[Fritz]

The latest back and forth is certainly in keeping with the tenor of the Brett Favre thread!

[pbmax]

The latest back and forth is certainly in keeping with the tenor of the Brett Favre thread!
Would you describe that tenor as unhinged debacle or chest thumping pissing match?

[Guiness]

Do Australians and Canadians generally feel a bit of sibling rivalry as children of the British Empire?

The Canadians seem to be the prissy favored child what with the gaudy ostentatiousness of the R.M.C.P., their willingness to speak French and all.

And Australians...well they were sent away to a kind of boarding school for wayward naughties.

*shrug* dunno. Too far away from each other for any rivalry! And I can't think of anything more ostentatious than using the word 'ostentatiousness'! :roll:

[Guiness]

These are my thoughts hoosier. Can't we as members here grow as a community and learn something from every member? Re-build PackerRats to the best fan site offered on the internet?


Thoughtful as always, Woody.

[swede]

When I use a word, it means just what I choose it to mean -- neither more nor less. I meant by "ostentatiousness" that we've had enough of that subject, and it would be just as well if you'd mention what you mean to do next, as I suppose you don't mean to stop here all the rest of your life.

[hoosier]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

Do Australians and Canadians generally feel a bit of sibling rivalry as children of the British Empire?

The Canadians seem to be the prissy favored child what with the gaudy ostentatiousness of the R.M.C.P., their willingness to speak French and all.

And Australians...well they were sent away to a kind of boarding school for wayward naughties.

Boarding school???? Don't you mean "island prison"? :lol:

[ThunderDan]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

Do Australians and Canadians generally feel a bit of sibling rivalry as children of the British Empire?

The Canadians seem to be the prissy favored child what with the gaudy ostentatiousness of the R.M.C.P., their willingness to speak French and all.

And Australians...well they were sent away to a kind of boarding school for wayward naughties.

Boarding school???? Don't you mean "island prison"? :lol:

I wasn't going to be the first to say that! :lol:

[mraynrand]

More jiberish, chest pounding crap. Count the times you wrote the "I" or a declanation thereofe in that post. You need to step down off of that rocking horse. It obviously makes you dizzy.

People who have met me from PR collectively vouch for me. Ever noticed that, Ed? They have stated I am well mannered and a gentleman in REAL LIFE. All we have to go on is YOUR RAMBLINGS about you. You keep insisting how great you are, but I sense a certain ambition to cover up the REAL you.

I have witnesses as to MY character. You have jiberish.

Do Australians and Canadians generally feel a bit of sibling rivalry as children of the British Empire?

The Canadians seem to be the prissy favored child what with the gaudy ostentatiousness of the R.M.C.P., their willingness to speak French and all.

And Australians...well they were sent away to a kind of boarding school for wayward naughties.

Boarding school???? Don't you mean "island prison"? :lol:

Island?

[swede]

When I use a word, it means just what I choose it to mean -- neither more nor less. I meant by "boarding school for wayward naughties" that we've had enough of that subject, and it would be just as well if you'd mention what you mean to do next, as I suppose you don't mean to stop here all the rest of your life.

[Guiness]

When I use a word, it means just what I choose it to mean -- neither more nor less. I meant by "ostentatiousness" that we've had enough of that subject, and it would be just as well if you'd mention what you mean to do next, as I suppose you don't mean to stop here all the rest of your life.

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

[Scott Campbell]

I also have a decent set of manners and am of good character Tarlam! I always have tried my very best to reach you as such and I constantly have failed. I don't have excessive pride and always can admit any error as it applys.


In the US we generally find character references more compelling when they come from people other than ourselves. I've never understood why you choose to post this stuff Woody. It reads like a job application.

That's not an attack or anything - just an observation.

Anywho - on to football!